Bad beat/Moaning/Venting thread - Mammy told me not to come.

[Strewelpeter]

Eh...

]

Doesn't this mean he had two mortgages on the same property at the same time

I got the mortgage from PTSB in June 2018 and once i got the €6000 cash back i paid off the mortgage in full by drawing down the BOI mortgage in July 2018.

... unless you had the 300K lying around to cover it sounds dodgy if not a bit worse

[Keane]

Eh...

He's inspired several people to try it for themselves so I guess we'll see how they get on.

[Keane]

Doesn't this mean he had two mortgages on the same property at the same time


... unless you had the 300K lying around to cover it sounds dodgy if not a bit worse

He's just saying he paid the existing mortgage by drawing down the switcher mortgage, no? That's how you carry out a switch.

[Kayroo]

He's just saying he paid the existing mortgage by drawing down the switcher mortgage, no? That's how you carry out a switch.

Here is one of his posts, just in case you didn't smell the dodgy...

"Yes that will probably happen with your solicitor, but keep onto BOI and get your full application into them asap. Have you tried EBS 2% cash back? PTSB 2 % cash back? KBC €3000 cash back? UB only offer €1500 but their rates are the best. Get as many applications into all the banks all at the same time. They will all do a credit check on you and it will show up if BOI or UB did a check on you 2 weeks ago as far as i know. IF say UB asks you about this just say you are shopping around and keeping your options open in case UB were to turn you down for some strange reason. Play dumb."

I've highlighted the bit you should be concerned about.

The letter of offer is based on an assessment of documents you submit, including the details provided by your previous lender. It is assessed and, if suitable, a letter of offer is sent out on the basis of information you provide. So you are, for all but one of the lenders, providing information you know is false or by the time you actually switch will be false in order to obtain a monetary benefit.

He is actively encouraging people to do this in a way so that the Banks won't be able to find out. That is inherently dishonest.

Quite apart from that issue, which is serious enough, you also have to realise how mortgages work. There are two contracts. The loan and the charge on your home. The charge has to be transferred from one Bank to another and by contractual obligation your solicitor has to register it in the Property Registration Authority. That takes time. And the PRA might raise an eyebrow when the fourth transfer document, all listing the same previous chargeholder, is submitted to them in short order.

I don't want to get too into this because I don't want to accuse anyone of anything but this seems so inherently wrong that I can't imagine anyone actually doing it. This guy is intentionally misleading Banks in order to avail of their cashback options. He's actually suggested lying to the Bank if they ask about previous credit checks. How does this not raise some suspicions that it's not legit?

[Kayroo]

I'm not necessarily suggesting anything untoward. I'm just saying that there really are an awful lot of reasons why I don't think this would work, is true or certainly is advisable.

[Raoul Duke III]

The onus is on the banks to do their own credit checks and to have adequate systems and processes in place to weed out anything dodgy.

If banks offer these 'deals', then people are going to take them up on it. Change your mortgage provider once a year like you would change your electricity provider. Why not?

[Kayroo]

The onus is on the banks to do their own credit checks and to have adequate systems and processes in place to weed out anything dodgy.

They are doing the checks. He's factored that in. That's why he advises to make your applications all in one go. So that the Bank's credit check misses what he's doing. If he did it once a year that would be 100% fine because the bank would be able to see what they were getting into.

This scheme attempts to avoid that ability.

[Keane]

Yeah the guy pushing the idea on the AAM thread is obviously a bit of a clown, but I didn't see anywhere on the form I glanced through that asks you whether you intend to do another switch soon after.

If you are asked I guess you can say you do intend that. I was in a situation taking out my mortgage where I was expecting to be asked about massive gambling transactions through my accounts but I wasn't asked so I didn't say anything, although I know banks normally care. Did I get my loan under false pretences for not raising it with them? Genuine question, it seems to me like it's not up to me to make them address it if they don't ask me - in either case.

Obviously we can be a bit circumspect about whether we want to try to deliberately obfuscate or mislead.

Probably no big benefit versus switching every 12 months ultimately, but so far as I know the CBI actively encourage regular switching.

[Kayroo]

I get my loan under false pretences for not raising it with them? Genuine question, it seems to me like it's not up to me to make them address it if they don't ask me - in either case.

No, not at all. They had access to your accounts and financial info as they asked you for it. If they didn't raise a query then you didn't obtain the loan under false pretences.

