Bad beat/Moaning/Venting thread - BabyforV

[Solskjaer]

cry you bastards, cry.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAID_2iKO5Y

[Dice75]

Still working...
fuck sake

Hurry up. Strippers are here.

[oleras]

cry you bastards, cry.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAID_2iKO5Y

Wow, thats so amazing. Thanks.

[horatio1]

Due to my poor performance in IPB comps , I now have enough people's bank deets for a nice pay day off the Russian mob.

This was obviously a joke but I just logged into my gmail to find a long mail from Geoff White , technology journalist with C4 news saying he has come across some information about which he needs to alert me, followed by;

"I've been investigating the trade in personal data among cyber criminals, and have found what appears to be some sensitive personal information which seems to connect with this email account"

Thought it was a hoax but the mobile number / email and Twitter contacts on the email seem to be ligit. Tried ringing him now but got voicemail.

I have only ever communicated about bank deets by pm however I would on occasion have forgotten my password and had a new one for IPB sent to my gmail. The most recent time being last week. I am a little bit worried now.

I have deleted any old pms that had bank details.

[CHDad]

You BBV'd bank details. Jesus.

[Kayroo]

This has to be a whopper ban surely?


[VINE]ebPUFjilKZM[/VINE]

[eamonhonda]

This has to be a whopper ban surely?


[VINE]ebPUFjilKZM[/VINE]

They really don't make scumbags quite like they do in rugby

[6starpool]

This was obviously a joke but I just logged into my gmail to find a long mail from Geoff White , technology journalist with C4 news saying he has come across some information about which he needs to alert me, followed by;

"I've been investigating the trade in personal data among cyber criminals, and have found what appears to be some sensitive personal information which seems to connect with this email account"

Thought it was a hoax but the mobile number / email and Twitter contacts on the email seem to be ligit. Tried ringing him now but got voicemail.

I have only ever communicated about bank deets by pm however I would on occasion have forgotten my password and had a new one for IPB sent to my gmail. The most recent time being last week. I am a little bit worried now.

I have deleted any old pms that had bank details.

You mean I wasn't meant to hack your PMs and sell bank details? Damn.

I jest, obviously.

[KevIRL]

Dom going for the the Jimmy Savile 'hide in plain sight' tactic I see...

[DeadParrot]

Hurry up. Strippers are here.

keep them on ice.
It's gonna be late when I get there, if at all

[Emmet]

This has to be a whopper ban surely?
...

He wasn't cited, and the time has passed...

Phenomenally cuntish

[Kayroo]

He wasn't cited, and the time has passed...

Phenomenally cuntish

Wasn't cited???

Wow

[coillcam]

He wasn't cited, and the time has passed...

Phenomenally cuntish

Fucking hell! Any context as to why he wasn't cited etc?

[Emmet]

Fucking hell! Any context as to why he wasn't cited etc?

French player, playing in a French league game, starts for the French national side usually, any ban would impinge on his ability to play in the World Cup...

Not a clue!

Ireland's Jack McGrath got quite lucky himself last night v the Barbarians to escape a citing, of course, the independent citing officer was Eddie Walsh, not exactly independent!

Just reading there that the citing commissioner last night was our very own Eddie Walsh. Sure if we'd known that, we could all have relaxed, he's not a man to go throwing out citations lightly...

[Raoul Duke III]

One episode into A Very British Coup. Enjoyable.

http://m.imdb.com/title/tt0094576/

[newbie2]

Eamon Dunphy is about to walk onto the late late show set. He was at Bill's funeral from 11.00am this morning. This should be TV gold.

[DeadParrot]

Just home.
Fuck this gay earth

[Strewelpeter]

Hmm somehow convinced myself months ago I'd be able to do an Olympic distance triathlon - I have 8 hours left to get ready

Ridic nervous .

Might be worth your while running a market on which point I'll give up at.

[ComradeCollie]

Eamon Dunphy is about to walk onto the late late show set. He was at Bill's funeral from 11.00am this morning. This should be TV gold.

Wow, is that mole/tumor on his right eye not removable?

[dobby]

Just home.
Fuck this gay earth

Light weight

[oleras]

I really should thank Chadders.

Watching GOT live for the last 2 weeks has been the best.

I have been so drunk on both occasions i get to appreciate them twice, in stereo if you like.

