General Poker Thread

[eamonhonda]

Your line is terribad tbh. I'm not even sure wtf you should do now you've got here this way, I prob c/c. I don't understand why you would c/r the turn instead of the flop, but I don't understand your whole play/plan for the hand.

You have to Cbet the flop, get value from a huge amount of hands and play it from there.

I know I played it shocking wouldn't play it like that again was just interested to see what people thought

[Donkathon]

Played the €35 deepstack in the voodoo last night and witnessed one of the most lol hands I've ever seen live

Player 2 min raises to ~$1.2k & gets 1 caller (player 1)

Flop 389

P1 bets out ~$1.2k & P2 insta re-raises to ~$5.2k & get called

Turn J

P1 checks & P2 ships it for about $25k

Now player 1 tanks for about 2 minutes & has player 2 covered by about ~$10k/$15k

Then WTF he folds 107 face up

Now seriously how the fuck could anyone even contemplate player2 could have Q-10 in this stop

If he did it would have to be surely Q10 but still no way I would fold this anyway in this spot?

Btw player1 knocks me out an hour later calling off my bluff for like 80% of his stack with I think 3rd pair on the turn

Good night though

[shano_88]

Villian is a better reg. He folds to too many 3bets and his flop and turn cb are 82/60. His river cbet % is only 17%. I was planning on calling flops and turns and probably folding to a third barrel on the flop depending on run out. I decide not to raise the turn as I think he is barrelling quite a bit here and will fold to a raise. In Hindsight, I think Its probably a raise given I dont think hes going to bluff the river If he misses. River was a pretty easy bet for value and Im not expecting to get checkraised here alot. I have doublefloated him a couple of times already and taken It away from him on the river but I dont know If he was noticed this and If he has I think he would probably just fire a 3rd barrell to combat It instead of a checkraise. Anyway, Does anyone b/c river? What sort of hands would you expect Villian to turn up with here given his line? Also Vs this type of Villian would you ever just fold the flop with this hand because were expecting a turn bet most of the time.


Winamax - €0.50 NL (5 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

CO: €69.50
BTN: €119.93
SB: €72.54
Hero (BB): €49.75
UTG: €50.50

SB posts SB €0.25, Hero posts BB €0.50

Pre Flop: (pot: €0.75) Hero has T:heart: T:club:

fold, fold, fold, SB raises to €1.50, Hero calls €1.00

Flop: (€3.00, 2 players) 3:heart: K:heart: J:spade:
SB bets €2.25, Hero calls €2.25

Turn: (€7.50, 2 players) T:spade:
SB bets €5.00, Hero calls €5.00

River: (€17.50, 2 players) 4:spade:
SB checks, Hero bets €12.50, SB raises to €63.79 and is all-in,

[Hectorjelly]

You only beat a bluff, so it comes down to how often you think he is bluffing the river like this.
I think your hand is too strong to fold the flop, you also know that you will rarely face a river bet.

[shano_88]

You only beat a bluff, so it comes down to how often you think he is bluffing the river like this.
I think your hand is too strong to fold the flop, you also know that you will rarely face a river bet.

I dont really know how often he will do this as a bluff. I folded it and was pretty happy about It at the time. Would you raise the turn when your not expecting him to 3barell here with missed fds, etc.

[Hectorjelly]

Unless you raise a lot of turns I wouldn't advise raising the turn, I think it looks too strong and you will fold out worse hands.

[RoadSweeper]

Everest Poker moving to iPoker. Sad day. Was once a goldmine.

http://pokerfuse.com/news/poker-room-news/everest-move-ipoker-close-its-independent-poker-room/

[eamonhonda]

Mid stages in a MTT avg stack 11k Hero has 12k blinds 200/400 140 left 54 get paid.

Folded around to hero in MP with 88
action?

[shano1888]

Mid stages in a MTT avg stack 11k Hero has 12k blinds 200/400 140 left 54 get paid.

Folded around to hero in MP with 88
action?

Raise to 800-1000. Depends on opponents stacksize/reads etc after that.