You didn't take intentional steps to give a false picture.

[Kayroo]

People should switch their mortgages. I will switch my mortgage soon and will do it a couple more times in the next decade or so. That's prudent financial management.

But the Bank will know I've done it before and they get to make their offer to me based on that information.

[Kayroo]

Let me put it another way. If it was all 100% fine why seek all the letters of offer at once and why the advise to play dumb? It doesn't feel right at all.

[Keane]

No, not at all. They had access to your accounts and financial info as they asked you for it. If they didn't raise a query then you didn't obtain the loan under false pretences.

You didn't take intentional steps to give a false picture.

It seems superficially similar to if I was to apply to three banks - all of whom I actually DO want a loan from - at the same time.

OK, I intend to switch between them in a fashion I suspect is going to rustle their jimmies, but if they don't ask me is it incumbent on me to flag it to them? Assuming I answer truthfully to any questions they put to me.

Let me put it another way. If it was all 100% fine why seek all the letters of offer at once and why the advise to play dumb? It doesn't feel right at all.

Oh yeah the 'play dumb' advice seems to be across the line for sure. Doing several applications at once is fairly standard, right?

[SatNav]

https://www.facebook.com/irishmirror/

Spot Mia and our brazen dog. Video at top.

[Kayroo]

Doing several applications at once is fairly standard, right?

This is a very fair point. And the answer is yes. But each of those applications and the subsequent offers presupposes that you'll only accept one. Once you have accepted an offer and drawn down the money that changes your financial situation so drastically that the other offers are effectively void because they were made based on the fact you didn't have a mortgage or, in the case of switching, that you did have a mortgage with for example AIB and this is who you'll be switching from.

The act of moving your mortgage changes the basis on which the other banks made their offers.

[KevIRL]

Andrew balbirnie hits 145 not out to steer Ireland to a very unlikely ODI win v Afghanistan in India today.

[Solksjaer!]

Kellys in Rosslare seems to be the go-to place with kids with plenty of people I know. However, if you win the IPB Cheltenham Tipping Competition the slightly more expensive Europe Hotel in Killarney is kid friendly with pool, spa, etc.

(You're welcome RDIII )

Cheers . Off to Mr Google now

[Raoul Duke III]

This is a very fair point. And the answer is yes. But each of those applications and the subsequent offers presupposes that you'll only accept one. Once you have accepted an offer and drawn down the money that changes your financial situation so drastically that the other offers are effectively void because they were made based on the fact you didn't have a mortgage or, in the case of switching, that you did have a mortgage with for example AIB and this is who you'll be switching from.

The act of moving your mortgage changes the basis on which the other banks made their offers.

Eh. No.

The bank's potential exposure is still the amount of the mortgage. There isn't some kind of multiplier at play!

[Denny Crane]

Just tell the bank you've an extra 6k in savings now.

[Raoul Duke III]

A private school had arranged a wonderful excursion for its younger pupils in the 2nd, 3rd and 4th forms – a trip to a local point-to-point race meeting. The children were accompanied by two female teachers. After enjoying their lunchtime picnic, the teachers reckoned that the children should visit the portable toilets before the races began. It was decided that the girls would go with one teacher, and the boys with the other.
The teacher assigned to the boys thought it better to remain outside while they did their business. However after a couple of minutes one of the 3rd form boys came out and told her that none of them could reach the urinals.
Deciding that her duty to the pupils should over-ride modesty, the teacher went into the gents toilet area and began lifting each boy up, her arms hoisting them under their armpits. She worked her way down the line and when she reached one particular boy, she couldn’t help but notice that he was, shall we say, very mature for his age.
“You must be in the 4th,” she commented to him, trying hard not to stare.
“No, I’m in the 6th riding Masterson Shadow, actually,” he replied. “But thanks for the lift.”

Just six days remaining to secure a precious slot in the IPB Cheltenham Tipping Comp. It reaches parts money can't buy.

[Raoul Duke III]

hmmm...in my inbox:

Dedsert (Ireland) Limited, trading as BetBright has ceased offering gambling services to its customers on a permanent basis.

inevitable really.

[Dice75]

hmmm...in my inbox:



inevitable really.

All ante-post Cheltenham bets voided. Probably a few sick people knocking around.

[Guest]

A mate of mine spotted a error with them a few years ago where he was able to accumulate multiple markets within the one golf event.

