Bad beat/Moaning/Venting thread - It's the end of the world as we know it

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

If we walk instead of drive we can reduce fatalities to almost zero. Amazing!

Yeah! Although it's probably hard enough to walk at 40kmh.

[Solksjaer!]

For Pedestrians- ironically in Dublin City Centre if you increase your speed by 5km you are less likely to be a fatality . For O'Connell St it should increase further.

[Micknail]

If we walk instead of drive we can reduce fatalities to almost zero. Amazing!

I did hear there's a new 'project 2050' that aims to eliminate road deaths by that date.
Handy job for the next 27 years I suppose.

[Lao Lao]

The Go Fund Me for the American guy who was badly assaulted in Dublin a while back is turning into a right shit show. The family raised about $130K but apparently the son who set it up is not on speaking terms with the father.

Some money was used for travelling to and staying in Dublin which is mentioned as the purpose on the Go Fund Me page but even with Dublin hotel prices, the actual cost can't be anywhere near that. The Dad has asked for the balance of the money and the son is having none of it. He says he will pay any medical expenses directly to the provider but no money is going to go to the father.

Sounds dodgy and the son is trousering a nice few quid.

[Strewelpeter]

Stuffed

Team orders and decency prevail, Kuss will be in red in Madrid

[Theresa]

The Go Fund Me for the American guy who was badly assaulted in Dublin a while back is turning into a right shit show. The family raised about $130K but apparently the son who set it up is not on speaking terms with the father.

Some money was used for travelling to and staying in Dublin which is mentioned as the purpose on the Go Fund Me page but even with Dublin hotel prices, the actual cost can't be anywhere near that. The Dad has asked for the balance of the money and the son is having none of it. He says he will pay any medical expenses directly to the provider but no money is going to go to the father.

Sounds dodgy and the son is trousering a nice few quid.

Sounds like it was initially set up to help the sons travel to Ireland while the oul lad was in a coma to be with him, pay any bills, and get him home. But now the oul lad expects to get the 130k, he was talking about buying a house with it "not a mansion, but something cosy".

I think the travel costs will be used and then everyone else be refunded.

[dinekes]

Ah here Doughal . Gave me a smile.

"These cows are small, those cows are far away"

[6starpool]

I did hear there's a new 'project 2050' that aims to eliminate road deaths by that date.
Handy job for the next 27 years I suppose.

Unless they move to fully automated transport by that time it won't happen, and they won't (spoiler alert).

[oleras]

Adjusting speed limits down will solve very little of the car crash fatalities, i would even take the over on the previous years deaths once implemented.

Enforce what you already have enacted into law, typical knee jerk reaction, going by numbers alone i think we may be the third safest in the EU wrt road deaths, but once you put a few leaving cert students in their prime into the mix it screws the visuals.

Article in the local paper yesterday, about the use of scramblers by scrotes, garda spokesman basically saying there is absolutely nothing that can be done...and here was me under the impression that a mechanically propelled vehicle had to be registered to be used on a public highway along with the person in charge licensed to use said vehicle and insured and taxed.

[eoghan104]

We are playing 8-game cash tomorrow night in the Bonnington. If anyone wants adding to the WhatsApp group PM me your number.

[zuutroy]

We are playing 8-game cash tomorrow night in the Bonnington. If anyone wants adding to the WhatsApp group PM me your number.

Oooh interesting!

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

Adjusting speed limits down will solve very little of the car crash fatalities, i would even take the over on the previous years deaths once implemented.

Enforce what you already have enacted into law, typical knee jerk reaction, going by numbers alone i think we may be the third safest in the EU wrt road deaths, but once you put a few leaving cert students in their prime into the mix it screws the visuals.

Article in the local paper yesterday, about the use of scramblers by scrotes, garda spokesman basically saying there is absolutely nothing that can be done...and here was me under the impression that a mechanically propelled vehicle had to be registered to be used on a public highway along with the person in charge licensed to use said vehicle and insured and taxed.

wtf?

[Hectorjelly]

Unless they move to fully automated transport by that time it won't happen, and they won't (spoiler alert).

