Tournament Director

[getupoutofthat]

just wondering what all the other players think ,is it ok for a tournament director to play in his own tournament ,proper event with a 10k gt

[DAMO72]

just wondering what all the other players think ,is it ok for a tournament director to play in his own tournament ,just a question

If its a proper event then no , but if it's a local pub game then i don't see the harm as long as all players agree .

[getupoutofthat]

maybe i should have said a proper event

[Dice75]

maybe i should have said a proper event

I've never seen or heard of a TD playing in a proper event.

[Flushdraw]

I presume you're talking about this game?

http://www.irishpokerboards.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18375

Do you mean a player TD'ing the game while playing, or just an owner/manager in general playing?

[JP Poker]

As a TD and Club owner I've played a good of my own games in the club, I normally play if it's a quiet night only.

None of the players seem to have a problem with it and a good few often ask me if I'm going to get in and add some money to the prize pool (which is what normally happens when I play )

I don't normally play any of my bigger games unless I have one of managers in that night and they become the TD and will make all rules ect. I can only remember playing €100 Poker Triathlon at both this years and last years Mini WSOP, both times I was scheduled in as an extra staff member and was only going to work if we were really busy.

Personally I don't see a problem with it as long as the TD pays his money and doesn't get any favourable decisions.

Then again I'm a TD

[westlife]

just wondering what all the other players think ,is it ok for a tournament director to play in his own tournament ,proper event with a 10k gt

I presume you're talking about this game?

http://www.irishpokerboards.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18375

Do you mean a player TD'ing the game while playing, or just an owner/manager in general playing?

If the op is talking about that game Tony then you will find that a lady called Dani was the TD for the event. Maybe the op could give us his/her opinion on a club pulling TWO guarantees in 6 weeks?

[Flushdraw]

If the op is talking about that game Tony then you will find that a lady called Dani was the TD for the event. Maybe the op could give us his/her opinion on a club pulling TWO guarantees in 6 weeks?

I'm not saying anything negative about it Phil! I would have been 100% sure that Derek wouldn't have been TD'ing the game while playing, and as JP has said, once someone else is TD'ing the game and every player has the same advantage, then there shouldn't be a problem. If a club has a guarantee to make, then i don't see anything wrong with them putting players in to make up the numbers so i don't have a problem with it

[westlife]

I'm not saying anything negative about it Phil! I would have been 100% sure that Derek wouldn't have been TD'ing the game while playing, and as JP has said, once someone else is TD'ing the game and every player has the same advantage, then there shouldn't be a problem. If a club has a guarantee to make, then i don't see anything wrong with them putting players in to make up the numbers so i don't have a problem with it

Hi Tony, no, the 2 guarantees were pulled ( without any pre notification) putting players in is standard.

[Flushdraw]

Hi Tony, no, the 2 guarantees were pulled ( without any pre notification) putting players in is standard.

I never made any comment relating to the guarantees being pulled. I was just responding to the comment about someone else TD'ing the game, which i presumed would have been the case anyway

[westlife]

Sorry, misread of post

[getupoutofthat]

all im asking is do players think its ok for a TD to play in his own proper tournament with a gt YES/NO ,,simple question ,nothing to do with anything else ,

[westlife]

all im asking is do players think its ok for a TD to play in his own proper tournament with a gt YES/NO ,,simple question ,nothing to do with anything else ,

If that was the game you wr talking about then you got a simple answer. As you wr discussing whats right and wrong in the running of a club i thought you could give us your opinion on guarantee pulling Gene!

[Donk Magnet]

its 100% fine once hes not td at said event its another player more money in the prizepool rules are the same for everyone its like anyone playing an event.

[getupoutofthat]

ive no problem with my name being spread all over the place at all philip ,im entitled to ask a question ,a lot of players have asked me about it so im just finding out what other players think ,no need for you to go on the defensive asking questions about things i know nothing about ,

[The Gold Rush Card Club]

Genie if you dont mind me asking where did this happen

[Lplate]

Proprietors do this all the time and it's not a problem. If the td was playing and made any ruling that involved his table then that would be wrong but I've yet to see this happen.

[westlife]

ive no problem with my name being spread all over the place at all philip ,im entitled to ask a question ,a lot of players have asked me about it so im just finding out what other players think ,no need for you to go on the defensive asking questions about things i know nothing about ,

Your entitled to ask....... And it's a valid question.....I don't think I'm on the defensive at all. You got a response from players. You say "a lot of players have asked you about it" so think it's fair to say that nobody likes the TD playing the games.

