Bad beat/Moaning/Venting thread - BabyforV

[darwinatemyhamster]

Ah Ireland

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/clinically-dead-pregnant-woman-being-kept-alive-by-hospital-30845660.html

We've just a despicable attitude to women

Not much information in the link but does the baby have a chance to be born healthy?
If so I don't understand why the family would be so against it.
If not then I can fully understand.

[ComradeCollie]

Are they lying?

Her family probably consists of more than just her parents. Even if she has no siblings, surely whoever impregnated her would have some interest in the outcome.

[Jibzzzz]

Just been to see Elf in the boird gais. Was class tbf. Would reccomend kids or no kids. Trish's arse worth it alone!

[Jibzzzz]

.

[Raoul Duke III]

Career highpoint of 2014: managing to make the word 'geebag' part of everyday management discourse.

Lowlights: everything else

[6starpool]

And specifically if it was your fiance?

Until you're in the situation it's impossible to say for sure, but as I said above I'd like to think I'd be for the option that would preserve the life of MY unborn child to at least salvage something good from a horrible situation. It's not hard to see how that could be someone's preference is it?

[darwinatemyhamster]

If I order the Chris Hadfield book right now on Amazon(standard delivery), how would you rate my chances of getting it before Christmas day?

[Jam-Fly]

If the life support machine is turned off the mother and baby die 100%.

If the life support machine stays on, a healthy baby may be born but the mother will die once it's turned off.

Is that it, or am I missing something?

If so, it's not even close imo. If it was the first trimester I think there's arguments to let both die. Given it's into the second trimester, you have to give the unborn baby every chance of surviving.

[ComradeCollie]

If I order the Chris Hadfield book right now on Amazon(standard delivery), how would you rate my chances of getting it before Christmas day?

91.75%

EDIT: Though 0% if it's the one released on Jan 15th 2015.

[Raoul Duke III]

If the life support machine is turned off the mother and baby die 100%.

If the life support machine stays on, a healthy baby may be born but the mother will die once it's turned off.

Is that it, or am I missing something?

If so, it's not even close imo. If it was the first trimester I think there's arguments to let both die. Given it's into the second trimester, you have to give the unborn baby every chance of surviving.

The mother is already dead. I have no idea what the 'right'answer is but this is surely a one in a billion scenarios that nutjob fanatics like to seize upon.

[Jam-Fly]

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news...-30845018.html

This sort of stuff seems to be popping up more and more. Should bookmakers be compelled to do some sort of background checks on high rollers to see if there gambling within their means? I'm not sure really if they should and if they could particularly where its cash and not online betting but its an interesting question.

Vickery said he made a profit of about €5,000 by the time his involvement came to an end in April 2010. He said at that stage there was no shortfall and the bank had been fully paid back.

ah sure all's well that ends well. He should sell shares at a mark-up next time.

[Jam-Fly]

The mother is already dead. I have no idea what the 'right'answer is but this is surely a one in a billion scenarios that nutjob fanatics like to seize upon.

I assume you're speaking with regard to abortion laws etc?

[SatNav]

http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/health-news/pregnant-woman-who-clinically-brain-4831032

only 16 weeks pregnant , personally I think this is going to be far too long on her family to keep this going. What are the chances of the baby being kept alive, born healthy? If the story read 8 , 9 months pregnant ~i would have a different view and maybe thats selfish. I dunno.

However if there is a good chance of baby surviving , is this not a nice legacy for all involved. very very sticky situation

[Denny Crane]

Sinn Fein / IRA they haven't gone away you know

http://www.herald.ie/news/water-worker-escapes-injury-in-pipebomb-attack-30844428.html

Such heros, firing pipe bombs at ordinary workers trying to scrape a living

The incident happened at 4pm at Ballsgrove in Drogheda during an anti-water charge protest.

I was wondering what was gonna happen when they made it to places like that.

[Jam-Fly]

alot in the news today it seems:

Dangerous prisoner on the run after breaking out of prison van at chipper

[darwinatemyhamster]

http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish...-brain-4831032

only 16 weeks pregnant , personally I think this is going to be far too long on her family to keep this going. What are the chances of the baby being kept alive, born healthy? If the story read 8 , 9 months pregnant ~i would have a different view and maybe thats selfish. I dunno.

However if there is a good chance of baby surviving , is this not a nice legacy for all involved. very very sticky situation

I staunchly disagree with your use of the term 'only' 16 weeks pregnant. This hasn't much to do with abortion imo.
In relation to the question that was asked of 5starpool if my wife was in the same situation God help anyone trying to pull the plug if my unborn child had a chance.

[Jam-Fly]

I staunchly disagree with your use of the term 'only' 16 weeks pregnant. This hasn't much to do with abortion imo.
In relation to the question that was asked of 5starpool if my wife was in the same situation God help anyone trying to pull the plug if my unborn child had a chance.

ah I dunno, there's a big difference between aborting a baby at 5 weeks and one at 20 weeks imo. This is fairly graphic but shows what babies look like at different stages of abortion: http://clinicquotes.com/abortion-pic...ferent-stages/

[darwinatemyhamster]

ah I dunno, there's a big difference between aborting a baby at 5 weeks and one at 20 weeks imo. This is fairly graphic but shows what babies look like at different stages of abortion: http://clinicquotes.com/abortion-pic...ferent-stages/

I said that this doesn't have much to do win abortion, and you''re pretty much agreeing with me., I genuinely don't understand what point you''re making here.

