Bad beat/Moan/Venting Thread - BBV Archive 1

[dannydiamond]

Nice one Dom, sounds like a pretty sweet spot.

A good few years ago my uncle was driving a bread van for a large bakery, the company was sold and he was made redundant, recieving a massive pay off.
Two weeks later he was back doing the same job with the same route for the new owners earning 20% more!

[Bubbleking]

quick one here for the BBV - Just got a call from home there saying that the family health insurance policy was too expensive so im out anyway just wondering is it worth me getting health insurance and roughly how much would it cost? - Im 23 non smoker fairly fit if that helps eh occasional drinker

Basically is t worth getting it at all?

[Guest]

quick one here for the BBV - Just got a call from home there saying that the family health insurance policy was too expensive so im out anyway just wondering is it worth me getting health insurance and roughly how much would it cost? - Im 23 non smoker fairly fit if that helps eh occasional drinker

Basically is t worth getting it at all?

VHI plan B is about 70 euro a month

im only keeping it going till I get 3 solid months into me in a gym and then its getting dropped (in case I do something stupid to myself in my unfit state)

*im leaving country before xmas so ...?

[AndyFatBastard]

What an awesome photo! It hasn't been photoshopped, no? On Friday night in Berlin (after the obscenely hot and humid weather) there was a mighty lightning storm, you just have to sit back and appreciate the forces of nature being unleashed, really amazing.

Pictures like this are done on a very long exposure. So all that lightning probably happened over several seconds rather than it all being caught in one perfect moment. The hard part is getting the bloke to stand really, really still. I suspect that bit might be altered, although the whole photo has probably had the standard photshop filters applied across it to make the colours more vibrant etc etc.

[V for Vendetta]

Hold on just a cotton picking minute.

Accusing me of being a blind patriot head in the sand merchant is a little hurtful:

...

I don't know, I'm just shooting the messenger I guess. I love living in Ireland (seriously), and I just don't want things to go tits up to the extent that I would be prevented from doing so.

I didn't intend accusing you of this. I do think you were a bit guilty of shooting the messenger and then I made a wider point about the quality of "debate" in general, anyway you're a big boy so I'm sure you can handle a little ego hurt.

[6starpool]

lol, private sector efficiency

if you don't have any firm plans\goals for your next step, why not take it and use the time to look around for something better?

seems like a no-brainer imo

There are 5 or 6 others I work with in the same situation, so there is a good chance a few of us would be doing it.As you say it can definitely be used to bide some time at least, but the nonsense of it is just ridiculous.

Nice one Dom, sounds like a pretty sweet spot.

A good few years ago my uncle was driving a bread van for a large bakery, the company was sold and he was made redundant, recieving a massive pay off.
Two weeks later he was back doing the same job with the same route for the new owners earning 20% more!

The only downside is that I wouldn't be in the same office as I am now, so would have to learn a new route to work, but other than that, prety similar.

[Theresa]

quick one here for the BBV - Just got a call from home there saying that the family health insurance policy was too expensive so im out anyway just wondering is it worth me getting health insurance and roughly how much would it cost? - Im 23 non smoker fairly fit if that helps eh occasional drinker

Basically is t worth getting it at all?

I remember having a convo with TG about this. He was saying he thinks its massively -EV for anyone our age who is in any way fit and overall quite healthy to have it. Anyone normal really.

[hopalong85]

Anyone having ipoker problems today? My hu tables just randomly freezing and closing down. Connection is fine on my side, although I highly doubt they will accpet that!

[Bubbleking]

lols this is fun working out +EV situations where my health is concerned. I dont think really need it tbh like what would I use it for?

[Raoul Duke III]

McWilliams should read bloomberg imo

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-0...ary-union.html

just read that myself, written by a Mr Dara Doyle (hmmm, wonder where he's from )

a few things jump out at me:

1. Garret Fitzgerald shouldn't be allowed near a microphone, he's embarrassing
2. The reporter claims that our deficit this year will be 11.7%. Eh, no it won't - it'll be 20%, highest in the world. Rank bad journalism.
3. The reporter claims that our CDS spreads have fallen over the last 18 months. Not true (if it was bond yields would have followed).
4. LOL-tastic comment about the country attracting high-end manufacturers such as Dell . No mention of what happened there or why!
5. He mentions the 7bn lobbed into BoI\AIb, no mention of the 35bn+ incincerated in Anglo\INBS.
6. Ionapaul nailed the point about public protest. Just because we're not rioting in the streets doesn't mean people support the government (just look at the polls)

Mr Doyle shouldn't be allowed to write for the Skibbereen Eagle.