27 years is a long time, I'd take that bet. I'd also bet by 2040 human driving will be outlawed in at least one major city.

It took about 50 years to go from Horses to Cars, but that required a huge change in human behaviour and a gigantic amount of new infrastructure. Compared to that the change from human to ai driving will be a doddle. (Going to EVs will be harder). You can already get almost any car to be retrofitted with autonomous capabilities.

[oleras]

wtf?

You cant be making decisions because you are emotional.

[MysteryGuest]

wtf?

is he not just making exact same point as you use to make re large payouts for misdiagnoses of certain medical tests?

[RichieM]

Well, this is certainly entertaining.

Much more fun than watching England or France kick incessantly.

Should have been red.

the magic of the RWC with under dog Uruguay getting over twice against a team that are legit contenders for the tournament.

[RichieM]

Not sure I like that call either.

[Strewelpeter]

Met the Gardai assigned here for the RWC last night, softest job ever. Basically their sole responsibility is taking selfies with fans while the French gendarmes look on jealously all the time nervously fingering their heavy weaponry.

Decent bit of BBV'ing there

A rape reported to them rather than French police and an outbreak of botulism leaving one dead so far

[Strewelpeter]

Very strange for Farrell to pick such a strong team for Saturday

[Lao Lao]

Those plucky lads from Uruguay must have been watching old reruns of Llyod's Munster to learn how to grow the big heart. They shouldn't allow the big heart in the World Cup, should only be a small group of top, elite, clinical teams .

[Theresa]

Should have been red.

the magic of the RWC with under dog Uruguay getting over twice against a team that are legit contenders for the tournament.

Lol would ya shhtop. That sentence actually strengthens the argument people have been making. Implying you never ever gave them a chance at even scoring! Never mind twice. And they still got roundly beaten.

Uruguay, Chile, Portugal, Romania, havent a hope of beating one of the big teams. Probably haven't a hope of beating anyone tbh.

[Theresa]

Those plucky lads from Uruguay must have been watching old reruns of Llyod's Munster to learn how to grow the big heart. They shouldn't allow the big heart in the World Cup, should only be a small group of top, elite, clinical teams .

Lol I was waiting for someone to use the word "plucky" fuck me if my eyes rolled any harder Id have fallen over.

[Solksjaer!]

Lol I was waiting for someone to use the word "plucky" fuck me if my eyes rolled any harder Id have fallen over.

Not like you to spectacularly not get it. I iz disappoint.

[MysteryGuest]

Did uruguay win? No . Lost to a second string French team off the back off a huge game against NZ
heartstrings very much untugged

[Theresa]

Not like you to spectacularly not get it. I iz disappoint.

lol ya alright Willy? That one been bugging ya a bit obviously.

[Solksjaer!]

lol ya alright Willy? That one been bugging ya a bit obviously.

It's Willie (see ya dont read the posts )

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

is he not just making exact same point as you use to make re large payouts for misdiagnoses of certain medical tests?

My apologies for having a visceral reaction to describing young kids dying as 'screwing the visuals'.

I don't get the analogy. One is a determination of a way to get one third less fatalities in cities by matching car speeds with modern city needs, the other is about false negatives on tests? There doesn't seem to be any relationship, even indirect.

[Lao Lao]

Decent bit of BBV'ing there

A rape reported to them rather than French police and an outbreak of botulism leaving one dead so far

May have been the way it was reported but when I first heard about the rape case, it was reported as the Gardai were in France but they were saying 'Nothing to do with us, this is on the French' which is obviously correct as the Gardai have no jurisdiction in France but normally they would say something like Gardai are assisting or something like that. Just seemed a very odd way of reporting it.

[Solksjaer!]

Did uruguay win? No . Lost to a second string French team off the back off a huge game against NZ
heartstrings very much untugged

But but but...

Louis Suarez , Edison Cavani, your team got a good beating tonight . DiegoForlan you hide your face my friend.

[Solksjaer!]

Open top bus from Montevideo Airport ala Jackies Army.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

Plucky outsiders indeed. When tomorrow in the schoolyard some kid is shouted at ur a gay, it'll be intended as a compliment.