[eamonhonda]

PokerStars Zoom No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (6 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

Button ($11)
SB ($8.97)
Hero (BB) ($8.04)
UTG ($7.64)
MP ($3.55)
CO ($1.81)

Preflop: Hero is BB with K, Q
4 folds, SB bets $0.15, Hero calls $0.10

Flop: ($0.30) Q, J, 10 (2 players)
SB bets $0.20, Hero calls $0.20

Turn: ($0.70) 5 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $0.50, SB calls $0.50

River: ($1.70) 9 (2 players)
SB checks Hero?

[Bubbleking]

PokerStars Zoom No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (6 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

Button ($11)
SB ($8.97)
Hero (BB) ($8.04)
UTG ($7.64)
MP ($3.55)
CO ($1.81)

Preflop: Hero is BB with K, Q
4 folds, SB bets $0.15, Hero calls $0.10

Flop: ($0.30) Q, J, 10 (2 players)
SB bets $0.20, Hero calls $0.20

Turn: ($0.70) 5 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $0.50, SB calls $0.50

River: ($1.70) 9 (2 players)
SB checks Hero?

bet about 1.30

Given his line I find it hard to fold to a shove

[Mike]

Not as impressive as bozzers graph but my comeback to poker is going well this month (.50/1 speed on stars, 9 seater)

SPOILER

[Caf]

WCOOP-02 mega sat turbo

Hero is 87/280. 196 places paid, 195 tickets and $55 for 196th. Avg is 22k. 32k will be the avg with 195 players left.


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, 11 Tournament, 1500/3000 Blinds 300 Ante (8 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

saw flop | saw showdown

Button (t44737)
Hero (SB) (t25225)
BB (t30751)
UTG (t5321)
UTG+1 (t25902)
MP1 (t22879)
MP2 (t6667)
CO (t16067)

Hero's M: 3.66

Preflop: Hero is SB with 4, 9
6 folds, Hero?

[FeetMagic]

I fold 100% of the time...

[Guest]

Charts say shove atc regardless of villain.

[Caf]

I thought it was pretty close tbh. This chart that you're working off, is it for sats? Ranges have to change from normal MTTs with the dynamics involved surely?

We're at a stage where our seat is close to a lock, but not gtd yet. With such a low avg stack my thoughts were that villain, with an above avg stack, would need a fairly tight range to make the call so shoving atc is a must here as it essentially locks up a ticket the times we get it through. I also thought, with the low avg, that we need to take every open shove we can BvB since it's rarely folded around to us to do so.

What would be your calling range be in the BB here? I know what mine is but I'm more than likely too tight in that spot.

FWIW I did shove, villain tank folded and I folded my way to a ticket.

[Guest]

I think it's too early for sat dynamics to be relevant. You've only enough chips for 4 orbits and there's still 85 to be knocked out, I don't see how you're close to a lock.

My calling range would be roughly 22+, Ax, K5s+, K9o+, QTo+, Q8s+, JTs against someone who I thought was shoving as wide as a good reg should be.

[Flushdraw]

I thought it was pretty close tbh. This chart that you're working off, is it for sats? Ranges have to change from normal MTTs with the dynamics involved surely?

We're at a stage where our seat is close to a lock, but not gtd yet. With such a low avg stack my thoughts were that villain, with an above avg stack, would need a fairly tight range to make the call so shoving atc is a must here as it essentially locks up a ticket the times we get it through. I also thought, with the low avg, that we need to take every open shove we can BvB since it's rarely folded around to us to do so.

What would be your calling range be in the BB here? I know what mine is but I'm more than likely too tight in that spot.

FWIW I did shove, villain tank folded and I folded my way to a ticket.

I seriously doubt that you're too tight if you were in the BB in this situation. If you're playing 25k and are 87th, then he's probably ~70th with 30k and has no need at all to call your shove, and can comfortably get a ticket by stealing blinds himself. I'm clueless with ICM (which i need to work on) but if his calling range is QQ+, then you can shove any 2. If you think he calls wider, then i wouldn't be shoving too wide. I'd be more inclined to fold if the BB was an idiot.

If this was an MTT, then his range for calling your shove (knowing nothing about him) could be something like A2+, K10+, 22+ but that would be suicide in this sat. I'm happy to shove there almost every single time.