[V for Vendetta]

quick one here for the BBV - Just got a call from home there saying that the family health insurance policy was too expensive so im out anyway just wondering is it worth me getting health insurance and roughly how much would it cost? - Im 23 non smoker fairly fit if that helps eh occasional drinker

Basically is t worth getting it at all?

Actuarially you aren't getting value. However until someone offers a health product for young people which covers catastrophe risk over a certain financial amount and cuts out all the bs like maternity benefits, sprained ankle physiotherapy and stops the cross subsidisation of inefficient market players then you've got little choice unless you are comfortable running the risk of major unexpected health problems.

Ask Brayruit to get on the case asap!!

[V for Vendetta]

Just got a job offer at roughly the same salary and package that I am on now to do pretty much exactly the same job I do now, just in an outsourced capacity rather than working directly. Considering the outsourcing company needs to be paid as well, it is presumably reasonable to assume that I am getting a good redundancy package, and then essentially costing twice as much for my current employers to retain. Madness. Now all I have to do is decide if I want to accept or not. It is the easy option though.

Seething with jealousy!! Nice one Dom!!

[oleras]

I want one and i want it NOW !!

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcieCn9fvTM[/ame]

[oleras]

There are 5 or 6 others I work with in the same situation, so there is a good chance a few of us would be doing it.As you say it can definitely be used to bide some time at least, but the nonsense of it is just ridiculous.


The only downside is that I wouldn't be in the same office as I am now, so would have to learn a new route to work, but other than that, prety similar.

Are you visually impaired ?

[BabyHawk]

Desperate times indeed.

[V for Vendetta]

I remember having a convo with TG about this. He was saying he thinks its massively -EV for anyone our age who is in any way fit and overall quite healthy to have it. Anyone normal really.

Yeah but take the example of my pretty fit cousin (aged 30) who gets rid of her VHI and then a month later has a suspected heart attack and can't have a consultant carry out the proper tests to confirm what happened to her for three weeks as she has to wait on the public list.

What price for the peace of mind?

Would you want to rely on our public service as the budget runs out towards the year end?

[Bubbleking]

Would you want to rely on our public service as the budget runs out towards the year end?

you just proved that getting HI is massively -EV and now your asking poker players if they want to take that risk

[Theresa]

Yeah but take the example of my pretty fit cousin (aged 30) who gets rid of her VHI and then a month later has a suspected heart attack and can't have a consultant carry out the proper tests to confirm what happened to her for three weeks as she has to wait on the public list.

What price for the peace of mind?

Would you want to rely on our public service as the budget runs out towards the year end?

Personally, I have health insurance, I was just letting BK know what an actuary who worked in VHI for a bit thought about it.

Your right though, but its the same for all insurance, your paying what is probably -EV for that peace of mind.

[Guest]

quick one here for the BBV - Just got a call from home there saying that the family health insurance policy was too expensive so im out anyway just wondering is it worth me getting health insurance and roughly how much would it cost? - Im 23 non smoker fairly fit if that helps eh occasional drinker

Basically is t worth getting it at all?

Bubbleking your going to be playing football so a chance of an auld injury.
I was lax about private insurance but broke my leg and dislocated my ankle in february
my first night in hospital was spent in some sort of a stock room had people coming in geting stuff the whole night.

Now i was heavily drugged but a bit of comfort would have been nice.
6 o clock the next day i got placed in a room with 2 old guys who were puking for 3 days straight and some poor kid who had constant diarrohea the smell as he used a comode was horrific.

No tv and the food was poor but thats what you get if your a public patient not always but i had to wait a week for an op cos the swelling was rediculoius
if one was private youd have follow ups witha consultant and generally get better treatment id not wish illness on anyone that had to go public.
Get insurance too fook

Private health insurance vhi or one of the others if you needed a hospital stay

[careca]

quick one here for the BBV - Just got a call from home there saying that the family health insurance policy was too expensive so im out anyway just wondering is it worth me getting health insurance and roughly how much would it cost? - Im 23 non smoker fairly fit if that helps eh occasional drinker

Basically is t worth getting it at all?