Haven't the best of memory but folks saying to me, that cell scene !! I am lost...watching it now.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[oleras]

Going away meal tonight with the family tonight at the hotel. A rather fine collective intake of breath from them when the wife ordered a beer.

Not as agasp i am sure when we read the word tonight twice.

[White Knight]

20,000 have already registered for the 4 starting days of the Colossus $565 WSOP event. Fairly sick

[Dice75]

keep them on ice.
It's gonna be late when I get there, if at all

Yikes. Bruxelles

[AndyFatBastard]

Yikes. Bruxelles

Hi m8. NE craic?

[dobby]

Hi m8. NE craic?

GFYAFB. Come to Bruxxelles ya light weight

[AndyFatBastard]

GFYAFB. Come to Bruxxelles ya light weight

Gone 2 bed. Enjoy the gig tomorrow. Don't let Dice get you too drunk. He's a bad influence.

[eamonhonda]

Gone 2 bed. Enjoy the gig tomorrow. Don't let Dice get you too drunk. He's a bad influence.

Name change to AndySoftCunt

[Lord Sir Banter]

Going away meal tonight with the family tonight at the hotel. A rather fine collective intake of breath from them when the wife ordered a beer.

in communist Russia, drink order you!

[Lord Sir Banter]

Just home.
Fuck this gay earth

come out next Friday
dobbo, cone to the gypsy rose

[eamonhonda]

Name change to AndyDryBastard

[eamonhonda]

come out next Friday
dobbo, cone to the gypsy rose

Name change to Lord Sir Fuckallcraic

[TheDrunkenOne]

cry you bastards, cry.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAID_2iKO5Y

watched and went wow and felt emotion.

googled and found

they met and talked the morning of the opening"

so she knew he was coming

also she did previously

that the artist played the Russian game, in which rhythmic knife jabs are aimed between the splayed fingers of one's hand. Each time she cut herself, she would pick up a new knife from the row of twenty she had set up, and record the operation. After cutting herself twenty times, she replayed the tape, listened to the sounds, and tried to repeat the same movements, attempting to replicate the mistakes, merging past and present

and thgt she was a mad thing

watched again and realise that the music is the emotion

ps. I am drunk

[CHDad]

All the Craic was in the Gypsy Rose

[Lord Sir Banter]

Name change to Lord Sir Fuckallcraic

50

[Lord Sir Banter]

cry you bastards, cry.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAID_2iKO5Y

The amount of flash bulbs when he sits down. Send him an aul text there telling him to pop along, or one of her other 'x' number of 'x's.

[Dice75]

Name change to AndySoftCunt

Pfffft. Showed dobby the sights. Left him off and hit the Aquarium for a drink and €25 roulette.Spun it up to €150 so jumped ont9 poker table. Cleared it out for €1600.

[Dice75]

Gonna buy nappies

[cardshark202]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_2pKNWthJ4

[eamonhonda]

Pfffft. Showed dobby the sights. Left him off and hit the Aquarium for a drink and €25 roulette.Spun it up to €150 so jumped ont9 poker table. Cleared it out for €1600.

All in a nights work. Steak lunch tomorrow!

[pokerhand]

Saw San Andreas tonight as am a sucker for disaster movies.

Terrible terrible movie, avoid like the plague. I can't even bring myself to give it a proper review except that it's shite.

[dobby]

Great night had. Rum and cokes were reaching dangerous levels so I scarpered. Well played on spin up dice. Now, Foo Fighters, FUCK YEAAAHHH!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBjQ9tuuTJQ

[Fuzzy Logic]

I think the thing is the way audit firms work has changed over the years. It used to be the case that audit firms came to their work with some sense of creating value for the client and performing useful exercises such as testing the underlying quality of the data upon which the accounts were based and the like.

However in recent years its seems to me that focus of the big 4 has changed. There no longer appears to be a goal of creating value for the client or indeed the investors who to greater or lesser degrees rely on the quality of the audit. The focus now for my money is on (a) protecting the partners from any liability and (b)Generating billable hours as economically as possible without impinging on (a).