McIlroy Outright, Top 5, Top 10 etc. It lasted 2-3 events before it was sniffed out. He got paid but didnt make much out of it.

888 appears to have taken them over, would they not honour the ante-post bets?

[BennyHiFi]

hmmm...in my inbox:



inevitable really.

e17mn seems a low amount for a 'proprietary technology platform' which had e14mn in net revenues in 2017 and was aiming to double that in 2018

https://www.racingpost.com/news/online-bookmakers-888-snap-up-betbright-in-15m-takeover/369073

The appointment of the MD from Stars always baffled me after the disastrous FT relaunch he oversaw.

Maybe someone on here knows the inside scoop

[Raoul Duke III]

Epic stuff at the Bernabeu; Real Madrid getting taken apart by Ajax.

[dobby]

Epic stuff at the Bernabeu; Real Madrid getting taken apart by Ajax.

The Ronaldoless effect

[Denny Crane]

I presume pancake flour is just normal flour with added mark-up?

[Raoul Duke III]

The Ronaldoless effect

Pretty sure Real knew they were getting the best of that deal

[dobby]

Pretty sure Real knew they were getting the best of that deal

Ah was tongue in cheek anyway.

Missing Ramos and Marcelo from defence tonight too. Ajax been excellent though. Have enjoyed watching them.

[dobby]

I presume pancake flour is just normal flour with added mark-up?

Do you mean the pre made pancake mix stuff or is there an actual.flour called pancake flour

Actually it doesn't matter. Just gonna be a mark up either way this time of year

[V for Vendetta]

e17mn seems a low amount for a 'proprietary technology platform' which had e14mn in net revenues in 2017 and was aiming to double that in 2018

https://www.racingpost.com/news/online-bookmakers-888-snap-up-betbright-in-15m-takeover/369073

The appointment of the MD from Stars always baffled me after the disastrous FT relaunch he oversaw.

Maybe someone on here knows the inside scoop

Not really if they have run out of runway. Probably over paying if there’s no other bidders.

[Tar.Aldarion]

I presume pancake flour is just normal flour with added mark-up?

Pancake flour is just self raising flour.

[Raoul Duke III]

Graham Shaw gone as Ireland women's hockey coach.

Having achieved World Cup silver. Gratitude, eh.

[ArmaniJeans]

Seems strange for the new owner to void ante post bets. Presumably if they've been running the market properly they should have the normal inbuilt margin that bookies have on all bets. Though maybe they have uncomfortable exposure on one horse.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[Denny Crane]

SPOILER

? There's loads of plastics with high melting point s.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[Denny Crane]

Ah sorry, thought you said that was the answer. Probably is right though

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[NewApproach]

Can plastics conduct heat well? Don’t think so, in which case hard to see how an oven would work without any metal parts.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[Denny Crane]

Can plastics conduct heat well? Don’t think so, in which case hard to see how an oven would work without any metal parts.

Not really sure where the first principles start with it, how could there be any people? Or anything other than lumps of plastic

[NewApproach]

Not really sure where the first principles start with it, how could there be any people? Or anything other than lumps of plastic

Step further and it’s just lumps of sand and oil reserves. Basically Dubai in the 50s

[bp_me]

Can plastics conduct heat well? Don’t think so, in which case hard to see how an oven would work without any metal parts.

In general no. In practice the only parts of an oven that actually need to be metallic are the heating coils in the oven. The rest could potentially be polymeric in nature.

Ignoring the hob here for the sake of simplicity.

[Solksjaer!]

If country x is fiction then everything is made of plastic including plastic people . It doesn't say anything has to be real/alive Think LEGOLAND. So yes the answer . :-)

[Rufio]

You planning on cooking plastic food in your plastic oven? How would your plastic people break down the plastic food once digested? Plastic stomach acid? GTFO

[Keane]

Eh. No.

The bank's potential exposure is still the amount of the mortgage. There isn't some kind of multiplier at play!

Along these sort of lines - would/should you be forced to start the whole application process again if say PTSB sell your mortgage to some other crowd after AIB have given you approval to switch?

If I go to draw down and AIB don't mention or ask anything about the fact that my loan is no longer with PTSB am I obliged to point it out? My financial situation hasn't changed in the slightest. It's definitely an interesting notion anyway, I'll keep an eye on that thread and report back if anyone has any positive or negative experiences from trying it.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[Tar.Aldarion]

People have been looking for Ethiopian food on here before and there's none in Dublin. There is for this week only at Veginity on Dorset street.