We are lucky in Ireland in that you will still be looked after in a hospital just as well if you don't have medical insurance and something bad happens to you.

I had a scary moment at 28 years of age and I got top class treatment. After this I joined the VHI and was told I wouldn't be covered for my ailment for 5 years but since then I have had regular tests etc and they have all been covered no problem.

Its a bit like the AA Breakdown service. Wait until you break down and you can then join them over the phone and have them come out on the spot

[Guest]

you just proved that getting HI is massively -EV and now your asking poker players if they want to take that risk

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9tEdbwXxXw[/ame]

[careca]

Yeah but take the example of my pretty fit cousin (aged 30) who gets rid of her VHI and then a month later has a suspected heart attack and can't have a consultant carry out the proper tests to confirm what happened to her for three weeks as she has to wait on the public list.

Ya I meant to say this but forgot, the consultant waiting time is one of the major reasons why you would.

[Angry-Ball]

Today I discovered that because my girlfriend works for HSBC I can get all the employee benefits that she gets if I open a HSBC account. This means I can switch my car loan and credit card balance for a massive reduction in interest rate.

Thanks to you fuckers turning me into a poker player, I'm as giddy as a child at Christmas. I just found a +EV situation and I'm gonna exploit it for the maximum possible value. It'll only save me ~£100 over the next six months. But that doesn't matter. I found value!

obviously when they do a credit check on you and see your degenerative ways they will sack your gf and you will get nothing

[V for Vendetta]

you just proved that getting HI is massively -EV and now your asking poker players if they want to take that risk

I'm a pretty safe car driver and I don't drink and I park my car in a safe area. I'm overpaying for my car insurance but if I want a car that's what it costs.

If you want to run the risk that's fine. If you want to insure the risk you are being overcharged. It's up to you to make the decision as to what price you are willing to pay for peace of mind. Personally I would hate to get sick in this country and be relying on the HSE for my treatment.

[6starpool]

Are you visually impaired ?

It is possibly a minor issue I'll give you that, although it may result in the doubling or more of my travel time (although I am only 15-20 mins away at the mo).

[LuckyLloyd]

I didn't intend accusing you of this. I do think you were a bit guilty of shooting the messenger and then I made a wider point about the quality of "debate" in general, anyway you're a big boy so I'm sure you can handle a little ego hurt.

True, and the last week or so has been the best I've personally had in a while so you ain't going to bring me down!

[LuckyLloyd]

Congrats Dom obv! Nice problem to have imo.

[Megatron]

Anyone having ipoker problems today? My hu tables just randomly freezing and closing down. Connection is fine on my side, although I highly doubt they will accpet that!

Yet again there seems to be problems on the Network.

Doing my head in at this stage.

[AndyFatBastard]

Actuarially you aren't getting value. However until someone offers a health product for young people which covers catastrophe risk over a certain financial amount and cuts out all the bs like maternity benefits, sprained ankle physiotherapy and stops the cross subsidisation of inefficient market players then you've got little choice unless you are comfortable running the risk of major unexpected health problems.

Ask Brayruit to get on the case asap!!

The nature of insurance is that those who don't claim pay for everyone who does. This isn't going to change.

[V for Vendetta]

It is possibly a minor issue I'll give you that, although it may result in the doubling or more of my travel time (although I am only 15-20 mins away at the mo).

Never did a man have a better Avatar!!



Are you not on a fitness buzz these days? Cycle to work I say. It's the business.

[Guest]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=953PkxFNiko"]One for the new player on the Irish poker scene[/ame]

[Theresa]

The nature of insurance is that those who don't claim pay for everyone who does. This isn't going to change.

It is amazing though that otherwise reasonable people don't really get this. Having to explain this to people day in day out is one of the worst things about my job. "But I didnt make a claim"...

3 months left though then I'm ouuuuuutta here.

[V for Vendetta]

The nature of insurance is that those who don't claim pay for everyone who does. This isn't going to change.

You got me Andy!

I guess my point is that it would be nice to have some more market segmentation without cross subsidies between age groups and risk profiles. Then if you don't claim you at least were paying something closer to the correct price for the risks you faced.