[Guest]

I think given the initial shock associated with the situation, it's very difficult for a family to see the larger picture, they'll only see the immediate horror of seeing their dead relative as some sort of incubator and not treated as a human.
However that being said, I think it's a decision that is for the greater good. Clearly they feel the chance of a full term is high, otherwise they wouldn't pursue it, especially given the potential public backlash.
Again for any of us to say what is right or wrong is just impossible to say.

[Lord Sir Banter]

Nightcrew (y)

[hotspur]

Having slept from about 9pm to 11pm I am awake and fresh as a daisy.

Rigger, you need to redouble your efforts re: pre Christmas Saturday soiree imo.

[Lord Sir Banter]

Having slept from about 9pm to 11pm I am awake and fresh as a daisy.

Rigger, you need to redouble your efforts re: pre Christmas Saturday soiree imo.

I've been a bit distracted and also on the fence as to whether to go full AJ on promo or as mellow as the response thus far.

Must hire AJ in on the job.

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[Jam-Fly]

Ugh, I've just spent the last half hour (well ten minutes) washing off vomit from my jacket. I'm ready to roll though

post made at 4:20, coincidence I think not.

Also just had a nap from 02:30 to 04:30 and ready to attack the world

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[Jam-Fly]

I said that this doesn't have much to do win abortion, and you''re pretty much agreeing with me., I genuinely don't understand what point you''re making here.

I'm saying there is undeniably a relationship between this case and abortion in general. As RDIII said, this is one of the one in a billion situations, but there is an obvious link. I think it's okay to abort a baby after 5 weeks, but not after 30 weeks for example. Similarly in this case, I think if the mother was only 5 weeks along, a case can be made for pulling the plug (it's still not a clear cut decision though). Given she's into the second trimester, I think it's fairly clear cut the decision that has to be made. It's not the exact same as a general argument about abortion, but there are some similarities for sure imo.

[Lord Sir Banter]

Saturday
ipbeers
booze
crimbo innit
bk

[Jam-Fly]

We're both on a roll! I can't help you with econometrics exam though, it looks rather tough

it's all in the past Hitch, Economics of Natural Resources is where it's at now. That's on Friday but just seems to be a case of learning of 4 essays so should be grand. After Friday then it's back to the more important things in life.

[Lord Sir Banter]

I'm saying there is undeniably a relationship between this case and abortion in general. As RDIII said, this is one of the one in a billion situations, but there is an obvious link. I think it's okay to abort a baby after 5 weeks, but not after 30 weeks for example. Similarly in this case, I think if the mother was only 5 weeks along, a case can be made for pulling the plug (it's still not a clear cut decision though). Given she's into the second trimester, I think it's fairly clear cut the decision that has to be made. It's not the exact same as a general argument about abortion, but there are some similarities for sure imo.

Fetus?

[Jam-Fly]

Fetus?

yiz get the jist of wot I was trying to say m8

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[Lord Sir Banter]

I just can't see how your getting a house out of the paperclip

Not too fixated on house m8.
Supercar, night with Kelly Brook, solid gold house, small.island, I'm flexible.

You pinting on Sat?
What odds are there of switching to DCU, similar type course. Got a close tp no from DIT Angier St, give their places to students on some lower than degree course with feeder options into their busi degrees.

[Lord Sir Banter]

Have read the Kyle book btw

Any use? His website is .. interesting.

[Jam-Fly]

I think the situation is maybe: does any other country in the world keep dead women alive to be baby incubators?

Like one single country.

Even the Texas case was turned off.

I think a lot of these things have to be looked at on a case-by-case basis, and although my opinion may not reflect my overall view on abortion etc, I honestly think the baby has to be given every chance in this specific case. I understand the 'mothers and unborn have equal status' may not exactly be the best law to use to govern ourselves, but again, in this specific case I think the mother has to be kept alive for the sake of the fetus.

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[Jam-Fly]

But no other country does this thing of keeping dead women alive to produce kids. Literally no other country in the world.

if every other country jumped off a bridge, would you want Ireland to jump off a bridge?

[Lord Sir Banter]

Thought it was great. Even after reading his website first. Don't get me wrong I agree with your aim.

I may not get you on the stapler, even with it's ownership history that makes it a collectors item, but one of my traded items could be something you have to have.

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[Jam-Fly]

But no other country does this thing of keeping dead women alive to produce kids. Literally no other country in the world.

yeah I understand what you're saying, but based on the information I have on this specific case, I actually think keeping the mother alive (even against the parents' wishes) for the sake of the unborn baby is acceptable behaviour.

There are other factors in this case that haven't been mentioned in the article - namely, is there a father in the picture anywhere? Did the mother have any wishes before she died?

