Bad beat/Moan/Venting Thread - BBV Archive 3

[Lazare]

By the way, this mass grave was discovered in 1976.

This has been known about for 38 years. The only reason our generation are finding out about it now is because a community group are trying to fundraise to build a memorial, and the church has lost it's total control of the media.

Still have a firm grip on RTE though.

[Wesley Harms]

Is anybody concerned that this fuvkin lunatic is helping to shape some of our children's futures

[Lord Sir Banter]

What is for breakfast?

I had a toasted sandwich with milk in town 1pm, that was breakfast.

You?

Is anybody concerned that this fuvkin lunatic is helping to shape some of our children's futures

What did you have for breakfast?

[CHDad]

Skipped it.

Dinner?

[Lord Sir Banter]

Skipped it.

Dinner?

Had some nuggets earlier. A yogurt a little while ago.
Got some 'Italian Vine Rippened Tomato and Lentil Soup', maybe some brown bread. See how things pan out.

You?

[Strewelpeter]

What is abominable is that we allowed this to happen. So easy to look for a scapegoat (the nuns or the church in this case), than to face our collective guilt and the dark underbelly that was, and arguably still is a feature of this fantastic little country.

This is it.

We

We did this; people like every one of us and we didn't need God or a Bishop to force us into it it is merely how we organised our social services in those days.

[CHDad]

Had some nuggets earlier. A yogurt a little while ago.
Got some 'Italian Vine Rippened Tomato and Lentil Soup', maybe some brown bread. See how things pan out.

You?

Dunno, will report back obv.

[Lord Sir Banter]

Skipped it.

Dinner?

Dunno, will report back obv.

Cool beans. I look forward to that.

[CHDad]

Nice one Lottie mate.

[Lord Sir Banter]

Nice one Lottie mate.

Hunger strikes.

Need the granny to knit me some shreddies.

[Lazare]

This is it.

We

We did this; people like every one of us and we didn't need God or a Bishop to force us into it it is merely how we organised our social services in those days.

What?

What control did 'we' have on our social services?

We're still wrestling now for control of it.

I'm flabbergasted that you of all people could come out with such shite.

[AndyFatBastard]

OMFG True Detective is the fucking nuts WTFOMGZ

[Raoul Duke III]

Feel like fucking Santa Claus the amount of cheques I am signing these days. Bah humbug.

ionapaul would be dead with stress by now

[davepoke/her]

OMFG True Detective is the fucking nuts WTFOMGZ

dem titties

[Lord Sir Banter]

dem titties

Hi dave, this objectives women and I find it offensive.
Thanks dave.

[eamonhonda]

Hi dave, this objectives objectifies
women and I find it offensive.
Thanks dave.

.

[Guest]

Prime Time is making me angry.

[oleras]

OMFG True Detective is the fucking nuts WTFOMGZ

Im falling in love all over again with season 3 of Veep.

[Strewelpeter]

What?

What control did 'we' have on our social services?

We're still wrestling now for control of it.

I'm flabbergasted that you of all people could come out with such shite.

No I am right, religion wasn't necessary for this to happen. This was the society we the people choose to build in the formation of a ridiculous state built of fear, suspicion and hatred.
It was a democracy, do you really believe that adults with a little bit of cop on, your grandparents generation and even my parents generation were completely oblivious of was going on?

[bohsman]

What?

What control did 'we' have on our social services?

We're still wrestling now for control of it.

I'm flabbergasted that you of all people could come out with such shite.

Jiggaman and SP have points. People stood by and continue to stand by the church and do little to nothing, it's blatantly clear that people had an idea of what was going on but continued to give money to the church and send family members to these institutions. Even now people put catholic on the census to appease their parents and baptise their kids for similar reasons along with trying to get their kids into schools run by the church. All this continues to give the church a crazy amount of power.

[NewApproach]

Prime Time is making me angry.

Jackie Levin is making an utter fool of herself. Discussion on third level education, "oh well this is all very academic".

