Bubble hand

[tipp86]

This is a hand i just played kind of tilty so im going to post it.

Stacks are estimates but close

1st and 2nd irish open ticket 3rd €720

Btn 80k

Sb ( me ) 33k

BB 75k

Button and BB would more or less open button every time 4 handed. This is second hand of 3 handed.

Btn opens to 4.8k

We have QJ

Do we call, 3bet, shove or fold?

[peteypop]

This is a hand i just played kind of tilty so im going to post it.

Stacks are estimates but close

1st and 2nd irish open ticket 3rd €720

Btn 80k

Sb ( me ) 33k

BB 75k

Button and BB would more or less open button every time 4 handed. This is second hand of 3 handed.

Btn opens to 4.8k

Do we call, 3bet, shove or fold?

i read it in bbv but state your hand for feedback.

[tipp86]

i read it in bbv but state your hand for feedback.

What??

[dannydiamond]

This is a hand i just played kind of tilty so im going to post it.

Stacks are estimates but close

1st and 2nd irish open ticket 3rd €720

Btn 80k

Sb ( me ) 33k

BB 75k

Button and BB would more or less open button every time 4 handed. This is second hand of 3 handed.

Btn opens to 4.8k

Do we call, 3bet, shove or fold?

Sorry Tipp but have to be honest, esp considering it's the first hand 3 handed, I think a shove here is bad. You have 20bbs,fold and figure out the new dynamic imo,and fold pretty quickly.

Sorry.

[BobSloane]

From bbv

blinds 800-1600 160 ante Hero has QJ


I would fold but i have no idea if thats the best play or not. A small thing, but I would prefer to shove if I was in bb as there wouldn't be two hands to get through. If I had a little less chips maybe ~25k i would be more inclined to shove too. Hopefully an expert in sats will come along with a more mathematical concrete analysis

[peteypop]

What??

correct english lesson 1,are u asking do u shove with any 2 cards?
correct english lesson 2,are u stating what hand u have ,and should u shove?

read your post??wtf
i was only asking the q about what u had so u could get the most feedback from people.

[peteypop]

From bbv

blinds 800-1600 160 ante Hero has QJ


I would fold but i have no idea if thats the best play or not. A small thing, but I would prefer to shove if I was in bb as there wouldn't be two hands to get through. If I had a little less chips maybe ~25k i would be more inclined to shove too. Hopefully an expert in sats will come along with a more mathematical concrete analysis

Bob answered the q u had Q J,thats what i was asking u to state.

[tipp86]

correct english lesson 1,are u asking do u shove with any 2 cards?
correct english lesson 2,are u stating what hand u have ,and should u shove?

read your post??wtf
i was only asking the q about what u had so u could get the most feedback from people.

Sorry edited to put in hand just made a mistake and didnt realise i left it out.

[Solskjaer]

Fold you've enough time left to get em in better, either of the two bigger stacks may be tempted to call you on marginal holdings. Also the top two could tango a little and you are back in it. Don't underestimate how badly people play in this situation , pressure, panic, gamble kicks in it's a tricky situation though but I find a fold.

[tipp86]

Sorry Tipp but have to be honest, esp considering it's the first hand 3 handed, I think a shove here is bad. You have 20bbs,fold and figure out the new dynamic imo,and fold pretty quickly.

Sorry.

From bbv

blinds 800-1600 160 ante Hero has QJ


I would fold but i have no idea if thats the best play or not. A small thing, but I would prefer to shove if I was in bb as there wouldn't be two hands to get through. If I had a little less chips maybe ~25k i would be more inclined to shove too. Hopefully an expert in sats will come along with a more mathematical concrete analysis

Ya im kind of going down that line anyway myself hence the thread. Im kind of with the bb theory as well.

What is the lowest range we shove with so?

[peteypop]

Ya im kind of going down that line anyway myself hence the thread. Im kind of with the bb theory as well.

What is the lowest range we shove with so?

A high or any pair 3 handed.

[tipp86]

A high or any pair 3 handed.

I wouldnt really consider 22-66 that much of a better shoving hand than QJ in that spot tbh

[bantee]

Tipp, as I already said in the BBV I would be 50/50 but now that I've thought about it, I'd lean towards a fold and see how the dynamics of the other 2 players pan out.

A couple of things to factor in: How have they both been playing since the final table? Is the 4,800 a typical raise from either of these players or do they mostly raise the full 3xBBs when they have premium hands? Are either of them overly agressive in all positions (as this can be exploited)? Do they have a tendency to fold to button raises and nit it up for a ticket? Do either of them tend to 3-bet light preflop?

I would basically play passively enough out of position with hands like QJ or wait til I get them in a limped pot to chance a raise with them.

Generally, I find in these satts that impatience sets in with a lot of these players and stupid mistakes can creep in such as overbetting hands.

Sorry if this is very wordy, I'm usually not great at giving constructive feedback in these threads.

Edit: Willie summarised what I was tryin to say better.

[tipp86]

Tipp, as I already said in the BBV I would be 50/50 but now that I've thought about it, I'd lean towards a fold and see how the dynamics of the other 2 players pan out.

A couple of things to factor in: How have they both been playing since the final table? Is the 4,800 a typical raise from either of these players or do they mostly raise the full 3xBBs when they have premium hands? Are either of them overly agressive in all positions (as this can be exploited)? Do they have a tendency to fold to button raises and nit it up for a ticket? Do either of them tend to 3-bet light preflop?

I would basically play passively enough out of position with hands like QJ or wait til I get them in a limped pot to chance a raise with them.

Generally, I find in these satts that impatience sets in with a lot of these players and stupid mistakes can creep in such as overbetting hands.

Sorry if this is very wordy, I'm usually not great at giving constructive feedback in these threads.

Edit: Willie summarised what I was tryin to say better.

Ya well 4.8 k was standard for btn, bb raised to 3.6k.

I considered btn to be poor and the btn a decent player. I reckon the bb was going to be a tough opponent but the button could easily have made mistakes i guess.

Looking back at all aspects its most likely a fold. Just a case of getting excited for a brief few moments. I guess these moments pop up and a lot of the time you will get away with it. I guess its when it happens in this scenario that it makes you sit back and evaluate the situation.

[peteypop]

I wouldnt really consider 22-66 that much of a better shoving hand than QJ in that spot tbh

im not an expert in stats,so maybe someone who can tell u that would be better than me.

[tipp86]

im not an expert in stats,so maybe someone who can tell u that would be better than me.

True im no expert myself.

[Laois Hammer]

if there opening there button everytime and theres a strong possibility there raise folding QJ looks like the nuts to me here and im shipping it all day long, if its someone who hasnt opened from there button in a year i fold.

to the guy that said he would rather shove this if he had 25k, why would it be better to shove with less fold equity

[BobSloane]

tbh I think your fold equity is about the same with 25k or 33k. But with 25k the blinds and antes are putting more pressure on your stack. Plus if hero has 25k and villains have ~70-80k they are beginning to get out of sight where if you dont move soon even if you double up you'll still be way behind. Maybe the wrong way to look at it i dunno


Word of caution Iron...if Zosma finds you he will fck you up

[Laois Hammer]

zosma?

[BobSloane]

Yes, he posted with great fury this morning at 8am in the bbv

[Wombatman]

I shove here some of the time depending on my and villains play up to this point.

[Mellor]

I wouldnt really consider 22-66 that much of a better shoving hand than QJ in that spot tbh

22-66 hand are rarely too far ahead, but they fair better against the QJ+ range

As for the hand, I fold and I'm pretty comfortable with it