Exposed Card

[drive56]

Playing in a tournament. Utg raises and get one caller and I 3 bet. Both players call. The flop is spread and both players check to me. The dealer, somehow forgets that I am in the hand and decides to start putting out the turn. I stop him just before it is turned but the player UTG has a slight glimpse of the card. He claims it could possibly be a black ace but isnt sure but knows it is definitley black. The dealer is unsure of what to do and the tournament director is called? The tournament director tries to explain to the dealer that the card must go back into the deck and a new turn be put out. THEN the dealer goes to do it again and burns the 2nd card before Ive got a chance to act in the first place on the flop. Is this the correct ruling with the two cards exposed? seems like im being put at a distinct disadvantage in this hand. Any info/opinions would be appreciated

[ghostface]

Playing in a tournament. Utg raises and get one caller and I 3 bet. Both players call. The flop is spread and both players check to me. The dealer, somehow forgets that I am in the hand and decides to start putting out the turn. I stop him just before it is turned but the player UTG has a slight glimpse of the card. He claims it could possibly be a black ace but isnt sure but knows it is definitley black. The dealer is unsure of what to do and the tournament director is called? The tournament director tries to explain to the dealer that the card must go back into the deck and a new turn be put out. THEN the dealer goes to do it again and burns the 2nd card before Ive got a chance to act in the first place on the flop. Is this the correct ruling with the two cards exposed? seems like im being put at a distinct disadvantage in this hand. Any info/opinions would be appreciated

pretty sure when the turn is exposed the correct way to do it is to deal the River face down then reshuffle the turn card into the deck and deal the turn.

No idea what to do when 2 have been like that, reshuffle the cards and start again from the turn??

[The Aul Switcharoo]

Playing in a tournament. Utg raises and get one caller and I 3 bet. Both players call. The flop is spread and both players check to me. The dealer, somehow forgets that I am in the hand and decides to start putting out the turn. I stop him just before it is turned but the player UTG has a slight glimpse of the card. He claims it could possibly be a black ace but isnt sure but knows it is definitley black. The dealer is unsure of what to do and the tournament director is called? The tournament director tries to explain to the dealer that the card must go back into the deck and a new turn be put out. THEN the dealer goes to do it again and burns the 2nd card before Ive got a chance to act in the first place on the flop. Is this the correct ruling with the two cards exposed? seems like im being put at a distinct disadvantage in this hand. Any info/opinions would be appreciated

pretty sure when the turn is exposed the correct way to do it is to deal the River face down then reshuffle the turn card into the deck and deal the turn.

No idea what to do when 2 have been like that, reshuffle the cards and start again from the turn??

Pretty much this^^
1)Burn and turn river card face down
2)Shuffle the remaining cards
3)Put the turn face down - Card has already been burned the first time
4)Players actions

As for doing it twice, just start the process again I would say. Would be very very rare it would happen twice. It's usually a brain fart/very tired moment when a dealer does this and then we wake up again. You are not at a disadvantage because the random shuffle will sort that out for you



Funny story though..I think I have made this mistake 4 or 5 times in the few years I have been dealing. First 2 times I did it, I did it in back to back weeks.. I shuffled the deck and put out the same card that I had put the first time and Gigetheman was at the same table twice.

[premierstone]

pretty sure when the turn is exposed the correct way to do it is to deal the River face down then reshuffle the turn card into the deck and deal the turn.

No idea what to do when 2 have been like that, reshuffle the cards and start again from the turn??

Yep this is the correct ruling, the River card and next burned card are to remain as they were, as the mistake had nothing to do with them and as for the turn the card that was exposed must have an opportunity to be turned again.

[The Aul Switcharoo]

By starting again I meant just do the turn again

[drive56]

Thanks wasnt sure what had really happened as the dealer had no clue what to do. Tournament director did as you' said to do was just checking because after he made the mistake the second time I wasnt sure what had happened!

[thegreatiam]

pretty sure when the turn is exposed the correct way to do it is to deal the River face down then reshuffle the turn card into the deck and deal the turn.

Actually, while this is a popular ruling, it is not the best ruling.

The actual rule is not to put the river face down but to simply shuffle the deck,

The idea behind the rule is to save the river, so it will remain the same regardless of what happens on the turn.

what it actually does it remove the random element from the river card. At all stages it is priority to maintain deck integrity by keeping the random cards.

Example:

dealer turns the turn early and its a 6.
You have pocket 6's and there is a 6 on the flop.

with the more popular rule, the river is protected face down and the 6 is shuffled back into the deck. the dealer then re-deals the turn and it is not the same 6.
We now 100% know that it is impossible that the river can be the 6 as it was separated.

in the other rule, the dealer does not separate the river, instead he shuffles all the cards in the stub. when he re deals the turn and it is not the 6, you still have that 1 in 40 something chance to hit our case 6.

even though seems like a small difference it can have a big affect on the outcome of the way the hand plays out.

But, as in most poker rulings, the most popular rule is often the incorrect one. This makes it hard to make the right ruling in this situation as when i do i know it will cause arguments.

Generally, youre more likely to encounter the 'protect the river' rule. and its acceptable to use in most games. I happen to prefer the other one.