[Raoul Duke III]

Yeah but take the example of my pretty fit cousin (aged 30) who gets rid of her VHI and then a month later has a suspected heart attack and can't have a consultant carry out the proper tests to confirm what happened to her for three weeks as she has to wait on the public list.

What price for the peace of mind?

Would you want to rely on our public service as the budget runs out towards the year end?

does Mrs V for Vendetta know about this?

[EARMUFFS]

Bubbleking your going to be playing football so a chance of an auld injury.
I was lax about private insurance but broke my leg and dislocated my ankle in february
my first night in hospital was spent in some sort of a stock room had people coming in geting stuff the whole night.

Now i was heavily drugged but a bit of comfort would have been nice.
6 o clock the next day i got placed in a room with 2 old guys who were puking for 3 days straight and some poor kid who had constant diarrohea the smell as he used a comode was horrific.

No tv and the food was poor but thats what you get if your a public patient not always but i had to wait a week for an op cos the swelling was rediculoius
if one was private youd have follow ups witha consultant and generally get better treatment id not wish illness on anyone that had to go public.
Get insurance too fook

Private health insurance vhi or one of the others if you needed a hospital stay

flip side of this is that even with plan b you don't always get a private room..i had a shoulder op and was put in a public ward(ok so it was elective surgery and i jumped the q) with a guy who was handcuffed to his bed with a garda sitting beside him. this guy was a class act who would use the commode every time dinner was served so the smell was unreal(never bothered closing the curtains either) i also had an angry midget who would squeal every time a nurse came near him that he was in pain and who would shout out that he was a homosexual and that he preferred to have male nurses..the 3 days i was in there felt like an eternity and i didnt get any sleep whic would have helped as i kept vomiting up the morphine and kept having to have injections in the stomach...fk irish hospitals...ps never saw the consultant at all over the 3 days only his ballsucking minions

[Strewelpeter]

In some ways the debate about how exactly we deal with the financials is superfulous and distracting.
None of our leaders have an alternative ... except maybe Happy Gilmore who was on the radio the other day promising to cut nothing and increase spending everywhere and is still almost entirely focused on attributing blame.
One real issue as was said earlier is the quality of the debate everyone in the media, maybe to an extent on here as well, comes with a position that is rigid. We know though that Nama is a done deal and now it is a question of whether we can stay in the Euro or not and that probably won't be a decision we can make.

What is really crucial whatever way the financial system works out is the one huge question that nobody is even attempting to answer beyond the bullshit 'smart economy' soundbites is this:
How do we get to a place where we have a functioning economy that can sustain a population of 5 Million people producing shit that people in other countries want at a price that they will pay ?
Have a look at what you do and then think about most of your friends, how many people do you know that actually produce anything? I can tell you now that the answer is feck all, we are a nation of service providers all trying to squeeze a living adding value to someone else's work and almost no one is producing anything.
We have any number of Accountants, Business and marketing types, we are right up to our necks in lawyers and there is an entire class whose role was to distribute the excess tax take of the boom. Yet we still have to look outside of Ireland for competent people to employ for most of the key technical skills in the so called smart industries. Now of course the really good guys no longer want to come and work in Ireland

How are we going to find something productive to do with all the builders and all those that supplied them?

[Raoul Duke III]

How are we going to find something productive to do with all the builders and all those that supplied them?

<flippant answer>that's Australia and Canada's problem now!</flippant answer>

[tylerdurden94]

Language is a little NSFW

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLGDex936UE[/ame]

[Strewelpeter]

I have a professional interest in the BOI ATM fiasco and there are two things that are worth noting.

I do not believe that it is possible that Boi are so incompetent that this setting was not noticed by the people responsible for a number of years. A decision was taken that refunds would only be applied when people came back looking for their money after leaving it behind.

