General Poker Thread

[jimbling]

Anyway, back to the hand.

I called and he had KK.

[jimbling]

Line Check

Quick line check.
Only have 135 hands on villain. playing 33/26/3.6. Aggr on flop is 6.0.

Is my shove the right play? I don't think I'm getting called by worse... but even if I call, I cant see him putting in more chips without me beat.


No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (4 handed) - Hold'em Manager Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

SB ($359.60)
Hero (BB) ($104.40)
UTG ($91.25)
Button ($107.25)

Preflop: Hero is BB with K, 3
2 folds, SB bets $2.50, Hero calls $2

Flop: ($6) K, 9, K (2 players)
SB bets $4.50, Hero raises $16, SB raises $30.50, Hero raises $85.40 (All-In), 1 fold

Total pot: $76

[jimbling]

Value call.....

This okay?
Villain is 30/24/2.6 over 1.2k hands. He's a loser over that small sample.
PFR on button is 60%. Fold to 3b is 37%
Fold to CB in 3b pot is 38%.
Aggr is 3.9 on the River.

No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (5 handed) - Hold'em Manager Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

SB ($61.20)
Hero (BB) ($100)
UTG ($100)
MP ($91.10)
Button ($192.35)

Preflop: Hero is BB with J, J
2 folds, Button bets $2.50, 1 fold, Hero raises $7, Button calls $5.50

Flop: ($16.50) 5, 5, Q (2 players)
Hero bets $9, Button calls $9

Turn: ($34.50) 3 (2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets $17, Hero calls $17

River: ($68.50) 8 (2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets $68.50, Hero calls $66 (All-In)

Total pot: $200.50

[Line Us]

I'd probably check call the flop there, not much value to be had in betting and he'll bet his air a decent ammount id say. I'd make it about 9 pre too, he doesnt fold to many 3bets and its going to be easier to get stacks in post. I'd have folded the river as played, he'd have to be pretty spewy to shove the river here.

[jimbling]

I'd probably check call the flop there, not much value to be had in betting and he'll bet his air a decent ammount id say. I'd make it about 9 pre too, he doesnt fold to many 3bets and its going to be easier to get stacks in post. I'd have folded the river as played, he'd have to be pretty spewy to shove the river here.

Why is there not much value to be had? His fold to CB in 3b pot is very low...... especially for someone who calls a lot of 3bets. So he's going to call with worse. I can see the point of trying to keep the pot smaller, but there's definitely value there.

With regards the river call.
His aggression picks up towards the river.....
Flop: 2.1
Turn: 2.2
River: 3.9

Those sort of stats tell me that he tries to steal a lot of rivers.
And in general, river pot bets / overbets are 95% either the nuts or bluff. (when pot is big)

So what nuts can he have?
(Oh, btw, another stat I should have put in there is his 4bet is 17%. I think that pretty much rules out QQ)

The only hand I can see in his range that pot bets that river is something with a 5 in it.
There are lots of 5s in his range all right. But I figured there was as many, if not more bluffs.

[Line Us]

I just think your never going to get 3 streets from worse on that board, this guy is aggro and has lots of air in his range, better to check the flop and leave him bluff than cbet i think, more value to be had. You could bet for protection, but I prefer to check call. I wouldnt think he's gonna float this flop too often though and then bluff off the turn and river with pure air. If thats the case then you can take the same line with AK,Qx and any pocket pair as there all bascially the same thing by the river. I just think you'll see him turn up with Qx too often for this to be a profitable river call. I cant see many 5x hands in his range either, A5s maybe, definitely only a small part of his range, he's going to be flatting and playing way more Qx's like this.

I'd also disagree about the river bet size, he's gonna bet pot here with his whole range, you've only 66 behind, also once you call the turn your more than likely calling the river. Looks like a pure value bet to me anyway. If he turned up with air here or a badly played 99/1010 then I'd stick him on the buddy list, take a note and 3bet him for value/ call him down light all day.

