Bad beat/Moaning/Venting thread - Wordle Gummidge

[Hectorjelly]

Some interesting stuff from Raoul's favourite Oligarch

“The sale of the club will not be fast-tracked but will follow due process. I will not be asking for any loans to be repaid. This has never been about business nor money for me, but about pure passion for the game and club. Moreover, I have instructed my team to set up a charitable foundation where all net proceeds from the sale will be donated. The foundation will be for the benefit of all victims of the war in Ukraine. This includes providing critical funds towards the urgent and immediate needs of victims, as well as supporting the long-term work of recovery.”

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/mar/02/chelsea-swiss-billionaire-hansjorg-wyss-says-offered-chance-buy-club-roman-abramovich

[dobby]

That's a fair post and if my views on religion make me narrow minded then sign me up. My hatred runs deep. I wouldn't be capable of a rational discussion on it.

[Silver-Tiger]

I'm in the the it's 2022 and you need your head examined if you are walking around with dust on your head that was applied by a priest.
I'm not even looking up what it symbolises but I imagine it's absolutely insane.

I have grandparents on one side still alive today in their late 80s with dust on their heads. Their children are in their 60s and thankfully the chain of that shite ended with my grandparents.

[ComradeCollie]

That's a fair post and if my views on religion make me narrow minded then sign me up. My hatred runs deep. I wouldn't be capable of a rational discussion on it.

I've enjoyed going to my local church a few times over the last several months. Mostly as a space where you can turn off the phone, and have little or no distractions. I'd be more annoyed if all those buildings were closed down than I was about the mediocre pubs that people were getting their knickers in a twist about.

[Lazare]

Anyone know if you're booked into the Red car park at Dublin Airport for a specified time and you arrive 15 mins or so before that will the barriers lift?

[Degag]

Some interesting stuff from Raoul's favourite Oligarch

“The sale of the club will not be fast-tracked but will follow due process. I will not be asking for any loans to be repaid. This has never been about business nor money for me, but about pure passion for the game and club. Moreover, I have instructed my team to set up a charitable foundation where all net proceeds from the sale will be donated. The foundation will be for the benefit of all victims of the war in Ukraine. This includes providing critical funds towards the urgent and immediate needs of victims, as well as supporting the long-term work of recovery.”

https://www.theguardian.com/football...man-abramovich

The emboldened word should really be replaced with the word "Ukrainian" before i'd pay him the smallest bit of credit.

[ComradeCollie]

Anyone know if you're booked into the Red car park at Dublin Airport for a specified time and you arrive 15 mins or so before that will the barriers lift?

Not me anyway. Though do like the humble brag of 'I'm off on me holliers'. Next door neighbour got back from his first trip abroad in two years. Proper broken collar bone from a snow board mishap. Probably life affirming in it's own way.

[Raoul Duke III]

Some interesting stuff from Raoul's favourite Oligarch

“The sale of the club will not be fast-tracked but will follow due process. I will not be asking for any loans to be repaid. This has never been about business nor money for me, but about pure passion for the game and club. Moreover, I have instructed my team to set up a charitable foundation where all net proceeds from the sale will be donated. The foundation will be for the benefit of all victims of the war in Ukraine. This includes providing critical funds towards the urgent and immediate needs of victims, as well as supporting the long-term work of recovery.”

https://www.theguardian.com/football...man-abramovich

I will bid....three billllion...........roubles.

Fuck him and his blood money. Although there's so much dirty money swilling around soccer, he might possibly not even be the worst.

[Raoul Duke III]

He seems to be in a hurry to divest himself of all his UK assets. I wonder why:

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

He's giving away something he owns for free to charity. It's surely a good thing, under any stretch of the imagination.

We all know all the oligarchs got their money in a bad way, but that seems like something decent he is doing with it.

[Lazare]

Not me anyway. Though do like the humble brag of 'I'm off on me holliers'. Next door neighbour got back from his first trip abroad in two years. Proper broken collar bone from a snow board mishap. Probably life affirming in it's own way.

Ha, it's a one night work trip bringing clients to The Netherlands.