There is a very good reason why what BoI were doing is the preferred way to deal with retracted cash from an ATM and I expect that they will revert to the previous setting, maybe with the addition of sending a note to people informing them that there was an incomplete transaction, when people figure out how easy it is to try to scam banks that automatically refund retracted cash. Lets just say there will be a lot more pf it happening soon

IMO the only correct way to deal with cash left behind at an ATM as one bank I know does is to not retract it at all, just leave it and let the next person who comes along decide how they want to deal with it. If some gobshite walks away without their money then that's their problem

[V for Vendetta]

In some ways the debate about how exactly we deal with the financials is superfulous and distracting.
None of our leaders have an alternative ... except maybe Happy Gilmore who was on the radio the other day promising to cut nothing and increase spending everywhere and is still almost entirely focused on attributing blame.
One real issue as was said earlier is the quality of the debate everyone in the media, maybe to an extent on here as well, comes with a position that is rigid. We know though that Nama is a done deal and now it is a question of whether we can stay in the Euro or not and that probably won't be a decision we can make.

What is really crucial whatever way the financial system works out is the one huge question that nobody is even attempting to answer beyond the bullshit 'smart economy' soundbites is this:
How do we get to a place where we have a functioning economy that can sustain a population of 5 Million people producing shit that people in other countries want at a price that they will pay ?
Have a look at what you do and then think about most of your friends, how many people do you know that actually produce anything? I can tell you now that the answer is feck all, we are a nation of service providers all trying to squeeze a living adding value to someone else's work and almost no one is producing anything.
We have any number of Accountants, Business and marketing types, we are right up to our necks in lawyers and there is an entire class whose role was to distribute the excess tax take of the boom. Yet we still have to look outside of Ireland for competent people to employ for most of the key technical skills in the so called smart industries. Now of course the really good guys no longer want to come and work in Ireland

How are we going to find something productive to do with all the builders and all those that supplied them?

We're going to have to get relatively cheaper and we're going to have to produce things. The mechanics of how it happens and the details of how the "pain" is shared is the only variable and the range of options on that front narrows every day....


Having said all that we still have plenty of fat to burn off and the quality of life is light years ahead of where it was 20 years ago. We've run good for 20 years and now we're going on a downswing.

[rounders123]

??? I'm not sure which of the two meaning you mean but I have an answer to both!

Its just that i noticed most times you post you quote about 10+ people. Like its volley practice at the net, "this one that one, oh theres another one!".

[Raoul Duke III]

I have a professional interest in the BOI ATM fiasco and there are two things that are worth noting.

I do not believe that it is possible that Boi are so incompetent that this setting was not noticed by the people responsible for a number of years. A decision was taken that refunds would only be applied when people came back looking for their money after leaving it behind.

There is a very good reason why what BoI were doing is the correct way to deal with retracted cash from an ATM and I expect that they will revert to the previous setting, maybe with the addition of sending a note to people informing them that there was an incomplete transaction, when people figure out how easy it is to try to scam banks that automatically refund retracted cash. Lets just say there will be a lot more pf it happening soon

IMO the only correct way to deal with cash left behind at an ATM as one bank I know does is to not retract it at all, just leave it and let the next person who comes along decide how they want to deal with it. If some gobshite walks away without their money then that's their problem

I'd love to see a timechart of when all these retracted withdrawals happened. I expect it to be heavily centred around 11pm-3am Friday\Saturday nights.

[6starpool]

Never did a man have a better Avatar!!



Are you not on a fitness buzz these days? Cycle to work I say. It's the business.

The auld fitness thing stopped when I messed up my ankle for a few weeks, and I never got going again on it sadly. I won't be cycling from around the Navan road to probably Sandyford, thank you very much.

[AndyFatBastard]

You got me Andy!

I guess my point is that it would be nice to have some more market segmentation without cross subsidies between age groups and risk profiles. Then if you don't claim you at least were paying something closer to the correct price for the risks you faced.

I agree it would be nice if health insurance was a "perfect market" where the cost of your insurance was simply the average value of a claim divided by your % chance of claiming per year. Unfortunately there are a large number of people who will never pay more into the system than they take out, but who cannot be refused insurance.

Much like having to pay PRSI even though you've already got a job, this is an unfortunate side effect of living in a functional society - one where a certain quality of life is mandated to all people, not just those who can afford it.

Can you tell I've spent a lot of time arguing with Americans about this? They have some fucked up diehard free-marketeers over there, let me tell you.

[V for Vendetta]

The auld fitness thing stopped when I messed up my ankle for a few weeks, and I never got going again on it sadly. I won't be cycling from around the Navan road to probably Sandyford, thank you very much.

Sorry to hear about the ankle - the risk of injuries are the major problem when you are carrying a bit of weight.

It's only 14km Dom.