[Flushdraw]

I think it's too early for sat dynamics to be relevant. You've only enough chips for 4 orbits and there's still 85 to be knocked out, I don't see how you're close to a lock.

My calling range would be roughly 22+, Ax, K5s+, K9o+, QTo+, Q8s+, JTs against someone who I thought was shoving as wide as a good reg should be.

That's madness Zu. I wouldn't even be calling anywhere near as wide to that in a normal MTT. Calling with those hands in a sat is just spewing chips away

[Guest]

That's madness Zu. I wouldn't even be calling anywhere near as wide to that in a normal MTT. Calling with those hands in a sat is just spewing chips away

Not according to the maths

[Flushdraw]

Not according to the maths

Which maths? Definetly 100% not for satellites.

That range you laid out is roughly a 30% range.

Just had a scan and saw this which is sort of relevant, but caf is never shoving 100% of the time in a normal MTT here, and anyone calling 30% in the BB will never be a winning player in sats because most people don't shove wide enough to make calling this wide profitable. We need to finish 195th, not amass chips to finish any higher than that.

100% is good against most calling ranges honestly.
(Even wider if the antes are more than 10% of the BB )

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...Wc&output=html

I just put in a 12bb stack with 9 players at the table.
Assume we shove 100% of hands, and the villain calls with 30% of hands. We have 38.737% equity vs 30% of hands.. We increase our stack by 9.57% on average each time we shove. It's a easy shove with ATC.


EDIT: I just put in 32o vs 30% of hands.. We have 29.973% equity vs that 30% calling range. It's still a +EV play with 32o.(+0.45 bb) (3.78% increase by shoving)

I believe this is what they call an unexploitable shove. If we shove 100%, and they call 100%, we have 50% equity. It's +EV to shove.. +1.2 bb per shove which is a 10% increase in our stack.

EDIT 2: On the opposite side of that spectrum, if he only calls with AA, it's a huge +EV shove. EV: +2.35 bb

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/23/small-stakes-mtt/quick-sb-shove-range-vs-bb-12bb-1226174/

[Guest]

Well I plugged in a shoving range of

22+,A2s+,K2s+,Q6s+,J8s+,T8s+,97s+,87s,A2o+,K8o+,QT o+,JTo,T9o

for the SB and it spewed out a calling range close to that from my earlier post. We need 42% equity to call and K6o has 42.6%.

I'll admit I have little to no experience with sats, but with 280 left and a 10bb stack with antes I think it still plays like a straight MTT. In a normal MTT, shoving 100% of hands there is unexploitably profitable.

[Flushdraw]

Well I plugged in a shoving range of

22+,A2s+,K2s+,Q6s+,J8s+,T8s+,97s+,87s,A2o+,K8o+,QT o+,JTo,T9o

for the SB and it spewed out a calling range close to that from my earlier post. We need 42% equity to call and K6o has 42.6%.

I'll admit I have little to no experience with sats, but with 280 left and a 10bb stack with antes I think it still plays like a straight MTT. In a normal MTT, shoving 100% of hands there is unexploitably profitable.

We're 70/280. We need to finish in the top 195 to win. We don't need another 30k chips, but losing 25k will almost certainly kill our chances. Normal equity calling ranges don't add up in this scenario. It's plenty late enough to play it like a satellite.

Assuming it's an $11 FO, then there's $41980 in the prizepool so 3816 players entered and we're down to the last 280 so we're well into the final stages

[Guest]

Assuming it's an $11 FO, then there's $41980 in the prizepool so 3816 players entered and we're down to the last 280 so we're well into the final stages

Hmm, when you put it like that it sounds different! I still think because we're so short and the average is so short that things can change very quickly and we need to be attacking. If you stay quiet for a single orbit you could drop well below average.

[Flushdraw]

Hmm, when you put it like that it sounds different! I still think because we're so short and the average is so short that things can change very quickly and we need to be attacking. If you stay quiet for a single orbit you could drop well below average.

A general guide line i use, and to take Caf as an example.