[Lao Lao]

Lol I was waiting for someone to use the word "plucky" fuck me if my eyes rolled any harder Id have fallen over.

If you didn't kop that I was trolling both sides of the argument at the same time, you're getting slow in your old age.

[MysteryGuest]

My apologies for having a visceral reaction to describing young kids dying as 'screwing the visuals'.

I don't get the analogy. One is a determination of a way to get one third less fatalities in cities by matching car speeds with modern city needs, the other is about false negatives on tests? There doesn't seem to be any relationship, even indirect.

You had a crusade re not letting emotional media stories influence the overall good done by the testing- which I agree with
ole making the point that current Ireland road safety quite good on European rankings and that we should enforce current rules instead of knee jerking to some unfortunate and tragic outliers and you went in on him?

[Theresa]

You had a crusade re not letting emotional media stories influence the overall good done by the testing- which I agree with
ole making the point that current Ireland road safety quite good on European rankings and that we should enforce current rules instead of knee jerking to some unfortunate and tragic outliers and you went in on him?

People are ignoring Zuuts investigation into the lying about the data. Surely thats a bigger story?

[Solksjaer!]

If you didn't kop that I was trolling both sides of the argument at the same time, you're getting slow in your old age.

Hence my post on his spectacularly not getting it . Went up the wrong Alley Theresa

[Theresa]

If you didn't kop that I was trolling both sides of the argument at the same time, you're getting slow in your old age.

Don't think I was too fast even in my youth. Was always a plucky underdog.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

That UK figure is something else. They're paying 10% of government income on interest payments. Presumably a big whack more in 2023. In terms of cost its more than Italy, which is some achievement. Ireland should fall to maybe 73% debt to GNI (the Irish alternative to GDP) this year and could well be down in the 50s by 2025 despite a *massive* ramp up in investment.

One other kinda interesting stat in the NTMA report - that the top three companies are paying €8 billion a year in corporation tax. Kinda puts some of the bigger capital investment projects in context.




re7I64sl.jpg


This chart is also interesting. Its the debt structure of households in the run up to the financial crisis vs now. See how there's almost a negligible amount of debt in the economy. We've essentially spent 15 years paying down everything to nil. Indeed we could probably afford to take a few more risks as households.


K7mX5XJl.jpg

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

You had a crusade re not letting emotional media stories influence the overall good done by the testing- which I agree with
ole making the point that current Ireland road safety quite good on European rankings and that we should enforce current rules instead of knee jerking to some unfortunate and tragic outliers and you went in on him?

I'm hoping i didn't describe people dying of cervical cancer as 'messing with the visuals'.

This recommendation is as a result of a two year investigation by a panel of experts, its not 'knee jerk'. Its also in line with other European countries which have similar rules around e.g. 30kmh in towns and cities.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

People are ignoring Zuuts investigation into the lying about the data. Surely thats a bigger story?

We'll have to see the underlying paper he was referring to, to understand the context. But a report clearly doesn't rise or fall based on a single reference. There's no inherent reason for the current 50kmh limit to remain the current limit. Its very reasonable that as more and more vulnerable road users are being killed (now 43% of all deaths), that we look at if something needs to be done. Speed limits are an obvious one, as by and large people tend to obey them within reason, they will also cut down on the 1500 serious injuries per year as lower speeds means significantly lower serious injuries. There's also a separate enforcement issue to also be dealt with and presumably tech will catch up on that end as its not possible to physically police to any great extent.

[ComradeCollie]

Yeah! Although it's probably hard enough to walk at 40kmh.

Far too few people die in RTAs considering the way we drive.

500 die from suicide each year, and that's just too unpleasant to talk about . https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpub...tatistics2019/

[Lazare]

Every now and then the thread gets a little spicy.

T'is fun.

GFY Hitch, GFY Theresa, GFY Ole

Fuck you too Willy

And you HJ, un putero GFY

[MysteryGuest]

I'm hoping i didn't describe people dying of cervical cancer as 'messing with the visuals'.

