Bad beat/Moaning/Venting thread - Mammy told me not to come.

[Mellor]

Another one for PSV to add to his signature wall of fame.

Dibs on this one...

Why so? Looks like its pretty much over and its got a very low fatality rate. Regular flu outbreaks are vastly more dangerous in terms of fatalities.

(Feb 14th)

[Hectorjelly]

When people were heading to Cheltenham on Monday, it was the day after 70K had been at Old Trafford for the derby, 60K had been at Murrayfield, lots of GAA matches had taken place with 5K at each ground. The Patricks Day parades were still 'on'. No government was upgrading the travel advisory to a level which would entitle them to their money back.
Maybe hating on the racing fans isn't the most logical thing to do.

It was an extremely foolish thing for anyone to do, the fact that other people did an equally foolish thing doesn't take away from how stupid it was. The reason it became a bone of contention here is because horse racing is popular here and we ended up arguing about it, no-one is saying it's worse than any other mass event that happened at the same time.

[Theresa]

I would have agreed with PSV if I didn't have him on ignore.

Yesterday you made the point, or maybe implied that, you didnt ethically think your life was more important than someone elses.

Do you think it's less important?

Also, what is your take on the ethical argument that doctors undertake to triage patients. Whereby they believe it unethical to use resources on a person with less likelihood of survival. Is that implicit valuation?

Been thinking a lot about your comments, so interested to hear your take.

[Hectorjelly]

I could be wrong but I think the real terror of what's happening in Italy only really started to come to light over the last 5 days or so.

Italians were on Joe Duffy early in the week talking about the difficulties they were having not being able to go to the gym. By Thursday we were finding out about 40 year olds being black tagged. No space for the dead.

We can't blame anyone, it's moving too fast.

I don't think thats true at all. It seems like it's moving fast because of a lack of empathy, intelligence and foresight on most peoples parts. Italy really moved our imagination because it's a Western country we can relate to - there are people dying in a rich part of the world. For anyone paying attention to what is happening around the world this is a slow moving disaster.

I thought Dice's post a week or so ago was very telling, (sorry to pick you out Dice), about how out in the 'Real world' people were behaving normally. Unfortunately until people are hit in the face with something like this they won't take it on board.

[NuckChorris]

HSE shutting pubs in Dublin City centre down since 12.00. Prob all gone by tomorrow. Loads had voluntarily agreed to close from tonight anyway. Right thing to do obv given the lack of self control going on today.

[Theresa]

Has anyone heard from Russia in all of this?

[Lao Lao]

That's a fair point.



PSV was the only voice against it.I think it was Mon or Tue when Eamo told him to give it a rest.

Then around Wed Keane posted that PSV was probably right. I agreed by then.

By Thurs I was annoyed about it. That trajectory was the same for everyone, bar the odd PSV.



We can't blame the punters. This is moving too fast.

Pfft!

Below was part of a post I made on March 5th.

All major gatherings (sporting, etc) over a few thousand people gets knocked on the head.

Others on here were arguing for similar.

There was too little focus on countries outside Europe as far as I'm concerned. Maybe that's just human nature, it's not effecting white Europeans so, meh...

It was always going this way unless decisive and radical action was taken.

When action was eventially taken, way too late in my opinion, we as a nation are still pissing around 3 days later.

[Lao Lao]

Has anyone heard from Russia in all of this?

They've official reported 59 cases, no deaths.

[hotspur]

Yesterday you made the point, or maybe implied that, you didnt ethically think your life was more important than someone elses.

Do you think it's less important?

Also, what is your take on the ethical argument that doctors undertake to triage patients. Whereby they believe it unethical to use resources on a person with less likelihood of survival. Is that implicit valuation?

Been thinking a lot about your comments, so interested to hear your take.

All other things being equal I don't think my life is more or less important than another's. Either of those is a delusion that you're special in some way. I think most of the man-made suffering in the world ultimately derives from this delusion.

The ethics of triage is something I haven't read much about, but there is plenty to read about it. On the face of it it is manifestly moral to me to allocate medical resources for the best overall outcome. It violates certain biomedical ethical principles around autonomy and beneficence, but in the latter only if beneficence is limited to the individual not getting treatment.