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[Jam-Fly]

Its probably a good indictor that we're doing something wrong.

I was being facetious fwiw. Still, technically speaking, it's irrelevant what any other country would do. But admittedly, if literally no other country would make this decision, it does have me questioning my own thoughts on the situation.

Another question, if the mother's parents wanted her to be kept alive for the baby's sake, should she be kept alive? Like is the debate completely about the parents' wishes or is it whether a woman should be kept alive in these circumstance full stop.

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[Jam-Fly]

But surely if we're the only country in world who keeps dead women alive to produce their kids, then other countries have thought through this logic better than us? I really don't think any other country in the world does this.

I understand that, and one element to it is "the experts and policy makers and morality/ethics people and doctors etc in other countries probably know more than me on this matter", and that's true. The other element is that this is a very specific case, and can you say with 100% certainty that that is the decision other countries would make?

Lets assume you can say that, why are all the other countries right and me/Ireland wrong? If you want to argue that they know more than me/Ireland, you're probably right, and that's fine, but I'd honestly need to hear a fairly convincing argument for me to change my opinion.

So basically, instead of saying, 'Ireland is wrong, no other country behaves like this', I want to see why Ireland is wrong, because as far as I can tell, they haven't done all that much wrong.

[Jam-Fly]

sorry to keep you hanging, god damn internet connection went.

Nothing was loading on Chrome/Firefox but managed to get PokerStars running fine. There's other issues with the internet connection, but when the connection was working and the web browsers still wouldn't load, could that be a problem with access to firewalls or something? Any easy ways to solve it in case it's a simple problem?

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[Raoul Duke III]

I understand that, and one element to it is "the experts and policy makers and morality/ethics people and doctors etc in other countries probably know more than me on this matter", and that's true. The other element is that this is a very specific case, and can you say with 100% certainty that that is the decision other countries would make?

Lets assume you can say that, why are all the other countries right and me/Ireland wrong? If you want to argue that they know more than me/Ireland, you're probably right, and that's fine, but I'd honestly need to hear a fairly convincing argument for me to change my opinion.

So basically, instead of saying, 'Ireland is wrong, no other country behaves like this', I want to see why Ireland is wrong, because as far as I can tell, they haven't done all that much wrong.

We are wrong because we opted for a total fudge in relation to abortion legislation which is directly the cause of horrific situations like this, Savita Haleppanavar, Miss X etc etc.

We voted for this, we are wrong and it's our fault. A stain on our escutcheon, to resuscitate a phrase I am quite fond of.

The one bright light on the horizon was Leo having the balls to call it.

[Kayroo]

The one bright light on the horizon was Leo having the balls to call it.

Peter Sutherland called it 30 years ago to be fair.

[Jam-Fly]

I see Newcastle's third choice keeper got injured in the League Cup last night. If they're not allowed sign an emergency keeper, they could have a 17 year old in goal versus Sunderland on Sunday.

[pokerhand]

I see Newcastle's third choice keeper got injured in the League Cup last night. If they're not allowed sign an emergency keeper, they could have a 17 year old in goal versus Sunderland on Sunday.

Think they are allowed to get a special loan if they want? Seem to remember city availing of this a few years ago...

[pokerhand]

Have to post this as its hanging open in another tab: the history of 'a grain of salt' as a term

A lecturer using wiki as a source!! That's a paddlin'

[Emmet]

Most intellectual night crew ramblings of all time perhaps?

[Iago]

Think they are allowed to get a special loan if they want? Seem to remember city availing of this a few years ago...

The issue is that you can only have 1 fit keeper on the books before they will allow you an emergency loan.

Newcastle bought another keeper from Notts Forest and loaned him back to Forest for the season as part of the deal with no option to recall him.

As far as the FA are concerned they therefore have 2 fit keepers. The 17 year old, and the one who will be playing for Forest at the weekend

[Emmet]

I think given the initial shock associated with the situation, it's very difficult for a family to see the larger picture, they'll only see the immediate horror of seeing their dead relative as some sort of incubator and not treated as a human.
However that being said, I think it's a decision that is for the greater good. Clearly they feel the chance of a full term is high, otherwise they wouldn't pursue it, especially given the potential public backlash.
Again for any of us to say what is right or wrong is just impossible to say.

We can't infer this. Legally, anyone who switches off the machine could be pursued (max prison sentence of 14 years).

This is just as (if not more likely) to be the deciding factor as the above. Consider that we don't terminate pregnancies with FFA. If we don't do that (the fetus will not survive) then how could we infer that a belief that the fetus will survive to term was even considered?

[pokerhand]

The issue is that you can only have 1 fit keeper on the books before they will allow you an emergency loan.

Newcastle bought another keeper from Notts Forest and loaned him back to Forest for the season as part of the deal with no option to recall him.

As far as the FA are concerned they therefore have 2 fit keepers. The 17 year old, and the one who will be playing for Forest at the weekend

Probably wrong about this but wasn't city in the same boat though at the time? Memory is hazy but seem to recall Hart was out on loan to Birmingham at the time they had the injury problem.