This recommendation is as a result of a two year investigation by a panel of experts, it’s not 'knee jerk'. also in line with other European countries which have similar rules around e.g. 30kmh in towns and cities.

Didn’t realise it was a longer term thing
fair enough
All for Tech that could increase enforcement- about time they did something useful
though price of oil/power will take care of road deaths for us in the not too distant future

[Lazare]

lol, the poor bastard...

[Solksjaer!]

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lol, the poor bastard...

[Solksjaer!]

Every now and then the thread gets a little spicy.

T'is fun.

GFY Hitch, GFY Theresa, GFY Ole

Fuck you too Willy

And you HJ, un putero GFY

Tbh . I quite enjoyed the toing and froing. Lots of shit going on with sick folk . It's a good distraction.

Nice subtlety on the 'Willy' i worn out correcting this .

[Hectorjelly]

Every now and then the thread gets a little spicy.

T'is fun.

GFY Hitch, GFY Theresa, GFY Ole

Fuck you too Willy

And you HJ, un putero GFY

vete a la mierda, maldito coño

[Raoul Duke III]

Those plucky lads from Uruguay must have been watching old reruns of Llyod's Munster to learn how to grow the big heart. They shouldn't allow the big heart in the World Cup, should only be a small group of top, elite, clinical teams .

We watched the game with a good chunk of Arcachon rugby club. They were genuinely scared for most of it, was a lot of fun winding them up with exaggerated cheering for Uruguay.

Actually could have won it with a bit more composure imo.

Train to Nantes today. Drinking levels will return to professional.

[6starpool]

27 years is a long time, I'd take that bet. I'd also bet by 2040 human driving will be outlawed in at least one major city.

It took about 50 years to go from Horses to Cars, but that required a huge change in human behaviour and a gigantic amount of new infrastructure. Compared to that the change from human to ai driving will be a doddle. (Going to EVs will be harder). You can already get almost any car to be retrofitted with autonomous capabilities.

I'm obviously not going to make an actual bet on something where I'm barely favourite to be alive at the end of the bet period, but I would be very surprised if Ireland specifically is all driverless vehicles in 2050. It would overall be much safer for all, but I can't see it. How to cater for reversing down a narrow country lane until you come to a gateway or nice piece of verge to pull in at to let a car pass would be a fun situation to consider. Highway and city driving, fine I can see that being achievable, but while there are still humans driving, there will still be more crashes and deaths.

It's good to aspire and aim high, and you can't really set an acceptable number of road traffic deaths, but a target of zero is patently unachievable, barring humans being wiped out before that.

[zuutroy]

We'll have to see the underlying paper he was referring to, to understand the context. But a report clearly doesn't rise or fall based on a single reference. There's no inherent reason for the current 50kmh limit to remain the current limit. Its very reasonable that as more and more vulnerable road users are being killed (now 43% of all deaths), that we look at if something needs to be done. Speed limits are an obvious one, as by and large people tend to obey them within reason, they will also cut down on the 1500 serious injuries per year as lower speeds means significantly lower serious injuries. There's also a separate enforcement issue to also be dealt with and presumably tech will catch up on that end as its not possible to physically police to any great extent.

Excuse the lack of axis labelling! x is speed, y is fatality rate of pedestrians struck at that speed. Orange is from figure 3.1 of the govt report, blue is from this meta-analysis paper which is cited in the report six lines after figure 3.1! The paper also says that shaping policy based on these S-curves is not a good thing. The orange data in the report is completely unattributed, so I did a bit of digging, and found that it comes from a 2005 modelling paper....It isn't even real data! This adds up when you see in figure 3.1 that the S is the exact same shape for car-pedestrian and car-car collisions, just shifted along the x-axis.

I have no opinion on the policy either way, but if I was reviewing this report is would be a Reject! Very shaky research integrity going on.