He's 87/280 with 195 paid

He needs 85 players to bust, so everyone from 1-110 is just inside the cutoff at the moment. If obviously varies with shortstacks in blinds, doubling up etc, so adjust it by 20% again so 1-88 are in the fold to a ticket bracket. They don't need to take any unnecessary gambles unless things change drastically when it gets closer to the bubble. Caf could probably fold to a ticket as it is, but he's right on the cusp so i like his shove but would hate any of these guys to call any shoves light for a large % of their stacks

[ghostface]

Quick one here, can't find my hand histories on my comp

74 left and 73 paid, hero about 55/74. Blinds 500/1000 100 ante

utg+1 65k (opening and reraising most hands, playing stack well on bubble) utg+2 55k (loose enough player), sb 14k, bb (hero) 18k

UTG+1 opens to 2150, UTG+2 flats as does the sb. Hero has 99.... shove alright here?

Stakes are only small if that makes a difference

[FeetMagic]

Ya definitely ship!

[sheehoni]

Playing a live sat last night for Summer Sizzler, 11 left with 8 tickets guranteed, was shortstacked and went all in small blind with 10 7 clubs, got called by 10 9.
Flop comes 9, 4, x all clubs, 4 on the turn and 4 on the river.

[KK82]

Just played this hand in the Big 55.. Should I always be 3 betting here? If so, is my sizing ok? Does anyone call the shoves?


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, 55 Tournament, 50/100 Blinds 10 Ante (9 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

UTG (t3890)
UTG+1 (t6473)
MP1 (t2015)
MP2 (t3678)
MP3 (t1391)
CO (t6793)
Button (t1924)
Hero (SB) (t3874)
BB (t2400)

Hero's M: 16.14

Preflop: Hero is SB with Q, Q
UTG bets t215, UTG+1 calls t215, 5 folds, Hero raises to t777, 1 fold, UTG raises to t3880 (All-In), UTG+1 raises to t6463 (All-In), 1 fold

Flop: (t8727) 6, J, 4 (2 players, 2 all-in)

Turn: (t8727) K (2 players, 2 all-in)

River: (t8727) 8 (2 players, 2 all-in)

Total pot: t8727

Also, is it bad to 3 bet such a strong hand if I'm folding. I would have called the first shove FWIW.

[Hectorjelly]

You played it fine, it's rare that the first caller will do anything but fold. Once he gets involved it changes everything.

[Hectorjelly]

Very quick question, rest of the hand doesn't really matter.

I check call the turn against a fish with pair and flush draw

River I get there, I have a 9 hi flush. The j and Q of my suit are also out.

Pot is 40, Effective stack 300 Board is Q 7 J 9 4 - I have 8 9

I check, villain bets 100.

Fold, Call or Shove?

Never seen villain overbet before. Don't know him very well

Here are my notes in their entirety
bad poker player
3bet Q9s IP
6bb raise with QA

[Winning!]

Very quick question, rest of the hand doesn't really matter.

I check call the turn against a fish with pair and flush draw

River I get there, I have a 9 hi flush. The j and Q of my suit are also out.

Pot is 40, Effective stack 300 Board is Q 7 J 9 4 - I have 8 9

I check, villain bets 100.

Fold, Call or Shove?

Never seen villain overbet before. Don't know him very well

Here are my notes in their entirety
bad poker player
3bet Q9s IP
6bb raise with QA

His range is polarized with a lot more flush than set/straight combos, some of which may even find a fold if we jam. Calling seems fairly clearly best

[Hectorjelly]

His range is polarized with a lot more flush than set/straight combos, some of which may even find a fold if we jam. Calling seems fairly clearly best

Surely there comes a point though where a player is bad enough that we can jam profitably? I was actually planning on check raising a normal bet, but the huge overbet threw me - there's a lot of players I'd happily fold against here, but I called. He has 8To for the 2nd best straight.

We beat quite a lot of flushes, and I doubt he ever folds one to a jam.

[Winning!]