[jimbling]

I just think your never going to get 3 streets from worse on that board, this guy is aggro and has lots of air in his range, better to check the flop and leave him bluff than cbet i think, more value to be had. You could bet for protection, but I prefer to check call. I wouldnt think he's gonna float this flop too often though and then bluff off the turn and river with pure air. If thats the case then you can take the same line with AK,Qx and any pocket pair as there all bascially the same thing by the river. I just think you'll see him turn up with Qx too often for this to be a profitable river call. I cant see many 5x hands in his range either, A5s maybe, definitely only a small part of his range, he's going to be flatting and playing way more Qx's like this.

I'd also disagree about the river bet size, he's gonna bet pot here with his whole range, you've only 66 behind, also once you call the turn your more than likely calling the river. Looks like a pure value bet to me anyway. If he turned up with air here or a badly played 99/1010 then I'd stick him on the buddy list, take a note and 3bet him for value/ call him down light all day.

Hmmm, I'll wait to see what others reckon on the river call. I dont see Qx in his shoving range much on the river at all.
Not sure why you can't see more 5x hands either? A5s and 56s definitely in his range. Maybe even 57s and 58s. I'm far more worried about a 5 than a Q anyway.


I agree with your points on the flop bet all right.

[colquhom]

Quick line check.
Only have 135 hands on villain. playing 33/26/3.6. Aggr on flop is 6.0.

Is my shove the right play? I don't think I'm getting called by worse... but even if I call, I cant see him putting in more chips without me beat.


No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (4 handed) - Hold'em Manager Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

SB ($359.60)
Hero (BB) ($104.40)
UTG ($91.25)
Button ($107.25)

Preflop: Hero is BB with K, 3
2 folds, SB bets $2.50, Hero calls $2

Flop: ($6) K, 9, K (2 players)
SB bets $4.50, Hero raises $16, SB raises $30.50, Hero raises $85.40 (All-In), 1 fold

Total pot: $76

I don't think you should raise the flop. Shove as played I suppose.

[Line Us]

Not sure why you can't see more 5x hands either? A5s and 56s definitely in his range. Maybe even 57s and 58s. I'm far more worried about a 5 than a Q anyway.

A5s and 56s is 4 combos of hands, dont see how you can think thats a large part of his range, he'll very rarely turn up with those. He can have way more qx combos( cant be bothered working out how many exactly), AQ,KQ,QJ and Q10 and these will be offsuit and suited. I'd say it would be pretty standard for him to shove any Q on the river too, why wouldnt he? Your hand is pretty face up as a pocket pair/AK.

[jimbling]

A5s and 56s is 4 combos of hands, dont see how you can think thats a large part of his range, he'll very rarely turn up with those. He can have way more qx combos( cant be bothered working out how many exactly), AQ,KQ,QJ and Q10 and these will be offsuit and suited. I'd say it would be pretty standard for him to shove any Q on the river too, why wouldnt he? Your hand is pretty face up as a pocket pair/AK.

lol, I know there is more actual combos of Qx, just not ones I would have put in his range.


What games do you play? I dont ever see people river shoving 60bbs with mediocre holdings the way this hand has played out. Maybe AQ, most others would put a small value bet or just check back.

[jimbling]

I don't think you should raise the flop.

Why not?

[colquhom]

Why not?

I was kinda torn when I wrote that and I suppose I could be convinced otherwise but I think you'll rarely get it in against worse if you get it in on the flop (I'd obv go ahead and raise like kj+ i suppose). I think you'll prob make more money just snapping off 3 barrels coz you've such a weak kicker. I think you kinda overrep your hand almost. He looks pretty aggro too so he may try to barrel you off 9x, fds and pairs i suppose.

Although, since its blind on blind he may not fold 9x+ if you have a dynamic or spazz like he did.

[digiman]

Kinda sick spot!!

So its my last orbit at the tables for the evening. I am up $175 after about 700 hands and would be happy enough with this result. FWIW I do think booking wins is important!!!

This hand pops up.