If you got a decent bike and built up to it you'd easily manage it in under 50 minutes. You would need a shower facility though....

I managed 25km around the Phoenix Park myself last night and I could probably have handled another 10km if I wanted to push myself. Not killing myself but keeping up a steady pace.

[V for Vendetta]

They have some fucked up diehard free-marketeers over there, let me tell you.

We've got a few over here too!!

[Iago]

I remember having a convo with TG about this. He was saying he thinks its massively -EV for anyone our age who is in any way fit and overall quite healthy to have it. Anyone normal really.

Granted most of ye lot have a decade or so on me, but I really think you're mad not to have health insurance.

At a very basic level you can claim back any GP / Physio expenses you might have so you can discount that off the annual cost. More importantly any significant injury (which can be picked up at any stage) is also covered.

I have mine through work (I pay for it, but before I'm taxed so it's discounted) but I've had to have surgery on my knee €4,500 cost which was covered by VHI, as well as different issues that required either the Swiftcare clinic or physio visits over the last couple of years.

From highlighting the issue to having the surgery completed and getting home I was done and dusted inside of 3 weeks. No waiting list, no hassle, no additional cost.

It's only €15/€20 a week, and I'd rather have it and not need it, than not have it and have to fork out in an emergency.


edit; said by everyone else above me. It's all about peace of mind and being covered when you need it tbh

[Theresa]

Granted most of ye lot have a decade or so on me, but I really think your mad not to have health insurance.

At a very basic level you can claim back any GP / Physio expenses you might have so you can discount that off the annual cost. More importantly any significant injury (which can be picked up at any stage) is also covered.

I have mine through work (I pay for it, but before I'm taxed so it's discounted) but I've had to have surgery on my knee €4,500 cost which was covered by VHI, as well as different issues that required either the Swiftcare clinic or physio visits over the last couple of years.

It's only €15/€20 a week, and I'd rather have it and not need it, than not have it and have to fork out in an emergency.

I couldnt agree more. I actually have health insurance, and am under no illusions as to how much I am paying for that peace of mind. But I want that peace of mind. I'm pretty active and if something happend an ACL or I slipped a disc squatting I'd be very glad I was being ripped off.

[Zuroph]

RE health insurance, little known trick...
first, go here

http://www.hia.ie/

then compare your current policy to the list, there will be a comparable "company plan" for whatever policy you're on. according to EU law (so im told) if they offer a policy to someone, they have to offer it to everyone. the Company plans are the reduced rates they offer to get the foot in the door of large companies. You can ring up and insist to be put on the same policy and get the exact same cover for less.

Re using health insurance; I'm 27 and in the last few years, I've broken my nose, had my appendix rupture, had two wisdom teeth out, and am going in next week for a septoplasty to repair a deviated septum related to the first nose break. priced a septoplasty privately, €7000!! will be in hospital for 3 days apparently, quinn will be footing the bill. So yes, health insurance is worth every penny IMO.

[6starpool]

No way I'd willingly be without health insurance here for any length of time. As said, better to have and not need than need and not have. If you can afford it, then you'd be silly not to.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[hotspur]

Insurance is inherently -EV. However EV is not the sole criterion for any gamble. The risk of ruin is why we don't put our net worth on the line at 5/4.

Also, with life not being a game, the actual value of the money to your life matters. This means that it's not just the relationship between the premium, the costs covered, and the probability of an event occurring triggering the policy that matters.

If the above were all that mattered (as it would in a simple EV calculation) then a health insurance package which cost €10k a month could conceivably be +EV. The relevance of paying the premium and paying the cost of the event without insurance to your life and lifestyle matters too. This is why so many low paid Americans have gone without health insurance - it's not because they are EV whizzes, it's because paying the premium would significantly affect their lifestyle.

So how much would €70 a month affect your lifestyle? Would it mean not socialising for a week or €70 less going into a savings account?

Also, notwithstanding the impressive job that actuaries do (actuarial based predictions outperform health professional clinical predictions), health insurance can be impossible to truly evaluate in respect of EV from a personal perspective since death or serious incapacitation is not particularly amenable to the assignation of a monetary value. It is done by insurance companies, but how does a person work out the cost of dying to themselves (not their family) in any meaningful way?