If you were to be told that you will have Coronavirus requiring ICU and a ventilator but you don't know what age and health status you will be in this thought experiment would you choose to have triage being done or not? I say yes as it maximises the chance that you will recover overall.

I asked my doctor friend today if triage would take into account his being a medical professional who can contribute if he gets well again should he contract it during work and he said he didn't think that it would be taken into account. I thought that was dreadful.

Among other things I think we need is public ethics to be articulated right now since most of us have never spent much time studying or thinking about ethics. The people out drinking in the pubs aren't bad people, they're just ignorant of the ethics of their actions for a number of different reasons.

It's one thing to give recommendations on what to do to physically reduce risk, it's another to give the ethical reasons why they need to do it. Some of that would be information to graphically link decisions to socialise unwisely with the deaths of vulnerable loved ones. Clearly some people need that.

Also people need to have it explained that, unlike the normal social contract whereby they can put themselves in harm's way through ignorance and get a pass, that this does not apply right now. They have no right to jeopardise the health of other people because they want to have a few pints in the pub or whatever it is. "Fuck it" is not an option right now.

So I would like to see this being put out by authorities in the media, rather than rely on social media shaming. I also think our psychological and emotional health is going to be tested in the coming time and we need help and advice with that.

[ComradeCollie]

I'm surprised had how stressed out I already feel about the whole situation. Really hope the army have been trained in how to operate the ESB generators.

[Guest]

New coronavirus test has received expedited approval from the FDA allowing a 10x increase in the speed of testing.
This is the 3rd that's received fast track approval but differs from the first two as it is commercially available.

It's also available in Europe for those that accept its CE marking

[Guest]

Proportion of US workers with no paid sick leave and the companies:

SPOILER

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/14/o....co/UvHudNpqGd

Someone mentioned no paywall

[DeadParrot]

[Dice75]

I don't think thats true at all. It seems like it's moving fast because of a lack of empathy, intelligence and foresight on most peoples parts. Italy really moved our imagination because it's a Western country we can relate to - there are people dying in a rich part of the world. For anyone paying attention to what is happening around the world this is a slow moving disaster.

I thought Dice's post a week or so ago was very telling, (sorry to pick you out Dice), about how out in the 'Real world' people were behaving normally. Unfortunately until people are hit in the face with something like this they won't take it on board.

No probs. That coment wasn't meant about the current problem more about his comments about the world being wrapped up in online anger, us and them and blue ticks. Lot of good things outside the internet (balanced by a lot of shithousery admittedly too).

[Denny Crane]

I don't think thats true at all. It seems like it's moving fast because of a lack of empathy, intelligence and foresight on most peoples parts. Italy really moved our imagination because it's a Western country we can relate to - there are people dying in a rich part of the world. For anyone paying attention to what is happening around the world this is a slow moving disaster.

It's human nature. I read a post on 2p2 from someone complaining that people struggle with taking on new information that contradicts their world view. It's like getting annoyed at water for being wet. We're not designed to assess these risks well.

[Guest]

I hope we can get some close to this trajectory in the coming weeks

SK with approx 300k tests complete, 8,162 cases confirmed, 834 recovered with 75 deaths.

Of the remaining 7,253 people, 7194(99.2%) are mild with the remaining being severe.

Additionally, they have gradually been decreasing the number of cases from a peak of 851 on March 4th to 107 on March 14th.

It's the most encouraged I've felt about the situation in the past number of days.

It's not saying that they're in any way done or that we will follow their trajectory but those numbers are encouraging.
They have the most comprehensive and reliable dataset available to date so hopefully we can come close to matching their figures.

[DeadParrot]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Bb2WTDP28GD_gHMfJMtr_RiR6INAOIUsTimXKFh8JrU/edit?usp=drivesdk

Model of expected rates
Model of expected rates

[Fullof..It]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/graphi...ona-simulator/

Some caveats but good visual of containment options and impact.

[Lazare]

[mdoug]

My plan of visiting every country in Europe this year has taken a fucking disastrous turn for the books. Was in Milan, Siena, Bologna, Venice etc literally 3-4 weeks before it all came out. Got to visit them before the huge lockdown too at least.