Pre and flop are kinda important for gauging the width of his value range there but in general I don't expect many worse flush combos since they kinda have to be connected, maybe one gap max.whereas there's gonna be a lot more Ax/Kxss combos. I expect sets and straights to bet less too since we call with worse so rarely. Guy is clearly a special case but without that knowledge originally shoving seems meh

[Hectorjelly]

Pre and flop are kinda important for gauging the width of his value range there but in general I don't expect many worse flush combos since they kinda have to be connected, maybe one gap max.whereas there's gonna be a lot more Ax/Kxss combos. I expect sets and straights to bet less too since we call with worse so rarely. Guy is clearly a special case but without that knowledge originally shoving seems meh

Yeah I might be reading too much into it because of what he turned up with, my note Bad Poker Player might have tipped me off though - I doubt he even noticed the flush

[eamonhonda]

Advice on all streets

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, 4.4 Tournament, 50/100 Blinds 10 Ante (8 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

MP2 (t7712)
CO (t1306)
Button (t2802)
SB (t3252)
Hero (BB) (t8808)
UTG (t10055)
UTG+1 (t12516)
MP1 (t4920)

Hero's M: 38.30

Preflop: Hero is BB with J, J
1 fold, UTG+1 bets t200, 1 fold, MP2 calls t200, 3 folds, Hero raises to t488, UTG+1 calls t288, MP2 calls t288

Flop: (t1594) 8, 7, 7 (3 players)
Hero bets t999, UTG+1 calls t999, MP2 calls t999

Turn: (t4591) 8 (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets t1100, MP2 calls t1100, Hero calls t1100

River: (t7891) 2 (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets t2100, MP2 raises to t5115 (All-In), Hero folds, UTG+1 calls t3015

Total pot: t18121

[Bozzer]

Your sizing pre is really small. It's gonna be 3way on the flop a ton with that sizing, which sucks when you have JJ oop. Make it $800 or so. The decision to sqz depends on how wide utg+1 is opening.

Flop is fine. I would just fold turn - at least 1 player has a boat there way too often to peel.

[Dice75]

Cash game 1-2
Straddle €5 with 1 caller (I think)

Player to your right lifts his cards up so visible to me (KJs) & makes it €50

I have A2o (€150)

Do you say anything / whats your move?

[Guest]

Cash game 1-2
Straddle €5 with 1 caller (I think)

Player to your right lifts his cards up so visible to me (KJs) & makes it €50

I have A2o (€150)

Do you say anything / whats your move?

Just fold like you normally would and tell him to cover his hand.



If your still steaming from an expensive round of Desperados id shove

[eamonhonda]

With nothing in the pot I fold as you would normally would to the bet and let the guy know about your honest deed

[sligoboi]

Cash game 1-2
Straddle €5 with 1 caller (I think)

Player to your right lifts his cards up so visible to me (KJs) & makes it €50

I have A2o (€150)

Do you say anything / whats your move?

Warn him you've seen his cards and to be more careful in future..If it happens again tell him again..after that it's open season...

[AKDonk]

Just fold like you normally would and tell him to cover his hand.



If your still steaming from an expensive round of Desperados id shove

With nothing in the pot I fold as you would normally would to the bet and let the guy know about your honest deed

This particular player had been told numerous times before about covering his hand, and at least once while i was sitting at the table.

Nothing wrong with taking advantage here. Surprised nobody else overshoved as it was clear once his hand was tabled what was happening imo.

[eamonhonda]

This particular player had been told numerous times before about covering his hand, and at least once while i was sitting at the table.

Nothing wrong with taking advantage here. Surprised nobody else overshoved.

changes situation then. time to take advantage

[Dice75]

Just fold like you normally would and tell him to cover his hand.



If your still steaming from an expensive round of Desperados id shove

Now here Mick, you've played cash with me before. For shame.

[40something]

Whisper in his ear that you saw his cards

Then shove

[peterswellman]

Surely if you're going to take advantage, do it right and call? We know his hand we can play perfectly against him rather than just taking a 60/40?

[Dice75]

Surely if you're going to take advantage, do it right and call? We know his hand we can play perfectly against him rather than just taking a 60/40?

Few loose cannons with big stacks behind. Rather shove & look strong.


Anyhow, announced to dealer that I'd seen his hand. Dealer calls floor. As he calls floor I shove. Floor asks me what cards were, verifys this and turns the KJ over so I'm not holding an advantage against anyone else at the table ( I knew this would be the case).
Few disgruntled folds and the KJ calls.