The consequences of this seem to be
1. The majority of base audit work being performed by audit juniors who have almost no understanding of how large financial concerns actually work - as opposed to the theoretical stuff they were still learning in college a month ago.
2. Partners and audit directors focusing the work performed in (1) on validating the arithmetic performed by the client as opposed to substantiating it.
3 Risk based audits as opposed to data audits - this is a sensible idea except that the majority of the work is still done by the wet behind the ears crew from (1) so they aren't in a position to find anything which might be a moderately concealed / not completely obvious wrong item.
4 The apparent interpretation of risk based audit as referring to the risk of damage to the asset base of the accounting firm partners as opposed to that of the clients shareholders.

For my money the big audit firms have ceased to create value for shareholders or indeed the public at large. Consider for example when is the last time you heard of a large public concern getting a qualified audit or indeed having the auditors refuse to sign the accounts? If this isn't something that ever happens then from an investors point of view what is the point in paying for the audit service?

With all due respect you're talking out of the wrong oriface. The reason why big 4 don't qualify accounts has nothing to do with 'protecting' the audit firm. In fact it is the complete opposite DUCY? For (a) can you explain a bit further as that reads like the audit firm should actually perform a more detailed audit than required under the standards. That is not a cop out from me more a curiosity as all audits need to meet basic auditing standards. Sounds like you have more of an issue with the standards rather than the audit firm to be honest.

As for (b) that is just your opinion. I can tell you it's wrong from someone who works in a big 4 but you can take that or leave it.

Your 4 consequences are also horseshit. The basic work is done by juniors, yes. Is it reviewed by more senior staff...yes. And the areas all staff look at are risk based so junior staff do not look at more risky areas. I liked the 'learning in college a month ago' to make your point. Yes we hire people from college. In fact we hire people straight from school. But they always have their work reviewed by more senior staff so your point is null and void as we all had to learn at some point. You are attempting to paint it like a surgeon performing an operation without any supervision, please base your cinsequences in reality rather than your perception of reality.

For consequence 2, audit firms sign an the audit report which sates that the information contained in the financial statements is true and fair in their opinion. The arithmetic being correct means nothing if the basic true and fair premise does not hold up.

Consequence 3, please refer to my response about the 'wet behind the ears' crew.

Number 4, please can we leave your already biased opinion at the door. Either the audit firm performing the audit meets the standards or they don't. It has nothing to do with the asset base of the partners. They would refuse to work on a risky audit rather than just try and generate the revenue. I have recently been involved in a large audit pitch where we walked away because the CEO was dodgy 15 years ago and we felt it was too high risk given the nature of the business he was setting up.

As for 'creating value' I am assuming you don't see the management letters that get sent to the board. Even in well publicised cases, the issues that arose were flagged to management years in advance but from an auditing or accounting standards viewpoint did not warrant an emphasis of matter or qualification. I have used the auditing standards a lot in this response so perhaps it is a change in those rather than audit firms suddenly taking it upon themselves to go above and beyond the required level of testing. But the more work done, the more it costs and for the vast majority of companies this would not add any value at all.

[Fuzzy Logic]

Having being audited many times, this is 100% true. You can always use the threat of moving audit firm to get dodgy shit (we had some interesting proprietorial 'mark to model' stuff back in the day that essentially said whatever the modeller felt like) through the audit if you really need to but generally the junior staff don't understand and the seniors don't want to know.

Everyone's a winner baby!

So your point is that you could intentionally be fraudulent and the auditor wouldn't know? This is the premise of audits as we can't test work for fraud where collusion exists.

The 'move audit firm' I get all the time and couldn't give a fuck to be honest as I still get paid the same. As for creating complex models then I get valuation specialists in to test the model and they tell me if it does what it's meant to. If it doesn't then we qualify or disclaim the opinion.

[Morihei]

Saw San Andreas tonight as am a sucker for disaster movies.

Terrible terrible movie, avoid like the plague. I can't even bring myself to give it a proper review except that it's shite.

I fuckin hate posts like this.

[Raoul Duke III]

So your point is that you could intentionally be fraudulent and the auditor wouldn't know? This is the premise of audits as we can't test work for fraud where collusion exists.

The 'move audit firm' I get all the time and couldn't give a fuck to be honest as I still get paid the same. As for creating complex models then I get valuation specialists in to test the model and they tell me if it does what it's meant to. If it doesn't then we qualify or disclaim the opinion.

As a matter of interest, how many qualified\disclaimed opinions have you issued? As a % of total. Genuinely interested.