New plan for the year is to visit every Irish county. Is there any sites people know of that would have a lot of information about nice places to visit in each county or would it be better to research individually? I had never heard anyone talk about Coumshingaun before applying for a job in January and it looks fecking class so I know there is a lot I don't know of.
If people have some must-see's for a county that would be ideal also!


This would be a more scenic trip obviously, as there will not be any festivals coming up in the next while and such.

[Guest]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/graphi...ona-simulator/

Some caveats but good visual of containment options and impact.

The primary caveat for me has been raised here. What proportion of people(if any) can become re-infected.

If the answer is zero then similar curves will continue to play out in the countries already exhibiting theses trends. I did see this recent article but questions around the source [

SPOILER

url]https://www3.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld/en/news/20200315_13/[/url]

I'm quite confident that seasonality will have a substantial impact on the virus in light of what I've read on the structure of this virus and other coronaviruses.

If it acts in a similar manner in terms of seasonality as influenza and other coronaviruses have historically, then we are effectively past the peak time which is late Jan to early March.

Again this is not to say that significant troubles don't lay ahead but I think the science and the most reliable stats to date are significantly divergent from the social media coverage. I actually have no issue with the sentiment as people clearly need to adhere to the advice of the experts.

[Hectorjelly]

My plan of visiting every country in Europe this year has taken a fucking disastrous turn for the books. Was in Milan, Siena, Bologna, Venice etc literally 3-4 weeks before it all came out. Got to visit them before the huge lockdown too at least.

New plan for the year is to visit every Irish county. Is there any sites people know of that would have a lot of information about nice places to visit in each county or would it be better to research individually? I had never heard anyone talk about Coumshingaun before applying for a job in January and it looks fecking class so I know there is a lot I don't know of.
If people have some must-see's for a county that would be ideal also!


This would be a more scenic trip obviously, as there will not be any festivals coming up in the next while and such.

This seems pretty optimistic! Why would you be able to travel around Ireland and not Europe?

[mdoug]

This seems pretty optimistic! Why would you be able to travel around Ireland and not Europe?

Have transport and for the most-part will either sleep in it, or a tent. Travelling here will be easy if the weather is good, just want to make a nice route and don't want to miss stuff.

[ComradeCollie]

New plan for the year is to visit every Irish county.

Cop yourself on, you fucking clown!

[mdoug]

Cop yourself on, you fucking clown!

You serious..?
I'll have my own food, my own transport, my own accommodation and isolation whilst hiking. Legit don't see your point or your need for aggression.

[Guest]

You serious..?
I'll have my own food, my own transport, my own accommodation and isolation whilst hiking. Legit don't see your point or your need for aggression.

No opinion on your plans but FWIW

I've climbed Coumshingaun half a dozen times, Slievenamon & Knockmealdown aren't too far either.

Coumshingaun is the nicest and most challenging of the three though.

[mdoug]

No opinion on your plans but FWIW

I've climbed Coumshingaun half a dozen times, Slievenamon & Knockmealdown aren't too far either.

Coumshingaun is the nicest and most challenging of the three though.

Cheers for that. Even if I don't do it now, it'll be nice to have for the future.

[Lazare]

Cop yourself on, you fucking clown!

Bit harsh?

Not unreasonable to assume things might be ok in a few months time.

[mdoug]

https://countytops.wordpress.com/hig...ts-of-ireland/

A good resource to climb the highest peak in every county in Ireland.

That's perfect. Also has a link to mountainviews.ie which I did not know of, but seems to be very useful. Much appreciated gab

[Solksjaer!]

You'd wonder if this drags on a bit when things become a bit lawless when those with little to no savings become desperate.

Up until last week I was worried sick for the mudder. Now I'm thinking 'I hope those other bastards dont get her toilet roll collection when shes gone.

[Fullof..It]

Brought the dogs for a walk up at Blessington lakes yesterday.

Very fresh day, and also felt great with the sense of freedom from Corona (mind and touch point exposure).