[Icarus152]

Think I've finally overtaken GoT TV series by reading the books. Haven't watched any of the newest eppys yet.

[Guest]

Jackie Levin is making an utter fool of herself. Discussion on third level education, "oh well this is all very academic".

Lucey made her look like a complete fool!

[6starpool]

On the transatlantic travel thing, in this day and age in flight entertainment systems are not a consideration for me. A tablet loaded with things you know you want to watch is much better most of the time, and don't get interrupted by some fecker telling you it's getting bumpy so fasten your seatbelt. Airplane food on pretty much all airlines in economy is gunk, so eating something reasonable before you go and eat the edible bits of what they serve you is preferable for me anyhow.

[LuckyLloyd]

Fucking hate this country.

Then leave.

Something so outrageous as this will never happen in this country again. Ireland has made massive strides over the past 40 years and the recent defeat of Shatter proves that we will continue to so so.

If you want to live in Scandinavia or head off to Haiti to do charity work then do so. If you're here and you want to rage against the supposed disgrace that this country is that's okay too - but it takes a serious lack of perspective to not realise how good we have it in a relative sense.

This thread is filled with people doing very well for themselves in life. High education on average; high earners on average; freedom to express ourselves publicly; a society where access to opportunity is reasonably weighted towards skill and effort. It takes some mental gymnastics to be on here trading culinary extravagances on one hand and raging about how disgraceful and hateful the country is on the other.

The church is literally dying out in this country. Its influence has been beaten back and trivialized through progressive law making to the point of irrelevance. Reason won. We don't need froathing at the mouth to fix the situation, successive governments have spent four decades quietly getting it sorted and the silent will of the nation has allowed them to do so. There will be no eye for an eye justice achieved on this one unfortunately as the perpetrators are dead or past the point of learning on the matter - but we don't need same.

[Strewelpeter]

Something so outrageous as this will never happen in this country again...

I want to believe this and I kind of do but despite my natural optimism I keep reading people like John Gray and the more I do the harder I find it is to win the arguments I have against them.

[AndyFatBastard]

LLoyd, the nation has a huge a mount of healing to do, and part of that process is staring down the past, admitting the mistakes, finding the root causes, and looking long and hard at the consequences so that we are certain it can never happen again.

[Mickey Rosa]

I find myself agreeing with the majority of what Lloyd has said which is slightly worrying me given his voting preferences in the recent elections.

To expect us as a nation not to bitch, moan and feel hard done by is a stretch though, it's a national pastime.

[oleras]

Now thats a fright !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWpsRyb5Fk0

[LuckyLloyd]

LLoyd, the nation has a huge a mount of healing to do, and part of that process is staring down the past, admitting the mistakes, finding the root causes, and looking long and hard at the consequences so that we are certain it can never happen again.

You see, that sounds great and all but the church has been thoroughly outflanked on all the vital things from which it derived its power and impactful influence. Successive legislators have utterly revolutionised the laws and processes which underpinned the situation that allowed Catholic Church abuses to run rampant.

The second phase (total victory) is already underway and is a simple game of demographics and time. Within 100 years the oddities of Irish life that involve turning up to a funeral where the coffin contains a body that wasn't inside the door more than a handful of times during its adult life will be erased due to a simple absence of churches and priests.

We won without the big showdowns. The sign of a working and robust society imo.

[LuckyLloyd]

I find myself agreeing with the majority of what Lloyd has said which is slightly worrying me given his voting preferences in the recent elections.

To expect us as a nation not to bitch, moan and feel hard done by is a stretch though, it's a national pastime.

lol

[Lord Sir Banter]

Now thats a fright !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWpsRyb5Fk0

you owe me 4 mins of my life back bruh

[eamonhonda]

I find myself agreeing with the majority of what Lloyd has said which is slightly worrying me given his voting preferences in the recent elections.

To expect us as a nation not to bitch, moan and feel hard done by is a stretch though, it's a national pastime.