If I post a new thread about guarantees not being honoured then I assume you will respond to it. And, as you seem to be spokesman for a number of players, maybe you could get a feedback about my question!

[getupoutofthat]

i can see and im sure the rest of the people on here see what your getting at and i guess ive hit a sore spot with some tonight ,the question i asked was simple either players agree or disagree ,

[The Gold Rush Card Club]

i can see and im sure the rest of the people on here see what your getting at and i guess ive hit a sore spot with some tonight ,the question i asked was simple either players agree or disagree ,

You still have not answered my question and how can it be a sore point with anybody unless it happened somewhere

[westlife]

i can see and im sure the rest of the people on here see what your getting at and i guess ive hit a sore spot with some tonight ,the question i asked was simple either players agree or disagree ,

Not sore at all and I'm actually delighted that you have looked for people's opinions about a matter of etiquette!

Would really love to get yours about reneging on guarantees

It is strange that you look for other people's opinion yet you refuse to give yours?

[getupoutofthat]

go back to my first post and im sure you will see do players agree or disagree with a TD playing in his own event or not ,i cant figure out why some people are getting so hot about it ,simple question for all players to answer ,

[The Gold Rush Card Club]

Thats not the question you asked.....you specified a 10k game a proper game (your words ) but you seem reluctant for some reason to say where it happened....ps welcome to boards ....

[getupoutofthat]

what i cant understand now is i put the question out to the general public and the two main replies are coming from you and your brother ,thanks for the welcome

[The Gold Rush Card Club]

you expect people to answer your question but you dont seem to have to many answers when asked a simple question.....

[The Gold Rush Card Club]

ps i have put an imput into many posts as has my brother on this site and for some reason you only post on two threads..........

[getupoutofthat]

does it really matter where it happened or if it happened ,its the opinion of the players that counts surely ,

[EnzoScifo]

just wondering what all the other players think ,is it ok for a tournament director to play in his own tournament ,proper event with a 10k gt

I would have no problem unless the td (owner) chopped it, like whats that about . OP, If you do start a thread like this then I presume you have an opinion, what is it?

If the op is talking about that game Tony then you will find that a lady called Dani was the TD for the event. Maybe the op could give us his/her opinion on a club pulling TWO guarantees in 6 weeks?

Come on Phil, fill us in. You cant just add half arse de railing stuff, give us the full story...

[RG67]

Not to get too involved in this post but I can assure you that at one particular event I was at within the last 2 years were the guarnatee far exceeded €15k I witnessed a TD working the floor for the first few levels making rulings etc and then was playing the event thereafter.

I personally found that a little strange, if not completely wrong, as although he was now considered a player with no power whatsoever he had been involved in making rulings against players he was now playing against.

When it comes to card clubs etc then I feel it's at the players discretion as to whether or not the TD can play. Whilst the TD is playing however he/she forfeits his/her right to make any ruling and has another member of staff act as TD whilst he/she dumps off their chips . This rarely occurs imo but when it does it generally is a donation to the pot as opposed to the TD trying to take the win for themselves.

[thegreatiam]

I've never seen or heard of a TD playing in a proper event.

Ive seen it hundreds of times and done it myself.

Ive seen it at major events/side events and in local clubs.

Ive seen club managers playing in games, td's playing in tournaments and cash games.


At the end of the day its only a minor issue when there is a ruling to be made. Most TD's work as part of a team so can easily sit back and let the team make decision if they feel its inappropriate.

If you're worried about the rule at the TD's table then situations that require rulings tend not to happen when the TD is sat right there in the action.

I once was told a story by a TD how a player won his ticket at a 100k event didnt want to play so the td stepped in and played it for him finishing second. Back in the day when people won satellites not knowing really what they were winning.

in reality a TD or any event staff have very little sway over the outcome of a game so them playing in it wont really make a difference. Most TD's arent so great at playing anyway so its usually free money ;-)

Most TDs who will play will be aware that they will be scrutinised at the time so will be avoiding to get in situations where they can be questioned. They'll go with the majority on a deal rather than give their own opinion for example. They will have their staff make rulings, but any decent TD knows that the staff he hires will make the right rulings. Beside the rules are freely available to anyone who cares to look them up. and most of the time they are straight forward enough.

