Bad beat/Moaning/Venting thread - Mammy told me not to come.

[Lord Sir Banter]

All on drugs.

[luckforsome]

Never saw anything like it. Even gabresalassie (you know who I mean) never dominated like that. Women's marathon record to be blown out of the water in 3 to 5 years time.

...Really was astonishing, just destroyed the field...Add in fact it was her first race of the season....Was convinced she'd be done for drugs after rio last year, glad I was wrong...

[Lord Sir Banter]

More jobs. http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/...-trump-w495042

[Flushdraw]

Bayern v Dortmund Super Cup gone to penalties

[The Istanbul]

If you give a woman the right to kill a life she should be locked up. Keep the 8th. Pro life. Hopefully the men in charge will see sense before the women lose the run of themselves.

So your belief is a woman should not have the right to choose. In all circumstances? Or perhaps you are just trolling

[Lord Sir Banter]

On Fox Sports right after Bayern beat Dortmund on penalties, female anchor 'German teams just too good at penalties'

[ArmaniJeans]

lol, popular win.

[dobby]

So your belief is a woman should not have the right to choose. In all circumstances? Or perhaps you are just trolling

Oh m8

[Guest]

Did think Bolt at 1/3 was a ridiculous price, didn't think it would be that gimp though.

[dobby]

Am in Clare for the weekend. Went to Kerry for the day to see the family. Get back to Clare and nobody home, to the pub we go. Clare minor ladies won some final today. Party central. Nathan Carter will be blasting soon. Hup the country

[Lazare]

19 is a cooler number anyway.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[ComradeCollie]

Listening to some vinyl on a 20 year old player. Thankfully didn't have the expected drunken accident wiring it up. Also surprised the belt hadn't decomposed.

[ComradeCollie]

Nostalgia

Giant red rizlas to go where we've been
was it ever to paradise green

[dobby]

eek. Is that what this is all about? That it should only be the woman's right to choose? I'd kinda assumed there would be some sort of fatherly say in the whole matter (without having really thought it through) given the temporary inhabitant of the womb is the product of both.

The whole repeal campaign is being run horrifically. This very isolating theme to the way it is being done. Thats just silly as if you have maybe 35-40% of the vote then the way to win is to be encompasing and encouraging in order to get new people to support the campaign.

I'd vote to repeal anyway, as its a healthy option to have available up to a certain number of weeks (first trimester + a few weeks), but can't see any chance of the thing passing.

That's exactly it. It just seems to be women women women. Feminism feminazis. Obviously they should repeal.the 8th but the amount of stuff like p&f is posting is intolerable.

[Lazare]

Dobby's discovered the Dublin coke scene.

[TheJiggaman]

Christ above, the posts online from Media and fans alike, saying how it's a disgrace Gatlin winning the 100m final etc.

Obv the guy is still a juicer, winning at that level at 35 years old, but are these people completely deluded??? Bolt, Farah etc are as big cheaters.

[ArmaniJeans]

Dobby's discovered the Dublin coke scene.

He is stepping his toes into the world of trolling. Mixed results so far but has to start somewhere, caught a few tiddlers but no big fish. Chadley should run a course or something.

[dobby]

Dobby's discovered the Dublin coke scene.

Wot you mean m8

[Lazare]

He is stepping his toes into the world of trolling. Mixed results so far but has to start somewhere, caught a few tiddlers but no big fish. Chadley should run a course or something.

Chad is a black belt.

[dobby]

He is stepping his toes into the world of trolling. Mixed results so far but has to start somewhere, caught a few tiddlers but no big fish. Chadley should run a course or something.

Was bored.

[RichieM]

eek. Is that what this is all about? That it should only be the woman's right to choose? I'd kinda assumed there would be some sort of fatherly say in the whole matter (without having really thought it through) given the temporary inhabitant of the womb is the product of both.

The whole repeal campaign is being run horrifically. This very isolating theme to the way it is being done. Thats just silly as if you have maybe 35-40% of the vote then the way to win is to be encompasing and encouraging in order to get new people to support the campaign.

I'd vote to repeal anyway, as its a healthy option to have available up to a certain number of weeks (first trimester + a few weeks), but can't see any chance of the thing passing.

Church on one side and feminazi's on the other mean that I am repelled equally by both sides so I can make a balanced decision. The level of retard hardlining either side of this i think will get it comfortably passed. Not gay marriage landslide but a comfortable 10 points

[CHDad]

He is stepping his toes into the world of trolling. Mixed results so far but has to start somewhere, caught a few tiddlers but no big fish. Chadley should run a course or something.

No real money in it.