£1/£2 No Limit Holdem
5 Players
Hand Conversion Powered by weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG (£206)
CO (£18.85)
BTN (£200)
SB (£131.95)
Hero (£200)

Pre-Flop: (£3, 5 players) Hero is BB 8:spade: 10:spade:
UTG raises to £7, CO calls £7, 2 folds, Hero calls £5

Flop: 3:diamond: Q:spade: J:spade: (£22, 3 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets £199, CO calls £11.85, £193 to Hero ($193)?

UTG is a decent player, plays a lot of HU and is pretty loose in 6max games. He has owned me a few times in HU but we don't play much, I certainly don't go looking to play him either in my buddy list!!

Who gambles here???

[TommyGunne]

I'd snap fold that preflop and I definitely fold now.

[BobSloane]

You need 46% to call. You can easily assign him a range to give you 46% but in reality your equity is almost always going to be just flipping or in bad shape against his better flush draws. On the other hand you you crush 6s4s,6s5s,6s7s and 5s7sand 7s9s..although they're probably not even be in his utg raising range that often. Calling off a giant overbet when you are hoping you are flipping so that your call can be +ev by like $1 or something sucks. Especially when you're trying to book a win!

[digiman]

I'd snap fold that preflop and I definitely fold now.

I probably call here preflop a bit to much but the game is 5 handed and hes pretty loose. Can't be that much of a snap preflop?

I folded to his shove, he said afterwards that he didn't realise it was 3 handed!!! He had AcTc, shortie had As5s. Board blanked out, good fold imo! I know had I of being down in the session I would probably have snapped this though

[BobSloane]

You need 46% ...... hoping you are flipping so that your call can be +ev by like $1 or something ...

He had AcTc

oard: Qs Js 3d
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 53.485% 52.73% 00.76% 522 7.50 { Ts8s }
Hand 1: 46.515% 45.76% 00.76% 453 7.50 { AcTc }


lol

[BobSloane]

Lol I lolled because i thought your hand was 46.5% Got to stop drinking on mondays. I still fold though

[gorrrr72]

I probably call here preflop a bit to much but the game is 5 handed and hes pretty loose. Can't be that much of a snap preflop?

I folded to his shove, he said afterwards that he didn't realise it was 3 handed!!! He had AcTc, shortie had As5s. Board blanked out, good fold imo! I know had I of being down in the session I would probably have snapped this though

You should work on this imho

[jimbling]

I was kinda torn when I wrote that and I suppose I could be convinced otherwise but I think you'll rarely get it in against worse if you get it in on the flop (I'd obv go ahead and raise like kj+ i suppose). I think you'll prob make more money just snapping off 3 barrels coz you've such a weak kicker. I think you kinda overrep your hand almost. He looks pretty aggro too so he may try to barrel you off 9x, fds and pairs i suppose.

Although, since its blind on blind he may not fold 9x+ if you have a dynamic or spazz like he did.

I think the last sentence is key. People are far more likely to not believe you in a blind on blind battle, and are much more likely to spaz out (as can be seen in this thread.... he 3bet folded me).

I don't think he would 3 barrel anything but a k into me either, so I thought the best way to get chips in strong was to raise the flop.

[jimbling]

Dont have too many hand histories on Villain.... but I do have a note which states "if calls pre, doesn't like to fold post.... don't bluff him unless willing to triple barrel"

No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (5 handed) - Hold'em Manager Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

SB ($125.05)
BB ($65.15)
UTG ($34.85)
MP ($221.85)
Hero (Button) ($99.50)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 5, A
2 folds, Hero bets $3, SB calls $2.50, 1 fold

Flop: ($7) 3, 4, 2 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $5, SB calls $5

Turn: ($17) 7 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $13, SB calls $13

River: ($43) K (2 players)
SB bets $35, Hero calls $35

Total pot: $113

Is river a call or fold?
btw, with the small amount of hands I have his river aggr is only 1.0.
I'm either way behind or way ahead.

[BobSloane]

I wouldn't consider folding river and imo your decision is whether to jam or call. Btw on the river you are (almost)always way ahead or way behind

[Denny Crane]

i'd jam

[jimbling]

Wow.... ye guys are nuts

I just called. He had Qc9c.