Although I am bringing the running gear. Hotel is 5km from the German border. I always run there and back whenever I'm there so I can tell people I ran to Germany and back before breakfast.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

I don't know if anyone has ever heard the story of the origin of the oligarchs. Its quite fascinating. I heard a research presentation on it a few years ago.

Back in the mid-90s Russia was a completely broken country. No order, no sense of direction, just lost. So the US approached them and said 'we've got a bright plan', and a team of economists from the US designed a scheme to fix Russia by turning it into a modern capitalist society.

The plan was to turn those factory drone workers into modern capitalists by giving them all a share of the factories they worked in. The standard economist flaw here, was while the plan was nice, the implementation was woeful, as they didn't design in any worker training on the value of what they had been given.

So the oligarchs arose by recognising the value of these assets. They would literally go house-to-house and say - you know that piece of paper the government gave you - let me give you a chicken for it. The workers almost uniformly went 'fuck yeah, a free chicken for some paper'. And so the oligarchs ended up owning these gigantic businesses for almost nothing. Gathering a bit of control of businesses, and then using that to generate cash to buy the rest, then using that to buy even more.

It wasn't criminal. So the money isn't 'dirty'. It was the equivalent of taking money off someone at 3am of the Jackpot. They just played on the information asymmetry of a stupid economic system.

Now they eventually started getting into politics, and then when Putin rose to power he recognised that the oligarchs had developed too much political power, and famously sat them down and brokered a deal that they would stay out of politics and he wouldn't come after their wealth. Thats why Khordovsky got crushed, because he went back on that deal.

I think a more recent issue, is that Putin has started to rely on the oligarchs, rather than keeping them out. But their origin story is quite smart.

[ComradeCollie]

I don't know if anyone has ever heard the story of the origin of the oligarchs.

Sounds to me like a taxi driver told you a story a few years ago, it has then been enhanced by your own imagination and the shows you have watched.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

Sounds to me like a taxi driver told you a story a few years ago, it has then been enhanced by your own imagination and the shows you have watched.

No! It was an economist who was using paper trails to figure out the acquisition value of those original companies. It was astonishing just how much wealth was transferred.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

This week, for the 10 year old, is a week called 'Permis Internet'. Started on Monday with a French gendarmerie sent over to introduce to the kids to being safe on the internet, and he's coming back on Friday to test them on what they learned and give them their 'permis'. So they've spent yesterday and today learning the rules of safe internet. Today was a video where the kid thought they were talking to another kid but then in 'morphed into a really creepy man'.

I was wondering why she had spent all evening at her desk making things, rather than the usual internet bantering with friends. Now tonight she won't sleep in case that guy is in the house.

It feels quite extreme. I suppose the message is hitting home anyway, as I'm fairly certain we would have told her hundreds of times to be careful, but never seemed to register.

[Strewelpeter]

I don't know if anyone has ever heard the story of the origin of the oligarchs. Its quite fascinating. I heard a research presentation on it a few years ago.

Back in the mid-90s Russia was a completely broken country. No order, no sense of direction, just lost. So the US approached them and said 'we've got a bright plan', and a team of economists from the US designed a scheme to fix Russia by turning it into a modern capitalist society.

The plan was to turn those factory drone workers into modern capitalists by giving them all a share of the factories they worked in. The standard economist flaw here, was while the plan was nice, the implementation was woeful, as they didn't design in any worker training on the value of what they had been given.

So the oligarchs arose by recognising the value of these assets. They would literally go house-to-house and say - you know that piece of paper the government gave you - let me give you a chicken for it. The workers almost uniformly went 'fuck yeah, a free chicken for some paper'. And so the oligarchs ended up owning these gigantic businesses for almost nothing. Gathering a bit of control of businesses, and then using that to generate cash to buy the rest, then using that to buy evurban legend en more.

It wasn't criminal. So the money isn't 'dirty'. It was the equivalent of taking money off someone at 3am of the Jackpot. They just played on the information asymmetry of a stupid economic system.