[DeadParrot]

If country x is fiction then everything is made of plastic including plastic people . It doesn't say anything has to be real/alive Think LEGOLAND. So yes the answer . :-)

They even have microwaves

[Raoul Duke III]

If you haven't signed up to the IPB Cheltenham Tipping Comp yet there is still time to Live the Dream.

Sign up today and avoid disappointment.
Terms and conditions apply.
Horses may go up as well as down.
Always seek independent professional advice.
If your gambling is becoming a problem you have to get better at it.

[Raoul Duke III]

Along these sort of lines - would/should you be forced to start the whole application process again if say PTSB sell your mortgage to some other crowd after AIB have given you approval to switch?

If I go to draw down and AIB don't mention or ask anything about the fact that my loan is no longer with PTSB am I obliged to point it out? My financial situation hasn't changed in the slightest. It's definitely an interesting notion anyway, I'll keep an eye on that thread and report back if anyone has any positive or negative experiences from trying it.

If you are asked a question, you should answer it truthfully. Otherwise chocks away imo.

[DeadParrot]

Along these sort of lines - would/should you be forced to start the whole application process again if say PTSB sell your mortgage to some other crowd after AIB have given you approval to switch?

If I go to draw down and AIB don't mention or ask anything about the fact that my loan is no longer with PTSB am I obliged to point it out? My financial situation hasn't changed in the slightest. It's definitely an interesting notion anyway, I'll keep an eye on that thread and report back if anyone has any positive or negative experiences from trying it.

The main issue i had with all of this is
if I draw mortgage on a tuesday, get €6000 cash on wednesday and pay mortgage in full on thursday is there an early settlement penalty? Whats the total profit?
Solicitors fees were posted on that thread €1350 per switch.

that and it seems shady as fuck

[Keane]

The main issue i had with all of this is
if I draw mortgage on a tuesday, get €6000 cash on wednesday and pay mortgage in full on thursday is there an early settlement penalty? Whats the total profit?
Solicitors fees were posted on that thread €1350 per switch.

that and it seems shady as fuck

There would be a breakage fee if you took on a fixed mortgage alright but not for variable, you can pay off variable as you please.

[Raoul Duke III]

The main issue i had with all of this is
if I draw mortgage on a tuesday, get €6000 cash on wednesday and pay mortgage in full on thursday is there an early settlement penalty? Whats the total profit?
Solicitors fees were posted on that thread €1350 per switch.

that and it seems shady as fuck

Usually only fixed rate mortgages that charge a breakage fee so I would say No.

Total Profit =
Cash backs received -
Solicitors Fees -
Other fees (extra valuations etc) -
Any higher interest costs incurred by switching

Then there's whatever price you put on your own time.

And the attractiveness obv diminishes if your mortgage is < 300k.

[TheJiggaman]

I see Paddy Power has descended further into the morass by renaming itself Flutter Entertainment

Guessing it's to suit the US Market.

They already have a couple of strong brands in the US (FanDuel & TVG) so I'd be curious to know what they'll do with them.

EDIT: Also, i'm guessing we'll never actually hear the name Flutter Entertainment in anything (kinda like Alphabet for Google)

[Keane]

The main issue i had with all of this is
if I draw mortgage on a tuesday, get €6000 cash on wednesday and pay mortgage in full on thursday is there an early settlement penalty? Whats the total profit?
Solicitors fees were posted on that thread €1350 per switch.

that and it seems shady as fuck

You actually just inspired me to calculate that the breakage fee on the fixed portion of my mortgage (we did 50% fixed, 50% variable) is close to nil which was a pleasant surprise, so cheers!

[Raoul Duke III]

Of course the easiest way to earn a four-figure lump sum is to win the IPB Cheltenham Tipping Comp.

[Solksjaer!]

Guessing it's to suit the US Market.

They already have a couple of strong brands in the US (FanDuel & TVG) so I'd be curious to know what they'll do with them.

EDIT: Also, i'm guessing we'll never actually hear the name Flutter Entertainment in anything (kinda like Alphabet for Google)

Wanna bet ?

[Denny Crane]

Cap their max bet at a tenner if they want to call themselves that.

[ArmaniJeans]

Flutter was the first betting exchange around 2000/01 I think.
Didn't quite know how to operate properly though, and lost out to the new kids quickly.
Presumably the name is a nod to them.