[KevIRL]

NZ are mighty entertaining to watch all the same

[Lord Sir Banter]

lot of hugs needed in here today

[Keane]

How many times do you need to turn a deposit over on pokerstars before you can transfer it?

[Dice75]

How many times do you need to turn a deposit over on pokerstars before you can transfer it?

Dont think you have to turn it over, just have to wait 48 hours

[dobby]

Went to Beshoff Bros on Dame St.last night. Nothing we don't already know.

SPOILER

[Raoul Duke III]

Young lad played his first ever organised match today, scored the equaliser. Celebrations worthy of Ronaldo winning a Ballon d'Or.

SPOILER

in a thrilling 9-9 draw

[bohsman]

How many times do you need to turn a deposit over on pokerstars before you can transfer it?

Once along with the 48 hour wait unless you're a good customer, then they'll probably turn a blind eye.

[Western_Sean]

.....

I'm glad you came back on this I've always wondered what the perception was from the other side of things.

The reason why big 4 don't qualify accounts has nothing to do with 'protecting' the audit firm. In fact it is the complete opposite DUCY?

I assume this is to do with litigation risk ? I don't fully understand what the grounds for that concern might be unless for some reason it was likely that the basis of opinion was flawed - perhaps you could explain?

Sounds like you have more of an issue with the standards rather than the audit firm to be honest.

This is a fair point but since the standards are more or less set by the audit firms through the standards boards it seems a bit moot. The overall point I was trying to make (perhaps unsuccessfully !) is that in their more recent incarnations audits fail to create value for the client or the shareholders of the client.

Examples like Autonomy, Olympus and Sino Forest spring to mind as cases where an audit report failed to reflect the actual happenings inside organisations. Sino Forest is a particularly good example given that much of the timber it claimed to own did not exist - which one might imagine would be a key risk.

As for (b)[..generating billable hours as economically as possible...] on that is just your opinion. I can tell you it's wrong from someone who works in a big 4 but you can take that or leave it.

At least one of the big 4 is I believe notorious for under paying staff, you are in the industry so I'm sure you know that already.

On a completely unrelated note the following suggests that fair remuneration standards can be problematic for large global concerns to adhere to.
KPMG in the news 2007

The basic work is done by juniors, yes. Is it reviewed by more senior staff...yes. And the areas all staff look at are risk based so junior staff do not look at more risky areas. I liked the 'learning in college a month ago' to make your point.

Fair point on the hyperbole.

This is a key point for me I think and it goes to the heart of why the audit process is failing stakeholders in my view. The problem is that as financial firms become more complex risk becomes more difficult to define, locate and quantify. RDIII's mark to model comment is a good example of this. The value that model generates can most likely vary wildly and very few people will be in a position to contradict the modeller. An auditor is very unlikely to be one of them.

Audit juniors are at the coalface but don't understand what they are looking at a lot of the time. Seniors and partners look at the high level things since they don't have time or resources to do anything else. You could drive Lehman or Anglo through the gap between their respective positions. Which I think addresses your comment on the true and fair view.

To me opinions should only be offered on the basis of sufficient and well understood information. It's unreasonable to expect an auditor to be in that position after a few weeks looking at a complex financial firm - there will be people who have worked there for years who won't be in that position. The point being that the audit opinion is just that an opinion based on quite limited information.

However it is sold to the general public and investors as a useful independent oversight - which in my view it isn't and can't be. This is ultimately why I'm unclear about how the audit adds value for those who ultimately pay for it. Perhaps you have a view on that you feel comfortable sharing? It may be the case that there is a point here I have misunderstood in terms of the objectives of an audit and for whom it is intended to create value.

[hotspur]

Young lad played his first ever organised match today, scored the equaliser. Celebrations worthy of Ronaldo winning a Ballon d'Or.

SPOILER

in a thrilling 9-9 draw

Reminds me of the Ajax kids celebrating like Ronaldo a few weeks ago:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eS2CWeq1kE0

Have been watching Aston Villa lately. Arsenal are going to cut through them like butter if they have overcome their late season slump as looked in evidence in their last game. 4-1 or some such I imagine.

[newbie2]

[CHDad]

[V for Vendetta]

Did Gab and Strewel complete TriAthy today? If so any update on how they got on? Would have been fun to go support actually.

[Solskjaer]

having a wee punt on Reluctant irishman to be man of the match. 16s for a modest amount