Usually it makes no difference and its just another player, at least its open, rather than say for example the TD's business partner/brother/lover/cousin playing you which you may or may not have knowledge of.

but youll always have the decision, if you dont like it and dont trust it play elsewhere.

[Dice75]

Ive seen it hundreds of times and done it myself.

Ive seen it at major events/side events and in local clubs.

Ive seen club managers playing in games, td's playing in tournaments and cash games.


At the end of the day its only a minor issue when there is a ruling to be made. Most TD's work as part of a team so can easily sit back and let the team make decision if they feel its inappropriate.

If you're worried about the rule at the TD's table then situations that require rulings tend not to happen when the TD is sat right there in the action.

I once was told a story by a TD how a player won his ticket at a 100k event didnt want to play so the td stepped in and played it for him finishing second. Back in the day when people won satellites not knowing really what they were winning.

in reality a TD or any event staff have very little sway over the outcome of a game so them playing in it wont really make a difference. Most TD's arent so great at playing anyway so its usually free money ;-)

Most TDs who will play will be aware that they will be scrutinised at the time so will be avoiding to get in situations where they can be questioned. They'll go with the majority on a deal rather than give their own opinion for example. They will have their staff make rulings, but any decent TD knows that the staff he hires will make the right rulings. Beside the rules are freely available to anyone who cares to look them up. and most of the time they are straight forward enough.

Usually it makes no difference and its just another player, at least its open, rather than say for example the TD's business partner/brother/lover/cousin playing you which you may or may not have knowledge of.

but youll always have the decision, if you dont like it and dont trust it play elsewhere.

Bolded bit means he's not the TD

Someone playing the Event while still making the rulings is the TD which I'm assuming the OP is on about? - I've never seen or heard of that.

Also peoples views on what constitutes a proper event is probably different.

Edit - just read back the thread and haven't a clue what people are on about pulled guarantees either!

I'm Out

[Jim11]

If he started the event as TD and made some rulings then no he should not play

[The Gold Rush Card Club]

the op is refusing to tell us where this happened

[isildur]

Anyone takin odds on a full scale blow up in Cork ??? wow

[westlife]

I would have no problem unless the td (owner) chopped it, like whats that about . OP, If you do start a thread like this then I presume you have an opinion, what is it?



Come on Phil, fill us in. You cant just add half arse de railing stuff, give us the full story...

Baz, this is a guy that joined boards a month ago and has been, according to him, requested to post this question. It is obv an attempt to throw innuendo at Derek playing at the gold rush.

Derek had a manager TD on the night (and the previous "big" game, Fionn from CP TD'ed) looking after rulings. The OP only plays in 1 club so I assume the question comes from their players. I have no problem with regs posting any questions but when a middle aged man, who has played poker for years, joins boards (please search his previous posts) a month ago and asks this question....... then it is trolling at it's worst.

As he was a representation of those poker players I wanted to get their feedback on Guarantees on certain games (and sats) that where pulled.

[westlife]

Ive seen it hundreds of times and done it myself.

Ive seen it at major events/side events and in local clubs.

Ive seen club managers playing in games, td's playing in tournaments and cash games.


At the end of the day its only a minor issue when there is a ruling to be made. Most TD's work as part of a team so can easily sit back and let the team make decision if they feel its inappropriate.

If you're worried about the rule at the TD's table then situations that require rulings tend not to happen when the TD is sat right there in the action.

I once was told a story by a TD how a player won his ticket at a 100k event didnt want to play so the td stepped in and played it for him finishing second. Back in the day when people won satellites not knowing really what they were winning.

in reality a TD or any event staff have very little sway over the outcome of a game so them playing in it wont really make a difference. Most TD's arent so great at playing anyway so its usually free money ;-)

Most TDs who will play will be aware that they will be scrutinised at the time so will be avoiding to get in situations where they can be questioned. They'll go with the majority on a deal rather than give their own opinion for example. They will have their staff make rulings, but any decent TD knows that the staff he hires will make the right rulings. Beside the rules are freely available to anyone who cares to look them up. and most of the time they are straight forward enough.

Usually it makes no difference and its just another player, at least its open, rather than say for example the TD's business partner/brother/lover/cousin playing you which you may or may not have knowledge of.

but youll always have the decision, if you dont like it and dont trust it play elsewhere.

In certain clubs it's one person who is all of the above............