You'd expect do disagree with most of what a person says because they vote for a party you don't like/disagree with?

[Lord Sir Banter]

I've sort of watched the first 2 episodes of true detective over the last while, on and off, maybe more than once. I have a seriously awful attention span, I guess I should just put the laptop away and watch stuff but even then my mind rarely focuses.

I'll spoiler my question...

SPOILER

ti;dr, Do I need to rewatch these or can I get away with moving on to episode 3? I have a general feel for the characters at this point and that a murder occurred.

[Mickey Rosa]

You'd expect do disagree with most of what a person says because they vote for a party you don't like/disagree with?

I'd expect given the stark difference in the parties we choose to vote for that our social outlook and the way we see Ireland progressing into the future may be different but tbh the comment was more in jest that anything.

[KK82]

I've sort of watched the first 2 episodes of true detective over the last while, on and off, maybe more than once. I have a seriously awful attention span, I guess I should just put the laptop away and watch stuff but even then my mind rarely focuses.

I'll spoiler my question...

SPOILER

ti;dr, Do I need to rewatch these or can I get away with moving on to episode 3? I have a general feel for the characters at this point and that a murder occurred.

Always worth going back again for yer woman's boobs, I suppose. I've only gotten as far as episode 3. Found it pretty dull so far. Kinda off putting that it's so short. Feels like it'll be over by the time I actually get into it.

[tipp86]

I've sort of watched the first 2 episodes of true detective over the last while, on and off, maybe more than once. I have a seriously awful attention span, I guess I should just put the laptop away and watch stuff but even then my mind rarely focuses.

I'll spoiler my question...

SPOILER

ti;dr, Do I need to rewatch these or can I get away with moving on to episode 3? I have a general feel for the characters at this point and that a murder occurred.

I have similar issues and nearly gave up on it after episode one. I watched episode two with no distractions and I was sold from there on in.

[Lord Sir Banter]

Spoilering this as it's quite graphic and could be upsetting to some.

SPOILER

[gorrrr72]

Bitches be crazy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISLVDxPN4T4

Video not embedding for me, just copy and paste the link to embed yeah?

[Micknail]

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B00IWP4RYA/ref=redir_mdp_mobile

Has anyone got an experience of this product?
I want to know will it allow me to miracast my HTC screen to a Tele?

[bohsman]

You see, that sounds great and all but the church has been thoroughly outflanked on all the vital things from which it derived its power and impactful influence. Successive legislators have utterly revolutionised the laws and processes which underpinned the situation that allowed Catholic Church abuses to run rampant.

They still have way too much power over kids as far as baptising, comunion, confirnation and running schools goes,.

[Kayroo]

Lloyd is absolutely right about the game being over. Secularism has won the day here. It's just a matter of time.

Strewel however is wrong. The culture that allowed this to happen was cultivated and fostered by the Catholic Church and even though much of the religious element of that is dying off and will continue to die off, the underlying culture is deeply rooted in our national psyche.

We did all stand by and allow this to happen. In much the same way that the current orders are inheritors of the sins of those who went before, we as a people are the inheritors of the shame of our fathers. The shame of those who put their daughters into the laundries and left them to the mercy of "Christian" charity. The shame of those who bent their knee and doffed their cap as men and women were villified and criminalised for love. The shame of those who stood by and let those children be raped. That's a shame we all share. That's a shame we have all inherited. It's as much a moral crime to stand by and avert your gaze as the powerful prey on the weak as it is to prey on them yourself.

We were the Catholic Church. They ruled by our consent and our silence. That silence hasn't gone away. We don't protest. We don't react. We keep our heads down. Mind our own business. The Catholic Church might die, but it's legacy will linger on long afterwards. Our collective shame.

[TheDrunkenOne]

the amount of cheques I am signing these days.:

I cannot remember the last cheque I wrote. I do know I opened another account ~3yrs ago and unsure whether I have even a chequebook for it, prob do but buried in cabinet if so. Older account, no idea of last cheque wrote or what for?