Anyway, my point is not to get caught up in the poker / gambling view that EV calculation is the total sufficient consideration for real life decisions.

[The Tourist]

Anyway, my point is not to get caught up in the poker / gambling view that EV calculation is the total sufficient consideration for real life decisions.

EV is a simplified concept that can be easily used at the table. It is not everything. For example, in finance investments are measured by the ratio of their EV to their expected risk, and correlations with other investments are also considered. In economics, expected utility can be used, and it is a more general concept than EV. For example, if someone gave you 10 million dollars, and kept back a billion dollars, and asked you to flip for the lot, winner takes all at 50/50, you wouldn't do it because the expected utility of the gamble would be negative, even though the expected value is positive. Or something. For small figures that are not important to you EV = expected utility.

[FeetMagic]

Looking for a bit of help here. Im doing a project for college atm that is related to smoking. One of the parts Im having trouble with is the mindset of smokers. Im hoping that a few smokers will respond to the thread and this question: why do you persist in smoking and what makes the habit so hard to break?

Im also hoping to get a response from someone that has successfully given up cigarettes; why and when did you give up cigarettes and was there any single motivation behind it?

Thanks alot.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[Maloney]

Strange one

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9JcOZlMlLY&feature=player_embedded[/ame]

[Guest]

Looking for a bit of help here. Im doing a project for college atm that is related to smoking. One of the parts Im having trouble with is the mindset of smokers. Im hoping that a few smokers will respond to the thread and this question: why do you persist in smoking and what makes the habit so hard to break?

Im also hoping to get a response from someone that has successfully given up cigarettes; why and when did you give up cigarettes and was there any single motivation behind it?

Thanks alot.

Alan Carr's book should answer a lot of this for you.

[Wreck]

why and when did you give up cigarettes and was there any single motivation behind it?

Gave up 01/01/2008, main motivation was long-term health benefits of quitting, secondary motivations were just wanting to break the addiction and change my lifestyle a little.

[kidsgotheart]

More pictures. This time ones that most of you may have never seen from the twin tower attacks.

Part 1

A second aircraft approaches the World Trade Center just prior to hitting the South tower. Within a span of 18 minutes, two planes had crashed into each of the twin towers of the World Trade Center in Manhattan in what President Bush called "a national tragedy and an apparent act of terrorism against our country.





A fireball erupts from one of the towers of the World Trade Center after the second plane hit. In the background, smoke billows from the other tower that was struck minutes earlier. The Brooklyn Bridge is in the foreground.






From about half a mile north, near Canal Street, people's expressions and gestures bore wittness to the sight they beheld: the collapse of 2 World Trade Center.





As people fled across the Brooklyn Bridge from Lower Manhattan, some of them betrayed their curiosity about Joseph Sylvester, a World Financial Center employee who had obviously been close to ground zero.





A person stands alone in the middle of a gaping hole in the World Trade Center, surrounded by smoke and flames, with nowhere to go and no way to be rescued.





A victim from the World Trade Center attack is treated by emergency medical personnel on the east side of Church Street across from 5 World Trade Center. She was evacuated before the building collapsed.





By the time the twin towers collapsed that morning, more than 2, 900 people were dead, lower Manhattan was covered in ash-laden debris and the lot where two of the world's tallest buildings had stood for more than a generation had a new name, ground zero.





Firefighters and paramedics assist the injured in the immediate aftermath of the twin towers' collapse.





An exhausted New York City police officer, Richard Adamiak, 26, ducked into the Stage Door Deli on Vesey Street across from the World Trade Center Plaza after the collapse of the first tower -- and shortly before the second tower came down.





Rescue workers and medical personnel continued their efforts in the middle of a vast, nightmarish landscape on West Street 24 hours after the collapse of the World Trade Center t.owers





Part 2 to follow

[Strewelpeter]

For some reason, the BBV keeps logging me out and throwing me back to this post.

Bit of a fail there StrewelPeter
Northern ireland isn't in Britain, it's in the United Kingdom (of Great Britain and Northern Ireland)

I couldn't find a geography fail pic to insert, but i'm sure you can imagine one.

'Fraid not my little Aussie chum

Because of longstanding ethno-sectarian divisions, British identity in Northern Ireland is controversial, but it is held with strong conviction by unionists

Just because half the population don't really recognise the fact doesn't mean it isn't one.