Now, at the time of the hand I couldn't figure him for a flush much... unless it was 3c4c or something, but surely he would have raised the turn if it was that. 56s for the better straight was a part of his range too.
But all in all, I thought I had to call.

After thinking about the hand later I figured that perhaps this might be seen as a poor call by ye guys so I thought I'd post it to see.

I had never even considered jamming. Why would you jam when you are either way ahead way behind???

[jimbling]

I'm struggling at the moment.

I'm not running below EV, just getting creamed. Every time I double barrel with air I get called, every time I do it with a hand they fold. Lost 3 buy ins yesterday with a flopped set and one with flopped Q high flush vs flopped nut flush. Twice I lost a full buy in with AA in a 3b pot vs set* (do people ever fold overpair in a non paired, no draw board against relatively unknown?)
Went on a 13BI downswing in the last two days. And I'm constantly getting to showdown with a slightly worse hand.
I know it's just variance, but my bad variance is always worse than my good variance. It appears I am just not good at the game

[jimbling]

btw, I know preflop is a bit loose, but I thought CO was going to just call the raise.

So, I pretty much got the flop I was looking for..... but BTNs call makes me think set immediately.... does everyone still shove?

$0.50/$1 No Limit Holdem
OnGame
4 Players
Hand Conversion Powered by weaktight.com

Stacks:
CO ($99.50)
BTN ($98.50)
Hero ($141.70)
BB ($104.10)

Pre-Flop: ($1.50, 4 players) Hero is SB A:club: J:club:
CO calls $1, BTN raises to $4, Hero calls $3.50, 1 fold, CO raises to $7, BTN calls $3, Hero calls $3

Flop: 9:diamond: 5:club: 3:club: ($22, 3 players)
Hero checks, CO bets $22, BTN calls $22, Hero goes all-in $134.70, CO calls $70.50, BTN calls $69.50

[Emmet]

Have had a pretty awful end to what looked like it could be a decent month of poker.

Starting to question myself a lot, please someone tell me this is beyond standard before my head explodes.

No-Limit Hold'em, $0.20 BB (6 handed) - Hold'em Manager Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

SB ($20.40)
BB ($37.84)
UTG ($20.30)
MP ($20)
CO ($21.73)
Hero (Button) ($22.57)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 8, 8
2 folds, CO bets $0.70, Hero calls $0.70, 1 fold, BB calls $0.50

Flop: ($2.20) 4, 4, 9 (3 players)
BB checks, CO checks, Hero bets $1.65, 1 fold, CO calls $1.65

Turn: ($5.50) Q (2 players)
CO checks, Hero checks

River: ($5.50) K (2 players)
CO bets $5, Hero folds

Total pot: $5.50

Results:
CO didn't show
Outcome: CO won $10.23

[Caf]

Starting to question myself a lot, please someone tell me this is beyond standard before my head explodes.

Should you bet the turn to check most dodgy rivers if it gets there? I know you play more cash than me but just throwing it out there before your head explodes.

[Emmet]

CO was playing 20/16 and hadn't got out of line.

I bet flop as I more than likely have the best hand now, and would like to fold his overcards.

I had a hard time trying to give him a range that opens, but Check calls the flop. And I guess that really confused me, meaning I was probably folding the turn if he lead, and definitely the river.

Basically, I didn't know where I was at, so didn't want to commit any more chips to the pot.

[TommyGunne]

That seems fine to me emmet. With reads I guess you can call against some guys and expect to see pairs smaller than yours that are now bluffing and missed fds that he didn't cbet (especially with that betsizing), but its a pretty standard fold.

[jimbling]

I can't deal with this anymore.

Right, now down nearly 20 BIs in a week. I am getting savaged. I'm not tilting, just losing.

This is a typical hand from a session, this happens a few times every single time.

This is super standard right? I have to shove river?