Now they eventually started getting into politics, and then when Putin rose to power he recognised that the oligarchs had developed too much political power, and famously sat them down and brokered a deal that they would stay out of politics and he wouldn't come after their wealth. Thats why Khordovsky got crushed, because he went back on that deal.

I think a more recent issue, is that Putin has started to rely on the oligarchs, rather than keeping them out. But their origin story is quite smart.

Interesting mixture of urban legend, casual racism and general ignorance in this post.

[ComradeCollie]

Was a bit surprised to see RT was taken down( the satellite feed) today. It was kind of interesting to see some opinions from the other side. For the last few days it was mostly live coverage from the Donbass and Minsk, with weird documentaries on the half hour comparing Ukraine with Nazi Germany. Kind of think hiding that propaganda gives it more credibility than letting people see it freely.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

Here's an IMF article on the subject:

https://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/fandd/1999/06/nellis.htm

The mass privatization program of 1992–94 transferred ownership of more than 15,000 firms through a distribution of ownership vouchers.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

Interesting mixture of urban legend, casual racism and general ignorance in this post.

https://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft.../06/nellis.htm

On the scheme itself.



I can't for the life of me see how you see racism in the post.

[ComradeCollie]

No! It was an economist who was using paper trails to figure out the acquisition value of those original companies. It was astonishing just how much wealth was transferred.

Do you think that I think economist should be anything other than an arts degree?

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

Do you think that I think economist should be anything other than an arts degree?

I devote a considerable part of my professional career to undermining economists for their rigid thinking, so sign me up.

[Hectorjelly]

I don't know if anyone has ever heard the story of the origin of the oligarchs. Its quite fascinating. I heard a research presentation on it a few years ago.

Back in the mid-90s Russia was a completely broken country. No order, no sense of direction, just lost. So the US approached them and said 'we've got a bright plan', and a team of economists from the US designed a scheme to fix Russia by turning it into a modern capitalist society.

The plan was to turn those factory drone workers into modern capitalists by giving them all a share of the factories they worked in. The standard economist flaw here, was while the plan was nice, the implementation was woeful, as they didn't design in any worker training on the value of what they had been given.

So the oligarchs arose by recognising the value of these assets. They would literally go house-to-house and say - you know that piece of paper the government gave you - let me give you a chicken for it. The workers almost uniformly went 'fuck yeah, a free chicken for some paper'. And so the oligarchs ended up owning these gigantic businesses for almost nothing. Gathering a bit of control of businesses, and then using that to generate cash to buy the rest, then using that to buy even more.

It wasn't criminal. So the money isn't 'dirty'. It was the equivalent of taking money off someone at 3am of the Jackpot. They just played on the information asymmetry of a stupid economic system.

Now they eventually started getting into politics, and then when Putin rose to power he recognised that the oligarchs had developed too much political power, and famously sat them down and brokered a deal that they would stay out of politics and he wouldn't come after their wealth. Thats why Khordovsky got crushed, because he went back on that deal.

I think a more recent issue, is that Putin has started to rely on the oligarchs, rather than keeping them out. But their origin story is quite smart.

There's a much more detailed and accurate account in a book I just read, Russia is only a small part of it, there are lots of great stories of extremely dodgy behaviour in Havana, South Africa during apartheid and others. Told from the point of view of western commodity traders:


The World for Sale: Money, Power and the Traders Who Barter the Earth’s Resources

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B08LK7KP6D/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_d_asin_title_o04?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[Hectorjelly]

Do you think that I think economist should be anything other than an arts degree?

Do you think that I think is a great opening to a question. It reminds me of the great gambling game at a poker table, betting on what someone at the table thinks about a fact. EG: How many people does Dave think live in Indonesia.

[paul8200]

Guys I am probably overstepping my profile here as a lurker, but what is great about IPB and the small number of similar sites is the polar opposite views, the outrageously different perspectives, the banter that comes from that and that leads up to every reader/contributor feeling they now have the measure of any situation (and mostly being wrong about that but that's life). So....