Do shops still take them even now?

[Closed_Account]

"My classmate like Stalin. He helped make USSR a real power and helped China fight against the dirty Japanese"

Nice sentence from one of my 15 year old students essays.

[oleras]

"My classmate like Stalin. He helped make USSR a real power and helped China fight against the dirty Japanese"

Nice sentence from one of my 15 year old students essays.

Speaking of USSR, was listening to the radio monday morning, some repeat of a history show, anyways...shocking statistic to follow. More Russian troops died in july and august of 1942 than the total losses of all allied forces during the WHOLE WWII.

That Eastern front was a hard place !

[TheDrunkenOne]

[CHDad]

People forget that Ireland is young, we're only getting big enough to fight off the bullies that have us under their thumbs recently.

We are hitting our growth spurt and entering our teens. Standing up for ourself now.

Unfortunately the Church is more like a paedo uncle and not a bully. We'll defeat it eventually but will take a while.

Where am I?

[Hectorjelly]

Young compared to who? Germany is only a little older and they have nearly conquered the world twice (three times if you count the EU).

[LuckyLloyd]

They still have way too much power over kids as far as baptising, comunion, confirnation and running schools goes,.

Means little ultimately. Not converting many long term church goers or, crucially, financial contributors. The rituals that we're still putting kids through on that score are an irritating nonsense, but they won't exist a hundred years from now.

The church is starved of mass goers; financial contributions; candidates in Maynooth and political influence. They are dead right when they claim they are under attack. We're Irish so no politician verbalises it, people don't generally talk about it but we all know the church is gradually dying.

[CHDad]

Young compared to who? Germany is only a little older and they have nearly conquered the world twice (three times if you count the EU).

China, they are auld and have those beards.

We are not really that old, only looking after ourselves a wet week. Its like we've only moved out of our parents gaf. We were stuck for rent and the parents in Britain sorted us out.

Where am I?

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

...

[SatNav]

could picture RD with this on his lap..

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003URQVJO/ref=as_li_qf_sp_asin_il_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=B003URQVJO&linkCode=as2&tag=fascplactotra-20&linkId=FSTLBE3PWESMQMZT

[Raoul Duke III]

could picture RD with this on his lap..

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...TLBE3PWESMQMZT

Was really hoping for a Scarlett Johanssen picture there.

[Raoul Duke III]

Speaking of USSR, was listening to the radio monday morning, some repeat of a history show, anyways...shocking statistic to follow. More Russian troops died in july and august of 1942 than the total losses of all allied forces during the WHOLE WWII.

That Eastern front was a hard place !

20 million Russians dead in WW2. Kinda puts all the D Day mythology in its place.

[Downtown]

I feel we might be a bit harsh in our emphasis on the collective responsibility. There are many reasons why the church commanded such power from the population. It is an institution centuries old, that extended its claws deep into every aspect of our society. People generally tend to accept the reality they are presented with. The church was not messily intertwined with law and education as it is today but inseparable.

Its a dangerous game to diminish the responsibility of the church or try share the blame amongst society in general beyond proportion. It must not be forgotten the power and hold the church commanded in a much more rural, isolated Ireland. Nor the brave non believers of previous generations.

If anything the collective responsibility of moderates and apologists is greater now than ever. Those who continue to consent to their children indoctrination, get married in church etc carry more shame and responsibility imo than they did in previous generations when the fear of the church was very real and with good reason.

[Emmet]

Lloyd is absolutely right about the game being over. Secularism has won the day here. It's just a matter of time.

Strewel however is wrong. The culture that allowed this to happen was cultivated and fostered by the Catholic Church and even though much of the religious element of that is dying off and will continue to die off, the underlying culture is deeply rooted in our national psyche.