No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (4 handed) - Hold'em Manager Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

SB ($133)
Hero (BB) ($116.05)
UTG ($105.20)
Button ($136.90)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q, J
UTG bets $3.50, 2 folds, Hero calls $2.50

Flop: ($7.50) 7, J, J (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets $5.50, Hero raises $18, UTG calls $12.50

Turn: ($43.50) 2 (2 players)
Hero bets $30, UTG calls $30

River: ($103.50) A (2 players)
Hero bets $64.55 (All-In), UTG calls $53.70 (All-In)

Total pot: $210.90

Results:
Hero had Q, J (three of a kind, Jacks).
UTG had 7, 10 (flush, Ace high).
Outcome: UTG won $208.90

[Emmet]

Tell me about me

[TommyGunne]

Your ft3b is very low.

Your wtsd would be considered high, but you've highish WWSF and W$SD so all is good.

Your turn ftcb is very low.

Your fold cbet to raise looks really low.

[Emmet]

Your ft3b is very low.

Your wtsd would be considered high, but you've highish WWSF and W$SD so all is good.

Your turn ftcb is very low.

Your fold cbet to raise looks really low.

Delighted to hear all that!

All leaks I have identified in recent weeks and have tried to eliminate them. Need a magnifying glass over the fold button tbh, but have gotten better.

Cheers Conor

[Sledgejammer]

Your VPIP in the SB is also way too high, you should be a total nit there. I also think you should try 3 betting alot more in position than out, it's alot more proftable

[AndyFatBastard]

In your last stats post I did suggest that you steal from the SB more, but 46%?

[Moneymaker]

This is super standard right? I have to shove river?

Yes, ul.

[Emmet]

http://weaktight.com/2371849

getting a lot of abuse for folding here in my "micro study group".

Villain is a 13/12 rock (400 datamined hands), 3bet of 3% and squeeze of 5% over that sample.

With player behind, and his 3bet size being so big, I'm happy to let this go. Am I nuts?

[TommyGunne]

His 3bet size is pretty standard. Loads of people use that size.

I'd definitely call anyway, the guy in the middle means you can call QQ and JJ at the least I think.

[Emmet]

Are we c/f all A and K hi flops? I can't see how we're getting any value here unless we hit our set?

[Teddie]

I've been mixing in donkaments with cash lately and I suck horribly at them I think. Any know of any good articles or free videos? I've read HOH Vol II but I seem to struggle whenever I have an orange M and I usually end up busting out from there. Is it it just a case of playing more and posting more hands? Like a starting hand guide, is there one for tournaments for the different Ms? i.e what to do with 4's in EP when your M is 14 etc?

[AndyFatBastard]

What hands do people use to 3bet bluff with? I keep seeing everyone say you should 3bet more from the button, but I can't see how to 3bet more without adding in "problem hands" to my 3betting range, something I'm very reluctant to do, given how often 3bets are called at my level. This leaves me with 3bet bluffing more. What's a good hand to do it with?

At present I'm using suited bullshit hands like Q9s and J7s. The sort of hand I can easily get away from and can occasionally flop the nuts or a big draw when my 3bet is called. Good idea/Bad idea?

[TommyGunne]

Small connectors, small suited gappers, maybe stuff like K5s or the likes, A2-A5s if you feel like you can't call them profitably. I guess the ones you mention are OK, but for some reason I'd never even consider Q9. Like J8s would be better than J7s obv, and you're prob not able to call either of them.

[Laois Hammer]

What hands do people use to 3bet bluff with? I keep seeing everyone say you should 3bet more from the button, but I can't see how to 3bet more without adding in "problem hands" to my 3betting range, something I'm very reluctant to do, given how often 3bets are called at my level. This leaves me with 3bet bluffing more. What's a good hand to do it with?

At present I'm using suited bullshit hands like Q9s and J7s. The sort of hand I can easily get away from and can occasionally flop the nuts or a big draw when my 3bet is called. Good idea/Bad idea?

wat works for me is pure air or big hands. Im flatting with hands like Q9s that i want to see a flop with.

You shouldnt be looking for a '3 betting hand' its a '3 betting spot' that it needs to be.

[Emmet]

RedJoker's 3bet video on leggo is pretty perfect in my esteemed opinion.

Well worth a look Andy.

[AndyFatBastard]

wat works for me is pure air or big hands. Im flatting with hands like Q9s that i want to see a flop with.