We are obvious very early in the disruption journey but Im trying to lean into the positives/opportunities. I hope its sustainable!

[SatNav]

Here getting ready for work thinking ffs this is retarted up to a busy shopping centre and it is busy with people still panic buying which I reckon will peak today.

When are they going to lock this country down its absolutely ridiculous. Teenagers, are running riot in centre, people hanging about. I'm standing there watching it all.
Mia is not allowed up town, wtf is wrong with parents.

I'm actually now getting really fucking anxious about the whole situation but unfortunately my day will go on like normal with people passing me coughing, sneezing etc.

[Solksjaer!]

Here getting ready for work thinking ffs this is retarted up to a busy shopping centre and it is busy with people still panic buying which I reckon will peak today.

When are they going to lock this country down its absolutely ridiculous. Teenagers, are running riot in centre, people hanging about. I'm standing there watching it all.
Mia is not allowed up town, wtf is wrong with parents.

I'm actually now getting really fucking anxious about the whole situation but unfortunately my day will go on like normal with people passing me coughing, sneezing etc.

You wont be selling many Sky Sports packages for a while.

Try to gauge if the coughs are dry or not . To relieve boredom. Every time someone coughs give out a little scream .

[Hectorjelly]

Don't go to work. Why risk it?

[The Situation]

The anxiety is real though, most of us so privileged to have lived through such non turbulent times that we dont fully know how to deal with such potential impending doom.

Found myself needing to go out for a three hour walk this morning sans internet to get back on a mental even keel.

We should have a mindfulness hour with Hotspur every day

[SatNav]

You wont be selling many Sky Sports packages for a while.

Try to gauge if the coughs are dry or not . To relieve boredom. Every time someone coughs give out a little scream .

About 6 people yesterday asked me to remove sports, which I have no authority to do so.

Weird thing is yesterday I signed up 2 customers, one elderly man and one pregnant girl and we are practically right beside each other while doing contract which takes, approx 20 mins or so. Madness

[Dice75]

Is GAB running a book on this too?

[SatNav]

Don't go to work. Why risk it?

I have no choice, I have to open store today. Until country goes into lockdown or my employer tells me stay at home. Wasn't really worried last week now I am deffo starting to panic. Just got message from friend who works in Tesco, people crawling under shutters, at 7 am this morning. Like this shit ain't fucking helping anyone.

I reckon today is going to be absolute mayhem. I can see an announcement tonight or tomorrow.

[dobby]

Don't go to work. Why risk it?

Not a luxury the vast majority of workers can afford. I'm expected in work this week too and would have lots of contact with people of all ages and questionable hygiene. One lad came in the other day coughing and spluttering announced he was just back from Italy and felt grand. Fucking moron.

It's all well and good saying just dont go to work. Unfortunately, until some kind of shutdown is announced from Govt, its business as usual.

[ComradeCollie]

You serious..?
I'll have my own food, my own transport, my own accommodation and isolation whilst hiking. Legit don't see your point or your need for aggression.

I may be over-reacting due to a lack of sleep. But unless your transport is a horse or a push-bike I don't think you'll be going far.

[Opr]

Spain gone lockdown

Arrangements for movement and fines imposed if laws are broken - up to €2000

Local Councils can update and add to the decree, but the countrywide State of Emergency measures applying throughout Spain - including the Canaries - come into force immediately on publication of the State of Emergency Law at 00:00 15-3-2020

All bars, shops, sports facilities, restaurants, cafes, churches, beaches, parks entertainment venues, etc, with the exception of supermarkets and chemists, will be shut.

The freedom of movement for citizens is covered by article 6 of the law. This will be restricted from 8am on Monday morning (but has been seen to be encouraged from tonight). It is the only article of the law that waits for Monday morning and It covers:
Limitations to free movement. During the state of emergency people can only move around for the following reasons:

1) buying food, medicines, and items of "primary necessity" (e.g personal hygiene products etc)

2) attending medical centres.

3) to travel to and from work (directly)

4) help/care for dependents like children, elderly, disabled etc.

5) going to the bank

6) for reasons of "fuerza mayor" -- an extreme reason to leave the home.