WhatsApp Image 2023-09-14 at 13.08.10.jpeg

[6starpool]

Excuse the lack of axis labelling! x is speed, y is fatality rate of pedestrians struck at that speed. Orange is from figure 3.1 of the govt report, blue is from this meta-analysis paper which is cited in the report six lines after figure 3.1! The paper also says that shaping policy based on these S-curves is not a good thing. The orange data in the report is completely unattributed, so I did a bit of digging, and found that it comes from a 2005 modelling paper....It isn't even real data! This adds up when you see in figure 3.1 that the S is the exact same shape for car-pedestrian and car-car collisions, just shifted along the x-axis.

I have no opinion on the policy either way, but if I was reviewing this report is would be a Reject! Very shaky research integrity going on.

WhatsApp Image 2023-09-14 at 13.08.10.jpeg

Sounds like someone shaping the data to fit the outcome they want to see implemented.

[dinekes]

Really begins the last 30 seconds or so...

Actually thought this might be fake in some way but seems legit Hard to get the head around how people can actually be this catastrophically stupid..racing towards momma bear with cubs......carrying a fucking child
Little fat fuckers couldn't get there quickly enough to get eaten

*They are also allowed to drive (shudder)

[MysteryGuest]

I feel seen
Reverse snobbery about rugby is every bit as nauseating as plain old snobbery

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/2023/09/15/reverse-snobbery-about-rugby-is-every-bit-as-nauseating-as-plain-old-snobbery/

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

Excuse the lack of axis labelling! x is speed, y is fatality rate of pedestrians struck at that speed. Orange is from figure 3.1 of the govt report, blue is from this meta-analysis paper which is cited in the report six lines after figure 3.1! The paper also says that shaping policy based on these S-curves is not a good thing. The orange data in the report is completely unattributed, so I did a bit of digging, and found that it comes from a 2005 modelling paper....It isn't even real data! This adds up when you see in figure 3.1 that the S is the exact same shape for car-pedestrian and car-car collisions, just shifted along the x-axis.

I have no opinion on the policy either way, but if I was reviewing this report is would be a Reject! Very shaky research integrity going on.

WhatsApp Image 2023-09-14 at 13.08.10.jpeg

Figure 3.1 is based on Wramborg (2005)? Which is indeed research that is viewed as potentially dated. But it has been also referenced in recent Australian and UK parliamentary speed-related reports. I guess its reasonable enough that these types of national reports would have been consulted by the panel members as being directly relevant. Although, yeah, it should have been attributed.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

I do like this though.

From an Irish perspective, the RSA recently commissioned a report that focused specifically on pedestrian fatality risk and vehicle speed, completed by Dr Kiran Sarma (University of Galway). A meta
-analysis completed by Hussain et al. (2019) was referenced in this report. This aligns with the work of the other studies.

'aligns with' being the classic research term we are both familiar with for saying 'in a generous interpretation this doesn't completely bomb what we've previously said, but please don't examine it too closely'

[zuutroy]

Whatever about it being dated, it's a modelling study that isn't supported by any subsequent papers that have actual data in them. Having the one 'this is the data we're acting on' figure in a government report being from an unreferenced theoretical study, while referencing an excellent study based on actual data and not showing it is comically bad.

A personal favourite I like to use when writing the 'discussion' part of papers is "These findings are not inconsistent with.....". About as safe as scientific analysis can get!

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

Whatever about it being dated, it's a modelling study that isn't supported by any subsequent papers that have actual data in them. Having the one 'this is the data we're acting on' figure in a government report being from an unreferenced theoretical study, while referencing an excellent study based on actual data and not showing it is comically bad.

A personal favourite I like to use when writing the 'discussion' part of papers is "These findings are not inconsistent with.....". About as safe as scientific analysis can get!

Yeah, that's a really nicely put together study. Weirdly I couldn't access it through work login and had to use scihub. wtf is with that - have the coffers run dry?

[zuutroy]

Worked OK for me through institutional access.

[Wombatman]

Shocking. Watch till end.

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGJWUAEpc/

[Micknail]

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGJWUAEpc/

I'm about as likely to open a Tiktok link as one of Solks facebook links!

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

I'm about as likely to open a Tiktok link as one of Solks facebook links!

no bother, it'll be on the six-one news in a week