Chad is a black belt.

Might be the best.

Was bored.

Let me show you.

[CHDad]

When iSnow died I smiled.

[Hectorjelly]

Why should men have a say in what happens inside women's bodies? That's a pretty archaic belief, hitch I'm actually surprised at you.

[Western_Sean]

The language used is interesting. Particularly the fact that its described as the "right to choose" as euphemisms go it seems particularly delusory.

[Guest]

Why should men have a say in what happens inside women's bodies? That's a pretty archaic belief, hitch I'm actually surprised at you.

If you're gonna spend the next 18 years paying for her decision, are you not allowed to at least voice an opinion ?

Surely you think enough of women that they can be spoken to when their decision affects you!?

[Hectorjelly]

Its the woman who assumes the burden of carrying the child. Ultimately the mans feelings and thoughts are pretty much irrelevant, both legally and morally. Women have the moral right to decide what they do with their bodies. Any other reasoning or argument extends the belief that one person can dictate what another does with their own body.

Obviously in practice the decision will often be made by couples, and there's nothing wrong with that. But legally the decision must rest with the person who is actually going to have to carry the child inside them.

I think its pretty mistaken to view this as just a "women's issue". At heart its about human freedom. The fact that it only affects women is immaterial. Every human has the right to their own body, and to determine what happens to that body. A fetus is part of a women's body, therefore ultimately its is the woman's decision what happens to the fetus .

A pregnancy to a woman is perhaps one of the most determinative aspects of her life. It disrupts her body. It disrupts her education. It disrupts her employment. And it often disrupts her entire family life.

And we feel that, because of the impact on the woman, this … is a matter which is of such fundamental and basic concern to the woman involved that she should be allowed to make the choice as to whether to continue or to terminate her pregnancy.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[Solksjaer!]

I'm in favour of amending the law but not due to the ' it's my body' mantra more to the many many instances where abortion is the sensible option. I think the provisio of protecting the bodies of the unborn from casual abortion is acceptable and in that end it should be part of the process that the wimmin have access to all available advice by default via a push system.

Whatever your feelings are on the topic it's still a great pity that potential people are terminated due to being an inconvenience .

No gay divorce though right? Feckers demanded to get married .

[Hectorjelly]

Whatever your feelings are on the topic it's still a great pity that potential people are terminated due to being an inconvenience .

On the contrary, the opposite is true.

https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/01/-what-economics-can-and-cant-tell-us-about-the-legacy-of-legal-abortion/267459/

This article is about the effects of legal abortion in the US after the ROE v Wade case.

"Living standards of children growing up were very different as a result. Fewer children grew up living in poverty, fewer children grew up in single parent households, fewer children grew up in households headed by welfare recipients. In some sense, you can think about following that cohort's path through life into things like educational attainment, labor market outcomes. You observe increases in college graduation, lower rates of welfare use for the children themselves, reduced likelihood of becoming a single parent themselves. These are outcomes for the children who were born in the early 70s that we observe 20 years later, that we observe for the cohort as a whole. Because it's a different group of children born relative to those who would have been otherwise. That's not to say that's a good thing, that's just what happened."

There is plenty of argument about what exactly the effects of abortion has on the decline of crime, but its pretty clear that children born in circumstances where they either aren't wanted, or aren't cared for enough lead to very bad outcomes, both for the children themselves and society as a whole.

[Solksjaer!]

On the contrary, the opposite is true.

https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/01/-what-economics-can-and-cant-tell-us-about-the-legacy-of-legal-abortion/267459/

This article is about the effects of legal abortion in the US after the ROE v Wade case.

"Living standards of children growing up were very different as a result. Fewer children grew up living in poverty, fewer children grew up in single parent households, fewer children grew up in households headed by welfare recipients. In some sense, you can think about following that cohort's path through life into things like educational attainment, labor market outcomes. You observe increases in college graduation, lower rates of welfare use for the children themselves, reduced likelihood of becoming a single parent themselves. These are outcomes for the children who were born in the early 70s that we observe 20 years later, that we observe for the cohort as a whole. Because it's a different group of children born relative to those who would have been otherwise. That's not to say that's a good thing, that's just what happened."

There is plenty of argument about what exactly the effects of abortion has on the decline of crime, but its pretty clear that children born in circumstances where they either aren't wanted, or aren't cared for enough lead to very bad outcomes, both for the children themselves and society as a whole.

Death by biased stats eh ? Sorry kid the rich guys don't fancy your chances anyway.

We are not a poverty stricken country .. That article assumes a ridiculous amount.