We did all stand by and allow this to happen. In much the same way that the current orders are inheritors of the sins of those who went before, we as a people are the inheritors of the shame of our fathers. The shame of those who put their daughters into the laundries and left them to the mercy of "Christian" charity. The shame of those who bent their knee and doffed their cap as men and women were villified and criminalised for love. The shame of those who stood by and let those children be raped. That's a shame we all share. That's a shame we have all inherited. It's as much a moral crime to stand by and avert your gaze as the powerful prey on the weak as it is to prey on them yourself.

We were the Catholic Church. They ruled by our consent and our silence. That silence hasn't gone away. We don't protest. We don't react. We keep our heads down. Mind our own business. The Catholic Church might die, but it's legacy will linger on long afterwards. Our collective shame.

I feel we might be a bit harsh in our emphasis on the collective responsibility. There are many reasons why the church commanded such power from the population. It is an institution centuries old, that extended its claws deep into every aspect of our society. People generally tend to accept the reality they are presented with. The church was not messily intertwined with law and education as it is today but inseparable.

Its a dangerous game to diminish the responsibility of the church or try share the blame amongst society in general beyond proportion. It must not be forgotten the power and hold the church commanded in a much more rural, isolated Ireland. Nor the brave non believers of previous generations.

If anything the collective responsibility of moderates and apologists is greater now than ever. Those who continue to consent to their children indoctrination, get married in church etc carry more shame and responsibility imo than they did in previous generations when the fear of the church was very real and with good reason.

I thought this was apt

This could be a watershed event in Irish history, if handled properly and maturely. The take home message here is no different to the harsh realities that on a grander scale Germany for example had to face after WWII, and to give them due credit, compared to other countries with former abusive regimes, they handled it fairly well. It is difficult to confront the ghosts of our past, but it is now long past time for Ireland to finally face up to its demons.

The root cause here, just as with all atrocity, is a power structure with no accountability. The RCC fell into a position of power after Irish independence was secured, and had effectively as much control over society as the Soviet secret police. They were not just above the law, they made the laws, and woe betide anyone who stepped out of line, especially if you were female. The gutless politicians who empowered them and deferred to them are just as guilty, as ultimately they were responsible for the security of every Irish citizen and they failed utterly in this regard. The harsh reality is that the cruelest and most vicious sadists and pedophiles in the country were allowed access to the country's most vulnerable, and no, not all of them were members of religious orders, although many were. The CICA report is a veritable who's who, outrageously without the names, of every sick monster who was given access to Irish societies most vulnerable.

A word of caution, if I may. The individuals we are concerned with, whether mothers and children abandoned by society, or banished to hellholes like Tuam or industrial schools, were in many cases the equivalent of those on the fringes of society today. Keep that in mind every time you hear people reference those on the lower rungs of society as scobes and chavs, and wax eloquent about what should be done to them. It is the same mindset and judgmental urge that banished our former citizens to the gulag.

I have signed the petition and will urge all I know to do the same.

And this is quite sadly true

http://www.broadsheet.ie/2014/01/16/notes-on-irish-scandals/

[LuckyLloyd]

20 million Russians dead in WW2. Kinda puts all the D Day mythology in its place.

The demented lunatic mass sacrifice that was the Russian defense at Stalingrad is truly wowing. A slavish collective will unmatched in history.

[Denny Crane]

20 million Russians dead in WW2. Kinda puts all the D Day mythology in its place.

It's surprising how few actually died on D-Day.

[Guest]

20 million Russians dead in WW2. Kinda puts all the D Day mythology in its place.

20million is probably the most reserved estimate.
It can vary from 25- 47 million depending on which academic you believe.
A peasant familys chances of surviving an eastern winter after there home was bunred to the ground and with no food was prerrt dismal im sure.
The siege of Leningrad between 1.4 and 2 million service men and civilins perished.

The scale of the battles of the eastern front will never be seen again thankfully.
After the atrocities committed its no wonder red army troops went bananas on german soil raping and killing everything in sight.

[Denny Crane]