You shouldnt be looking for a '3 betting hand' its a '3 betting spot' that it needs to be.

Well I'm playing Rush poker, so if I have air OTB I've already hit Auto Fold long before it gets to me. It needs to be a hand that I would open if folded to me, know what I mean? Also, Q9s is an auto fold even to a cutoff open.

[TommyGunne]

wat works for me is pure air or big hands. Im flatting with hands like Q9s that i want to see a flop with.

You shouldnt be looking for a '3 betting hand' its a '3 betting spot' that it needs to be.

Hmmm, I'd be more looking at the hand than the spot. Having a good 3b spot is usually completely unimportant if you don't have a good 3b hand. Against someone that has a semblance of balance, almost any spot is admissable.

Like if you get a super 3b spot and you have 23 or 88 then its not a good time to 3b.

Whereas if some reg opens CO and your on the button with 9To or whatever then bombs away.

This matters a hell of a lot when you have a semblance of being deep. It quickly becomes apparent that your hand matters a lot.

[TommyGunne]

Well I'm playing Rush poker, so if I have air OTB I've already hit Auto Fold long before it gets to me. It needs to be a hand that I would open if folded to me, know what I mean? Also, Q9s is an auto fold even to a cutoff open.

So you never 3b light IP? Thats where a lot of people leaks in rush come from imo. They just don't balance their 3bs well.

[AndyFatBastard]

So you never 3b light IP? Thats where a lot of people leaks in rush come from imo. They just don't balance their 3bs well.

Well I either 3bet as a bluff or for value. So I flat call with the likes of AJ, KQ and the above mentioned 9Ts. I currently 3bet 5.7% which is probably above average, because I have 3bet bluffs in my range but will most likely have the goods when I do it. I wouldn't mind it being higher though.

You're spot on about people's ranges. Guys seem to either 3bet 10% or 4% and that makes them easy to play against. It's the guy 3betting 7% that makes you think, because you know he's doing it often enough that a good chunk of his range is light, but there's also a good chance he's got it. That's where I'd like to be.

[Flushdraw]

So you never 3b light IP? Thats where a lot of people leaks in rush come from imo. They just don't balance their 3bs well.

What i noticed playing Rush poker, is that if you 3bet the CO/Button from the blinds every single time the opportuntiy arose, you wouldn't be doing too much wrong.

[Laois Hammer]

Well I'm playing Rush poker, so if I have air OTB I've already hit Auto Fold long before it gets to me. It needs to be a hand that I would open if folded to me, know what I mean? Also, Q9s is an auto fold even to a cutoff open.

Ah i dont really play cash so just go with tommygunnes advice

Hmmm, I'd be more looking at the hand than the spot. Having a good 3b spot is usually completely unimportant if you don't have a good 3b hand. Against someone that has a semblance of balance, almost any spot is admissable.

Like if you get a super 3b spot and you have 23 or 88 then its not a good time to 3b.

Whereas if some reg opens CO and your on the button with 9To or whatever then bombs away.

This matters a hell of a lot when you have a semblance of being deep. It quickly becomes apparent that your hand matters a lot.

I didnt realise he was talking about cash so im more than likely off point yes.

In tourneys since ive worked on 3betting spots rather than 3betting cards ive picked up alot of easy chips and set tables up exactly how i want them.

[OutFlank]

Just had a look at the paddypower blog and there is a video that advocates open limping ak in EP. I rarely if ever open limp and i'm using a work computer so I cant hear the sound that explains the reasoning behind the AK open limp. In what circumstances would you open limp and what range of hands would you have?

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYlfP5UO1oE&feature=player_embedded[/ame]

[AndyFatBastard]

What i noticed playing Rush poker, is that if you 3bet the CO/Button from the blinds every single time the opportuntiy arose, you wouldn't be doing too much wrong.