[LuckyLloyd]

Its the woman who assumes the burden of carrying the child. Ultimately the mans feelings and thoughts are pretty much irrelevant, both legally and morally. Women have the moral right to decide what they do with their bodies. Any other reasoning or argument extends the belief that one person can dictate what another does with their own body.

Obviously in practice the decision will often be made by couples, and there's nothing wrong with that. But legally the decision must rest with the person who is actually going to have to carry the child inside them.

I think its pretty mistaken to view this as just a "women's issue". At heart its about human freedom. The fact that it only affects women is immaterial. Every human has the right to their own body, and to determine what happens to that body. A fetus is part of a women's body, therefore ultimately its is the woman's decision what happens to the fetus .

While I fully agree with this, I can see how it will be argued against by the Iona Institute et al: "we represent the fetus, and the above shows a callous disregard for life, murderer".

It's going to be one ugly fucking campaign.

[Iago]

Its the woman who assumes the burden of carrying the child. Ultimately the mans feelings and thoughts are pretty much irrelevant, both legally and morally. Women have the moral right to decide what they do with their bodies. Any other reasoning or argument extends the belief that one person can dictate what another does with their own body.

Obviously in practice the decision will often be made by couples, and there's nothing wrong with that. But legally the decision must rest with the person who is actually going to have to carry the child inside them.

I think its pretty mistaken to view this as just a "women's issue". At heart its about human freedom. The fact that it only affects women is immaterial. Every human has the right to their own body, and to determine what happens to that body. A fetus is part of a women's body, therefore ultimately its is the woman's decision what happens to the fetus .

While I agree in principle that it should be a woman's choice as to whether or not she carries a fetus to term I also believe that in line with this there should be an option for a man to legally divest himself of responsibilities towards said fetus if it is carried to term.

When we say it's purely a 'woman's choice' this completely disregards the very significant impact that a child has on a mans life also, be that emotional, financial, social or whatever.

The difficulty in something like this is obviously the fact that it is an exceptional rather than normal circumstance (in relative terms) where the father-to-be has no interest in having a child or being part of it's life. It does however happen, even with the best of intentions on both sides.

[Iago]

on an even more serious note

ONLY 5 days left to the start of the Premier League campaign folks. It's a 10 month ride of fun and frolics but one you won't spend the next 18 years regretting unless you're not in of course

[Hectorjelly]

Death by biased stats eh ? Sorry kid the rich guys don't fancy your chances anyway.

We are not a poverty stricken country .. That article assumes a ridiculous amount.

What does the article assume?

There is plenty of poverty in Ireland...http://www.thejournal.ie/poverty-ire...62501-Jul2016/

[Hectorjelly]

While I fully agree with this, I can see how it will be argued against by the Iona Institute et al: "we represent the fetus, and the above shows a callous disregard for life, murderer".

It's going to be one ugly fucking campaign.

Yes you are right. I actually have quite a bit of respect for that viewpoint, its at least coherent.

[Hectorjelly]

While I agree in principle that it should be a woman's choice as to whether or not she carries a fetus to term I also believe that in line with this there should be an option for a man to legally divest himself of responsibilities towards said fetus if it is carried to term.

When we say it's purely a 'woman's choice' this completely disregards the very significant impact that a child has on a mans life also, be that emotional, financial, social or whatever.

The difficulty in something like this is obviously the fact that it is an exceptional rather than normal circumstance (in relative terms) where the father-to-be has no interest in having a child or being part of it's life. It does however happen, even with the best of intentions on both sides.

That's interesting at first glance, but is actually pretty crazy if you think about it. The point of forcing fathers to support their children isn't to apportion blame, but for the Childs own good. If your suggestion was carried out then you would be giving men a get out of jail free card - and also pressuring women into having abortions. Nobody on the pro choice side thinks its a good idea for women to be pushed into having abortions, but that would be the logical outcome of your idea.

[Iago]

That's interesting at first glance, but is actually pretty crazy if you think about it. The point of forcing fathers to support their children isn't to apportion blame, but for the Childs own good. If your suggestion was carried out then you would be giving men a get out of jail free card - and also pressuring women into having abortions. Nobody on the pro choice side thinks its a good idea for women to be pushed into having abortions, but that would be the logical outcome of your idea.

That's looking at it from a purely financial standpoint which is quite a narrow view. Of more import to the child is the emotional and physical support of a parent and family than financial.

The child's own good in real terms will never be serviced by being born to a parent that doesn't want them.

I don't think women should be pressured into having abortions but I think PEOPLE should think very carefully about the implications and realities of having a child from the child's perspective rather than just their own. You often hear 'I want a child' as a reasoning for having a baby, which at essence is a selfish intention which may or may not actually be in a child's best interest.