[DeadParrot]

Dice flips good

[warnsie]

Loads of mistakes

very active player only at table 2/3 orbits, playing most hands and opening/3betting/4 betting light. Both biggest stacks at table v early in tournament.


1. limp utg and call raise, 1st mistake oop? Or is this ok with k9s vs serial raiser pf?
2. my c/raise on flop wrong? his flop min raise cafuffled me. c/c and reassess turn instead?
3. prob a ton of other mistakes too

Cheers for the feedback

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, 3.3 Tournament, 40/80 Blinds (6 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

BB (t3294)
Hero (UTG) (t11617)
MP (t4650)
CO (t17958)
Button (t1820)
SB (t3296)

Hero's M: 96.81

Preflop: Hero is UTG with 9, K
Hero calls t80, 1 fold, CO bets t240, Button calls t240, 2 folds, Hero calls t160

Flop: (t840) 9, A, K (3 players)
Hero checks, CO bets t160, 1 fold, Hero raises to t519, CO raises to t1038, Hero calls t519

Turn: (t2916) 2 (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets t1680, Hero calls t1680

River: (t6276) J (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets t15000 (All-In), Hero folds

Total pot: t6276

[Caf]

What do you do pre-flop with aces in the same spot? Limp?

[Hectorjelly]

Do you mainly play limit?

Firstly I'd never open limp pre
K9s is definitely a fold utg
Calling the raise oop is - EV


Post flop is ok, flop 3bet is pretty thin, especially since you clearly don't know what to do if he plays back at you. When check raising the pot will get very big very quickly, so its easiest to polarise your range so that its easy for you to know what to do. Check raising bottom two on a dry board is tricky as you kind of over represent your hand.

[Hectorjelly]

2 Limpers, Cutoff raises. I 3bet on button with Q9 spades. Everyone folds and the cutoff calls. The flop is 938, 3 and 8 of spades. Cutoff donk pots the flop. The effective stack is exactly 1 buyin once he bets the flop. Call, fold, shove, minraise?

Edit: No notes on player, doesn't seem great.

[shano1888]

Id shove anyway. Might get him to fold out a9, 10s or similar which might make sense given preflop action. You will obv be live if he snaps with an overpair or set etc. Im not folding v a random and im not flating given our aggressive line pre.

[shano_88]

Im not folding anyway. Is there a psb left If you just call the flop?

[shano_88]

Id shove anyway. Might get him to fold out a9, 10s or similar which might make sense given preflop action. You will obv be live if he snaps with an overpair or set etc. Im not folding v a random and im not flating given our aggressive line pre.

Villian is never folding A9 or 1010 here Id imagine. I wouldnt be shoving trying to get him to fold them anyway.

[shano1888]

Villian is never folding A9 or 1010 here Id imagine. I wouldnt be shoving trying to get him to fold them anyway.

Ya probably not. Id still prefer shoving. Dont like the idea of having to decide wether to call it off if he jams the turn when it comes red paint.

[Caf]

We've 3b, got top pair and a FD, get it in.

Haven't a clue what the stacks are or what you mean by 'exactly one buy in' as an effective stack.

Just realised that it's probably cash and we have 100bb behind, carry on.

[Marsden02]

Shano and shano, thought you were talking to yourself, confusing with a few beers in.

[shano1888]

Shano and shano, thought you were talking to yourself, confusing with a few beers in.

I set up the acc with too many beers in. Will change it at somestage/ when i figure out how. Re the hand, what caf said.

[Hectorjelly]

I did shove, but I immediately regretted it. I think call and get it in on the turn is much better.

There are two benefits to shoving. He can fold better, and I protect my equity. (Eg AK doesn't draw out on me)

I really doubt he ever folds better, I never expect anyone at low stakes to fold TT here given how they play it.

But the big benefit to calling is that I induce more bluffs, or bets from worse hands. He may just shove any pair all in on the turn, hoping I have AQ/K

Also there are a tonne of cards that make him a second best hand. Any Q or spade might give him a pair but he a better hand.