I do sense a growing intolerance at times I think we have to watch. I hope HH doesn't mind me using his posts and the responses to as an example the last week or so. I find his posts interesting and that's not to say I agree with some or many but I do think we should ensure tolerance levels are always high and let conversation flow

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

There's a much more detailed and accurate account in a book I just read, Russia is only a small part of it, there are lots of great stories of extremely dodgy behaviour in Havana, South Africa during apartheid and others. Told from the point of view of western commodity traders:


The World for Sale: Money, Power and the Traders Who Barter the Earth’s Resources

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B08LK7KP6D/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_d_asin_title_o04?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Ah, I must read that!

I read How Asia Works a while back (a bit boring to be honest), and there was a lot there on this US imposition of economic reform schemes across the Asian countries. In fairness, a few of those reform schemes worked very well. Mainly the original Japanese one on land reform of giving everyone a plot of land, but the schemes became a bit madder and excessively ideological over time. Philippines being the famous fuck-up.

[Wombatman]

I see Eoghan McDermott has resurfaced. Not going down well on the Twitter.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

I see Eoghan McDermott has resurfaced. Not going down well on the Twitter.

Therein lies the problem of twitter.

Was just reading an article on it. He won't get back on radio, tv, or whatever he was on, but he'll reap a fine amount of legal damages.

I'd imagine the twitter mob has now moved on to changing the goalposts, and exclaiming that 'well even if she was at the age of consent ...' Now, in fairness, that's a massive age gap (37 vs 18), but each to their own. Let those of us who haven't whacked off to legally nubile youth be the first to cast a stone.

I'd be the first to cast that stone, but I seem to not have any stones laying about. curses.

[Keane]

What's the best way to get from Ireland to San Sebastian? I know a few folks have done it a few different ways for rugby trips and stuff.

[dobby]

Therein lies the problem of twitter.

Was just reading an article on it. He won't get back on radio, tv, or whatever he was on, but he'll reap a fine amount of legal damages.

I'd imagine the twitter mob has now moved on to changing the goalposts, and exclaiming that 'well even if she was at the age of consent ...' Now, in fairness, that's a massive age gap (37 vs 18), but each to their own. Let those of us who haven't whacked off to legally nubile youth be the first to cast a stone.

I'd be the first to cast that stone, but I seem to not have any stones laying about. curses.

Well, it was 27 and 17. But apparently there was contact when she was 16 and wanted to work in radio. Nothing sexual happened until she was "legal" apparently.

So at best, hes a creep grooming a young wan, at worst.....

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

ah, I was going on his current age minus a year. I think anyone in their 20s should easily get away with it. But apparently not. Didn't realise 17 was the age of consent, actually. But it does seem to be socially policing sexual preferences. Not too sure that's a smart idea, as society always tends to fuck up when it starts to do that. Witness, Catholic Ireland, the earlier conversation, where the entire country was governed by pretty awful sexual social policing. You'd have to definitely look at him a bit askance though.

[Strewelpeter]

https://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft.../06/nellis.htm

On the scheme itself.



I can't for the life of me see how you see racism in the post.

Don't see any references to serfs trading chickens for shares in that IMF yarn

[Strewelpeter]

Guys I am probably overstepping my profile here as a lurker, but what is great about IPB and the small number of similar sites is the polar opposite views, the outrageously different perspectives, the banter that comes from that and that leads up to every reader/contributor feeling they now have the measure of any situation (and mostly being wrong about that but that's life). So....

I do sense a growing intolerance at times I think we have to watch. I hope HH doesn't mind me using his posts and the responses to as an example the last week or so. I find his posts interesting and that's not to say I agree with some or many but I do think we should ensure tolerance levels are always high and let conversation flow

Ah I think it's ok, maybe a bit tetchier and slightly less respectful than usual but thats what you'll get when there's a 'local' war.

[Wombatman]

"I believe her".

"But the accusations were false".

"Well..........em..........".

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

Don't see any references to serfs trading chickens for shares in that IMF yarn

But it does talk about the lack of knowledge of the workers who received the vouchers and how they didn't realise the value they had, which was my general point. I'm sorry if you assumed the chicken story was a factual quote from the time period rather than a lighthearted embellishment. I do remember the guy who presented the study though talking about people handing out crates of vodka for shares. And my general explanation clearly wasn't 'urban myth' as that (and any number of articles from the time) attest.