If abortion is legal and a woman doesn't want a child then she can abort it (simplified I know)

If abortion is legal and a man doesn't want a child, then tough luck unless the woman feels the same way.

That isn't balanced or fair & it certainly isn't in the best interest of the child assuming a child is born.

[RichieM]

Why should men have a say in what happens inside women's bodies? That's a pretty archaic belief, hitch I'm actually surprised at you.

It is a stupid rabbit hole that hole that people are looking to put a ruling round that doesn't matter. It isn't what's on the docket and unless we decide that women should be chattel again won't be something we can legislate for.

Whoever came up with the idea that this is a vote on a women right to choose instead of doctors performing a procedure have isolated a portion of the vote because they dismiss the male point of view as irrelevant.

I can see why they thought it was a strong media message but it isn't.

The legislation that will be voted on is obviously going to give the decision solely to the women unless they are mentally incapictated then who ever has control of all medical decisions makes the calls.

The idea that women will be heading off to get spite abortions is pretty crazy but anyone crazy enough to be doing so will hopefully get pick up by the medics and treated.

Same as any operation outside this doctors will want to make sure that if partners or one night stands have not been consulted there is a good reason and that emotional supports are in place.

Basically men will rightly get the same amount of say as the uk - none and doctors will be bound by the same medical ethics code for all operations.

Anyone suggesting that men should be able to force women to have an abortion is crazy, the choice is to just leave the women raise the kid solo if you decide you want to walk away.

It will pass if it goes to the docket anyway, part of the no campaign from last time will have died and more pro choice people in the voting circle.

[Guest]

Gatlins win last night was delicious. The fucking nerve of that crowd booing after getting on their knees for Mo "broken doorbell" Farah,GTFO. Also giving a big cheer for convicted doper Yohan Blake

[Opr]

This is heavy for a Sunday morning. You should all be at mass.

Opr

[Hectorjelly]

That's looking at it from a purely financial standpoint which is quite a narrow view. Of more import to the child is the emotional and physical support of a parent and family than financial.

The child's own good in real terms will never be serviced by being born to a parent that doesn't want them.

I don't think women should be pressured into having abortions but I think PEOPLE should think very carefully about the implications and realities of having a child from the child's perspective rather than just their own. You often hear 'I want a child' as a reasoning for having a baby, which at essence is a selfish intention which may or may not actually be in a child's best interest.

If abortion is legal and a woman doesn't want a child then she can abort it (simplified I know)

If abortion is legal and a man doesn't want a child, then tough luck unless the woman feels the same way.

That isn't balanced or fair & it certainly isn't in the best interest of the child assuming a child is born.

Yes, if you look at the decision purely from the point in time where the woman is pregnant then yes, it isn't fair and balanced that the woman has 100% of the choice and the man has none. However, would you agree that it is fair and balanced that the woman performs 100% of the child birth, and the man performs 0%? What about the fact that the woman carries the baby for 100% of the nine available months?

If you take a wider view of what has happened, both people involved knew the risks before hand.

People have children because of an evolutionary urge to procreate. I don't think much good comes from trying to judge if people are having children for the right reasons or not.

[jack90210]

Ordered a mytaxi yesterday, driver was your classic Dublin taxi driver sort. First thing he says is card machine is broken so he needs cash. Now obviously I didn't believe him because it's all done via the app. It was early in the morning so I didn't fancy a row and I couldn't see any downside for me. Did I miss something is there downside for me? What's the upside for him?

[Guest]

If there was abortion in ireland the waiting list would be nine months.

[Emmet]

Why should men have a say in what happens inside women's bodies? That's a pretty archaic belief, hitch I'm actually surprised at you.

Dangerous language really.

We all live in a society that requires us all to interact, it is inherently important that we all have a say in that society. I say that as someone fully in support of respecting a woman's right to choose what's best for them.

[Denny Crane]

Its the woman who assumes the burden of carrying the child. Ultimately the mans feelings and thoughts are pretty much irrelevant, both legally and morally. Women have the moral right to decide what they do with their bodies. Any other reasoning or argument extends the belief that one person can dictate what another does with their own body.

Obviously in practice the decision will often be made by couples, and there's nothing wrong with that. But legally the decision must rest with the person who is actually going to have to carry the child inside them.

I think its pretty mistaken to view this as just a "women's issue". At heart its about human freedom. The fact that it only affects women is immaterial. Every human has the right to their own body, and to determine what happens to that body. A fetus is part of a women's body, therefore ultimately its is the woman's decision what happens to the fetus .