[stevobulmers]

Hi Guys,
Im a boards newbie but a poker oldie! Ive had a look at the comments on here and im so disappointed to see this conflict, it looks to me like there is conflict about the owner of the goldrush winning the 10k at his own club last week. I came up from clonmel to play this tournament and it was a great tournament (while I lasted)
I cant say for sure that the owner was acting as TD in the form of player and also making rules to be honest, if he did then I didn't hear any complaints on the night.
There was a girl there floating around and dealing but she wasn't over to my table. However I see the concern of the OP as one thing I noticed was the owner was dealing with tournament entries and giving out chips/table cards etc, my issue here is he shouldn't be doing that if he has intentions of playing as it could be very easy to arrange a nice soft table for himself while grouping the good players at one or 2 tables to take themselves out.
Ive seen this happen before to be honest.
The fact he went on to win I fear hasn't helped to be honest, did the owner knock out the op maybe? I dunno, anyway sorry if this causes any problem but I have now played in both cork clubs and its a shame to see conflict in a big city.
Steve

[Sirtoyou]

Baz, this is a guy that joined boards a month ago and has been, according to him, requested to post this question. It is obv an attempt to throw innuendo at Derek playing at the gold rush.

Derek had a manager TD on the night (and the previous "big" game, Fionn from CP TD'ed) looking after rulings. The OP only plays in 1 club so I assume the question comes from their players. I have no problem with regs posting any questions but when a middle aged man, who has played poker for years, joins boards (please search his previous posts) a month ago and asks this question....... then it is trolling at it's worst.

As he was a representation of those poker players I wanted to get their feedback on Guarantees on certain games (and sats) that where pulled.

TBF poker players are customers first and foremost, some play one club some float between the three. It's up to the operator to provide a product that attracts the most customers simple as. Why is this being made such a loyalty issue with players bitching at each other. Genie is an established player for years on the Cork scene how long he has an IPB account is irrelevant tbf if he wants to ask a question he has as much right as anyone. These are some very childish insinuations you are making against customers. Who do you feel is putting him up to asking questions?

[premierstone]

the op is refusing to tell us where this happened

Baz, this is a guy that joined boards a month ago and has been, according to him, requested to post this question. It is obv an attempt to throw innuendo at Derek playing at the gold rush.

Derek had a manager TD on the night (and the previous "big" game, Fionn from CP TD'ed) looking after rulings. The OP only plays in 1 club so I assume the question comes from their players. I have no problem with regs posting any questions but when a middle aged man, who has played poker for years, joins boards (please search his previous posts) a month ago and asks this question....... then it is trolling at it's worst.

As he was a representation of those poker players I wanted to get their feedback on Guarantees on certain games (and sats) that where pulled.

Why should the OP name the club/tournament that provoked the question, he is merely asking a simple question whether people feel the very idea of a TD playing their own event is ethically correct, and also how long he is a member of this forum or how many posts he has is also irrelevant.

Phil, what has your question re guarantees got to do with this thread and the OP, if it is something that genuinely concerns you and is something you want to have discussed open your own thread ffs.

[getupoutofthat]

im only in the door and i was wondering why my ears and nose were at me today but i can see the reason now ,well i have played poker in all three clubs in cork and i play every monday night in dungarvan ,ive played a lot of tournaments around the country and for the most part get on really well with other players TD s and so on ,,,ive asked one simple question on IPB and im getting all kinds of abuse ,think its a bit unfair really when all i was trying to do was to get some good feedback on this subject ,HAPPY NEW YEAR TO ONE AND ALL

[The Gold Rush Card Club]

Just to clarify that if the op is relating to my club,i did play the 10,000 game there as i have plenty of other games in the club.I was not td for this game as i am never td in any of the big games in the club that i play in.I have asked my regular customers would they prefer me to play or not and the response is yes they want me playing as i am normally the value at the table.I did not win the tournament there was a 2 way chop and when we were down to 3 players a chop was offered and refused by one of the other players.My seat card was given to me by the td on the night and for the final day the seating draw was done in front of the players.All stacks are on the table with the exception of the 2k early bird chips.And just a small thing because of my win €500 was added that night to the winner of the €40 win the button tournament that took place the same night as any player that played in it can confirm .I can confirm i did not knock out the op as he is a regular in another club in cork and has played in my club twice so you can make up your own mind on his reasoning for asking the question.