[eamonhonda]

What's the best way to get from Ireland to San Sebastian? I know a few folks have done it a few different ways for rugby trips and stuff.

Fly to Bilbao and you're close

[Solksjaer!]

PUTIN. I deserve Ukraine after losing the Whitehouse

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

Watching Reacher on Amazon Prime and its a whole lot of fun. The books are boring as fuck, but they've picked a great cast, set the tone ever so slightly light.

This is top light entertainment, having watched two more episodes. No brain cells will be affected, but its a great mix of action and very understated humour.

[Mellor]

But it does talk about the lack of knowledge of the workers who received the vouchers and how they didn't realise the value they had, which was my general point. I'm sorry if you assumed the chicken story was a factual quote from the time period rather than a lighthearted embellishment. I do remember the guy who presented the study though talking about people handing out crates of vodka for shares. And my general explanation clearly wasn't 'urban myth' as that (and any number of articles from the time) attest.

I think the "light hearted embellsihment" anf\d the characterizing the commoner as stereotypically dumb is probably what SP was getting at.

He privatisation happened, but the profiteering was more so a system of arbitrage and corruption than chickens for billion dollar vouchers.

[Lazare]

Guys I am probably overstepping my profile here as a lurker, but what is great about IPB and the small number of similar sites is the polar opposite views, the outrageously different perspectives, the banter that comes from that and that leads up to every reader/contributor feeling they now have the measure of any situation (and mostly being wrong about that but that's life). So....

I do sense a growing intolerance at times I think we have to watch. I hope HH doesn't mind me using his posts and the responses to as an example the last week or so. I find his posts interesting and that's not to say I agree with some or many but I do think we should ensure tolerance levels are always high and let conversation flow

So very well said.

Been trying for the last two weeks to verbalise something similar.

Post more.

[Raoul Duke III]

Fly to Bilbao and you're close

We flew to Biarritz and it's an hour from there

[ComradeCollie]

This Russian youtuber is about as non political as you can get, but he's well pissed off with the sanctions already

[Raoul Duke III]

This Russian youtuber is about as non political as you can get, but he's well pissed off with the sanctions already

I lasted 2 minutes. He seems to have no awareness of why the sanctions have been imposed and is self-obsessed, to put it mildly.

[DeadParrot]

No! It was an economist who was using paper trails to figure out the acquisition value of those original companies. It was astonishing just how much wealth was transferred.

I'm familiar with the story, but yours definitely seems the PG version of the tale.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

I think the "light hearted embellsihment" anf\d the characterizing the commoner as stereotypically dumb is probably what SP was getting at.

He privatisation happened, but the profiteering was more so a system of arbitrage and corruption than chickens for billion dollar vouchers.

Most people know absolutely nothing about investment. My parents, life long investors, still think in terms of stock market value based on the price of shares. As in, they think a share of one company costing €0.01 per share is much better value than a share of another company costing €40. They still haven't grasped the concept of market capitalisation. It has been widely shown that common investors suffer from these stupid perspectives and that this costs then money.

Even the average professional investor can be pretty dumb. A lot trade actively through overconfidence and end up underperforming the market.

So the average clued-in investor is pretty stupid when it comes to investment.

So ... how absolutely completely bone-headed stupid about investment value do you think the average person who had spent their entire life working on a factory production line, with no education, under a system of communism, was about the investment value of a voucher they had been given?

I think it's not beyond the bounds of assumption, to think ... pretty fucking stupid.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

I'm familiar with the story, but yours definitely seems the PG version of the tale.

It's not a one-off global instance of that type of story. Hairbrained economist-dreamt-up schemes have destroyed many a country.

[Raoul Duke III]

Win the 2022 IPB Cheltenham Tipping Comp and you could probably afford to buy an ex-oligarch's yacht, with maybe a football club and a supermodel thrown in on the side.

A mere 12 days to go.