I think it's an issue that women should decide on.

And I still can't figure out my own view point. In my teenage years it was assumed with my gf that any mishap and we were on the boat. Right now having a child would destroy my current life and not that it would be my choice but I don't think I would be comfortable going along with one. (Can imagine Hitch fist pumping here). And I know my two closest female friends have had the same change of opinion. Think we'd be Pro choice but wouldn't choose it ourselves.

Can't agree with women being vessels. But also can't see how it's fair that those of us that made it through get to shut the door behind us. Looking at it through a veil of ignorance would we choose a society with abortion and risk never existing? There's what, close to 100m people in the US alone that never got to live?

[Denny Crane]

Thanks very much to Lao Lao for the reservation. Really appreciate it!

Raoul let me down though! I thought he guy running the VKs name was Andy, double checked the restaurant thread and Raoul referred to him as Sean. Sean's the owner. Great meal as always.

I see they're introducing 3euro corkage next year. Doubt we'd get a group in before then though.

[shrapnel]

Absolutely loving and enthralled by Sapiens, and based on the goodreads ratings the rest of the world is too. Such an excellent book.

Loved the first 2/3. Final third is meh.

[KevIRL]

This is heavy for a Sunday morning. You should all be at mass.

Opr

Just back from mass.

Prayed for Lazare.

[SatNav]

I'm in kerry, where can I bring a 12 yr old. Take into acc its fucking pissing down.

[Morihei]

It is a stupid rabbit hole that hole

An astute observation.

[Denny Crane]

Apologies if it has already been pointed out but the next episode of GOT has leaked online. It is a small file so I doubt the quality is great. I am resisting the temptation but I dunno how long that will last.

Opr

Adult Marshmallow Experiment.

[dobby]

I'm in kerry, where can I bring a 12 yr old. Take into acc its fucking pissing down.

Where in Kerry?

Tralee, aqua dome, cinema, bowling if it's still there at manor west shopping centre. Also an arcade there that would pass an hour.

Killarney, not a lot of options in fairness. Again cinema or swimming. Doubt she'd be too happy with a tour of muckross house or Ross castle.

Could do a boat trip at Ross castle. The boat is enclosed so you won't feel the wind or rain and it takes you out around the islands and the driver gives the history of the place. Did it once, was grand to pass an hour away.

[Wombatman]

@ Hectorjelly

By your logic I'm guessing you support abortion on demand and up until full term.

[SatNav]

Where in Kerry?

Tralee, aqua dome, cinema, bowling if it's still there at manor west shopping centre. Also an arcade there that would pass an hour.

Killarney, not a lot of options in fairness. Again cinema or swimming. Doubt she'd be too happy with a tour of muckross house or Ross castle.

Could do a boat trip at Ross castle. The boat is enclosed so you won't feel the wind or rain and it takes you out around the islands and the driver gives the history of the place. Did it once, was grand to pass an hour away.

Gonna leave it till tomorrow morning now, weather too bad and gonna watch tipp match in the house.

Thanks btw lol

[Hectorjelly]

@ Hectorjelly

By your logic I'm guessing you support abortion on demand and up until full term.

I don't agree with your train of thought, or the words you use.

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/phrase-abortion-on-demand-has-dishonest-edge-1.2702041

"By using this terminology within the debate on abortion, all of these negative associations are subtly dragged into the discussion.
A linguistic trick allows the policy of providing safe, legal abortion services to women to become associated with a culture of impatience, laziness, selfishness and thoughtlessness – all the worst aspects of consumer culture.
This is the implicit meaning behind “abortion on demand”."

I think third term abortions are much more difficult medically and usually not legal except where the mothers life is at risk.

I'd like to know what part of my logic you disagreed with?

[Wombatman]

I don't agree with your train of thought, or the words you use.

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/phrase-abortion-on-demand-has-dishonest-edge-1.2702041

"By using this terminology within the debate on abortion, all of these negative associations are subtly dragged into the discussion.
A linguistic trick allows the policy of providing safe, legal abortion services to women to become associated with a culture of impatience, laziness, selfishness and thoughtlessness – all the worst aspects of consumer culture.
This is the implicit meaning behind “abortion on demand”."

I think third term abortions are much more difficult medically and usually not legal except where the mothers life is at risk.

I'd like to know what part of my logic you disagreed with?

I'm neither agreeing or disagreeing with you, just trying to follow your logic. Saying the issue is wholly the domain of the woman carrying the embryo or fetus suggests the right to abort at any time.

If there is to be limit then who should decide, just the woman in question right?