Yeah, if you're gonna 3bet bluff then I think you should do it at the point at which your opponent's range is widest. i.e. when they've open raised the button. But if you only do that then your 3bet from the blinds will be higher than from the button, and everyone keeps saying this is bad. I don't really see it, myself, but then I've been playing Rush profitably for the last 50k hands. Thing is, I don't think Rush is that much of a special case. At some point I think it balances out and plays like any other game. I'd have to play a bunch of regular poker on FT and tell you later.

[TommyGunne]

I would never open limp. Its just silly. The only time I'd ever consider it is with mid sized stacks at a passive table with a lot of donkeys with small pps, and even then I almost definitely wouldn't. AK is just an awful hand to limp with. You'd be best off just raising. Like to limp AK, you have to construct a limping range first, and thats just real silly.

[TommyGunne]

Yeah, if you're gonna 3bet bluff then I think you should do it at the point at which your opponent's range is widest. i.e. when they've open raised the button. But if you only do that then your 3bet from the blinds will be higher than from the button, and everyone keeps saying this is bad. I don't really see it, myself, but then I've been playing Rush profitably for the last 50k hands. Thing is, I don't think Rush is that much of a special case. At some point I think it balances out and plays like any other game. I'd have to play a bunch of regular poker on FT and tell you later.

Its because you'll be oop for the rest of the hand, and if the btn is competent, its going to be super easy to exploit you. Like if you open the btn and one of the blinds with a decent 3b %, particularly from blinds 3bets, you can actually call pretty wide. But if you open from any other position and the btn 3bs, even if he's a mental 3better from the btn, its pretty difficult to outplay him. You are just forced to fold a hell of a lot.

[jimbling]

I would never open limp. Its just silly. The only time I'd ever consider it is with mid sized stacks at a passive table with a lot of donkeys with small pps, and even then I almost definitely wouldn't. AK is just an awful hand to limp with. You'd be best off just raising. Like to limp AK, you have to construct a limping range first, and thats just real silly.

I'm not advocating limping with AK, but just want to say this piece of "advice" is for MTT play. I really don't think you need to construct a limping range in order to do this. 90% of players will just assume you have a small pp and play accordingly (assuming low-mid MTT with large player pool).



I can see scenarios that it may be beneficial to limp AK, but they are few and very player/stack size/dynamic dependant.

[TommyGunne]

I'm not advocating limping with AK, but just want to say this piece of "advice" is for MTT play. I really don't think you need to construct a limping range in order to do this. 90% of players will just assume you have a small pp and play accordingly (assuming low-mid MTT with large player pool).



I can see scenarios that it may be beneficial to limp AK, but they are few and very player/stack size/dynamic dependant.

If you limp something then you have a limping range. I know its for MTTs. Dunno what your point is there.

Its not that you won't be able to play it profitably, its just that it will be way better to raise.

[colquhom]

Ye Redjokers video is pretty much the nuts. Couldnt agree more with basically everything he says.

An important point to make is that although we generally want a polarised 3bet range against regs in position (and hands like 97s, 96s, j8s etc are good for that), you should look for spots to 3b fish with a very unpolarised range.

For example if a fish opens Mp who is like 60/30 with ft3b of 0 and a 4b of 0 you should be 3 betting kq, kj on the button etc which we would never do against a reg.

[jimbling]

If you limp something then you have a limping range. I know its for MTTs.

Yes, I know.
What you said in the previous post was:

Like to limp AK, you have to construct a limping range first, and thats just real silly.

My point is that you dont really have to "construct a limping range first" in order to decide to limp AK in a very specific set of circumstances.

But perhaps I am misunderstanding what the statement means.

Its not that you won't be able to play it profitably, its just that it will be way better to raise.

I agree.

[jimbling]

Ye Redjokers video is pretty much the nuts. Couldnt agree more with basically everything he says.

An important point to make is that although we generally want a polarised 3bet range against regs in position (and hands like 97s, 96s, j8s etc are good for that), you should look for spots to 3b fish with a very unpolarised range.

For example if a fish opens Mp who is like 60/30 with ft3b of 0 and a 4b of 0 you should be 3 betting kq, kj on the button etc which we would never do against a reg.

Did you post this in the wrong thread?
Either way, could you point me in the direction of Redjokers video??