[roleynoley]

I played this event and Dani was TD for the night.Derek played and chopped it,so what!!!Personally I love seeing Derek playing as hes great value lol.And as for what Steve is saying about Derek giving out seating cards at the start to give himself an easier table?LMAO at that.There are no easy tables in there anyhow,To answer your question Genie my answer is NO a TD shouldnt play a big event like this and I didnt see DANI playing atall!!!

[KevIRL]

westlife - please cut out the sniping and taking the thread off topic. If you wish to ask a question about guarentees, feel free to start a seperate thread

[westlife]

TBF poker players are customers first and foremost, some play one club some float between the three. It's up to the operator to provide a product that attracts the most customers simple as. Why is this being made such a loyalty issue with players bitching at each other. Genie is an established player for years on the Cork scene how long he has an IPB account is irrelevant tbf if he wants to ask a question he has as much right as anyone. These are some very childish insinuations you are making against customers. Who do you feel is putting him up to asking questions?

He can ask any question he wants..... and he has received replys from numerous players. What Insinuations? If you went to the trouble of reading HIS posts, he says that "a lot of players have asked me about it" (post 15).... So you will have to ask him who these players are!

[westlife]

westlife - please cut out the sniping and taking the thread off topic. If you wish to ask a question about guarentees, feel free to start a seperate thread

absolutely!

[getupoutofthat]

now i must go out again ive things to do but might be back again later ,can really understand what all the fuss is about ,must of the people ive played cards with are a great craic ,cant understand how a simple question could cause so much resentment ,

[westlife]

now i must go out again ive things to do but might be back again later ,can really understand what all the fuss is about ,must of the people ive played cards with are a great craic ,cant understand how a simple question could cause so much resentment ,

No resentment at all, shouldnt have derailed your thread..... great game in the gold rush tonight!

[Wolves]

No way should staff be allowed to play in any game imo. Go to another venue if you want to play there's plenty about.

[getupoutofthat]

back again thanks roleynoley for a straight answer ,thats all i was looking for all along was a yes/no answer ,happy lucky new year kid

[getupoutofthat]

listen lads , this has escalated into some kind of personal attack,i asked a question regardingTD playing their own tournaments but let me make one thing clear, ive played poker and gambled for years with derek who on a personal note is a sound fella,the post wasnt a question of his character,

[BrianN]

No way should staff be allowed to play in any game imo. Go to another venue if you want to play there's plenty about.

Do you want the staff to be killed or what?! Theres enough resentment shown towards punters who play a game in a different club, could only imagine if a staff member was caught doing it!

Fwiw I don't see a problem with Derek playing a game in his own club. As people have said there was a manager in place acting as TD so he has no advantage over any other player. In general, there should always be somoene not participating in the tournament acting as TD, whch was the case seemingly in this instance so I don't see a problem.

[The Istanbul]

listen lads , this has escalated into some kind of personal attack,i asked a question regardingTD playing their own tournaments but let me make one thing clear, ive played poker and gambled for years with derek who on a personal note is a sound fella,the post wasnt a question of his character,

I do not see it as a problem if a TD plays their own event (but I would say that wouldn't I?). Personally I run my game because I want to have a proper game in my town to play in first and foremost and, as far as I know, my customers are happy with this given that, to date, the game is well supported.

As regards the off-topic stuff I think that the poker players of Cork and surrounding areas are very lucky to have 2 well-run clubs putting forward a comprehensive schedule of daily games (most with guarantees) giving the players a constant choice. I know that, as a player, I play in both clubs and enjoy the games in both and long may this continue!

Of course I am confident that Genie will continue to commute to Dungarvan for the best weekly game.

[Icarus152]

No way should staff be allowed to play in any game imo. Go to another venue if you want to play there's plenty about.

Wolves.

[Nero Ceasar]

Im buying popcorn for this thread, im expecting big things here later today based on whay I saw tonight.... dont disappoint me now ye here

[DAMO72]

Im buying popcorn for this thread, im expecting big things here later today based on whay I saw tonight.... dont disappoint me now ye here

So what did you saw

[Jayminator]

No

[corkie123]

So what did you saw

see damo

[DAMO72]

see damo

Where you see Damo

[GlennDoyle]

Where you see Damo

You can't miss Damo!

[DAMO72]

You can't miss Damo!

it's about time a proper TD with qualification's n all got involved here .