7) to put fuel in your car

It also has been confirmed you can walk your dog/pet but it must be on a lead, and you must social distance (minimum 1m from other people), and it must be for the shortest time required.

Opr

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[limpwhacker]

Relax

[SatNav]

I think what got me was the video of the cop van with the loudspeaker in benidorm.

Spanish and English "please stay in doors, do not leave your house etc

It was, like something from a movie. It frightened the shit out of me.

I'm also on a fuerteventura group page and the streets are empty, all businesses closed bar super markets. Heavy fines imposed if out and about unless you're getting food or going to chemist.no cases there at all, was one she has now recovered.

Most pubs here in town closing tonight at 11.30 pm till further notice.

And this is only the beginning......

[Raoul Duke III]

Relax

You wouldn't believe the amount of gardening I'm getting through. Great displacement activity.

30 years of overgrown ivy to clear.

[dobby]

Relax

Care to expand? Because as with everything discussed on this site, its nice to hear both sides of the argument.

[Raoul Duke III]

Care to expand? Because as with everything discussed on this site, its nice to hear both sides of the argument.

At a micro level, follow the official advice. But freaking yourself out spending 12 hours a day online is not good for you either (and to be practical, stress inhibits your immune system).

[Iago]

Spain gone lockdown


Opr

which would be grand if online shopping worked, but it doesn't. Rightly blocked out for confirmed victims, elderly/infirm and pregnant women.

Will still have to don the hazmat for bread and stuff but all good. Day 5 of lockdown for me and only slightly stir crazy so far

[dobby]

At a micro level, follow the official advice. But freaking yourself out spending 12 hours a day online is not good for you either (and to be practical, stress inhibits your immune system).

Not freaking out at all. Avoiding Twitter and Facebook as much as possible. Trying to follow the official advice but it's hard when I'm doing everything correctly this weekend and then be told, yeah you have to come to work. Either shut it down or dont. I've a fence that needs fixing too

[Raoul Duke III]

Not freaking out at all. Avoiding Twitter and Facebook as much as possible. Trying to follow the official advice but it's hard when I'm doing everything correctly this weekend and then be told, yeah you have to come to work. Either shut it down or dont. I've a fence that needs fixing too

Don't go to work would be my advice.

[dobby]

Don't go to work would be my advice.

Lol. Yes. But, as mentioned, that's not a luxury decision I can make. I did ask the operations manager and HR before leaving on Friday what's the craic and was told its business as usual until someone gets the virus, then they will shut down to clean the place and back at it.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[Dice75]

I'd assumed you would be able to go out for walks etc once you were keeping to yourselves?

If we get similar to that Spanish lockdown I will instantly be classifying kids as pets.

[Opr]

Looks like a soft closing of the pubs has already happened around the country without an official announcement. Probably doing it this way to flatten the curve and not have the off licences completely overrun and unable to cope.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hks6Nq7g6P4

[ComradeCollie]

We're hoping to escape to a countryside house isolated on a few acres on Tuesday for a month. Just 20 mins away by train, so hopefully we won't get locked down before then. Don't think so though. Owner is still hemming and hawing (acceptably) on whether to rent or not.

What's the plan if in four weeks time the is no public transport? I assume there are decent sized shops within walking distance of the house?

[CHDad]

Alot of pubs around here are closing tonight. First bit of sense at last.

[shrapnel]

What's the plan if in four weeks time the is no public transport? I assume there are decent sized shops within walking distance of the house?

our Hitch is going to become a lean mean hunting machine. food from the land!!!

[ComradeCollie]

our Hitch is going to become a lean mean hunting machine. food from the land!!!

I imagine him more like this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRTpwyNGT6w

[Guest]

The markets got quite an uptick on the last day's trading, almost 10% on the day.
It will be interesting how they react tomorrow in response to the US border closures.

Anthony Fauci the head of the US National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases at the National Institutes of Health must have one of the most unenviable jobs in the world right now.

He has spent 40 years on the front line of HIV/Aids and Ebola treatment, now he's stuck walking the tightrope between pandering to Trump's ego and disseminating the most accurate information to citizens.

Already calls that the administration has muzzled his efforts.