[Raoul Duke III]

It's not a one-off global instance of that type of story. Hairbrained economist-dreamt-up schemes have destroyed many a country.

Not aimed at you obviously, but are economists generally considered to be some of the nuttier academics out there? (or maybe it's just academia generally that turns people screwy)

I have fond memories of my economics classes in UCD (some of the few classes I bothered attending in my B.Comm) where Dessie Norton would turn up quite obviously hungover, dishevelled and proceed to brandish the textbook he wrote himself around like it was the bible while ranting on about 'saboteurs'. The students used to cram in for this glorious free entertainment and would bait him on to ever-higher realms of crazed behaviour. He was barred from every pub with miles of the campus for various acts of outrageousness.

Standard fare?

[Strewelpeter]

But it does talk about the lack of knowledge of the workers who received the vouchers and how they didn't realise the value they had, which was my general point. I'm sorry if you assumed the chicken story was a factual quote from the time period rather than a lighthearted embellishment. I do remember the guy who presented the study though talking about people handing out crates of vodka for shares. And my general explanation clearly wasn't 'urban myth' as that (and any number of articles from the time) attest.

According to my sources, people who were there at the time, the idea that workers ever had any meaningful chance to get ownership is pure fantasy. Every industry and sector was different but almost everything was a simple carve up between local management (mostly party apparatchiks), military, Kremlin and the exiles who could source the mighty dollar.

The difference between the way these things were handled in Ukraine and Russia particularly in regards to agriculture and land ownership is probably a significant part of why we are where we are now.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

According to my sources, people who were there at the time, the idea that workers ever had any meaningful chance to get ownership is pure fantasy. Every industry and sector was different but almost everything was a simple carve up between local management (mostly party apparatchiks), military, Kremlin and the exiles who could source the mighty dollar.

The difference between the way these things were handled in Ukraine and Russia particularly in regards to agriculture and land ownership is probably a significant part of why we are where we are now.

Sure. The system was designed to fail. But that was the problem. The intention of Yeltsin, in particular, was quite nobel in principle. He wanted, under international pressure, to create this modern capitalist system where everyone was an owner. The vouchers were given directly to factory workers. They just didn't educate the workers on the value of what they were given, or design in safeguards.

I'm not sure Ukraine is a good comparison, given they had a reasonably similar rise of oligarchs.

Maybe a good comparison is Japan post-WW2. Under Wolf Ladejinsky, the US forced completely democratic land distribution, and designed in a huge number of safeguards to prevent landowners re-accumulating land by taking advantage of un-educated individual land plot owners. The Russian scheme didn't incorporate these safeguards, meaning the rise of a few powerful business owners playing on information asymmetry was almost pre-ordained.

China also did the same in terms of forcing even distribution of land, albeit that the Chinese approach was much more brutal and bloodstained, but also laid the groundwork for their economic expansion.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

Not aimed at you obviously, but are economists generally considered to be some of the nuttier academics out there? (or maybe it's just academia generally that turns people screwy)

I have fond memories of my economics classes in UCD (some of the few classes I bothered attending in my B.Comm) where Dessie Norton would turn up quite obviously hungover, dishevelled and proceed to brandish the textbook he wrote himself around like it was the bible while ranting on about 'saboteurs'. The students used to cram in for this glorious free entertainment and would bait him on to ever-higher realms of crazed behaviour. He was barred from every pub with miles of the campus for various acts of outrageousness.

Standard fare?

Economists in particular are oddballs. But, yeah, people who act normal in academia are an absolute rarity. I suspect PhD programmes exist largely to weed out odd characters from the workplace and keep them in a safe place.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

Computer upgraded to Windows 11 recently and shockingly ... its almost good.

[Silver-Tiger]

I learned about Hitch's tale of how Oligarch's made their money through listening to Red Notice by Bill Browder. Great true story that plays out like a thriller. The vouchers that the Oligarchs were hoovering up were actual physical vouchers! A few grand here or a car there for them, It's fucking nuts. Of course Browder got rich from being one of the first investors to spot opportunity in Russia and it drove them up the wall. Everyone named in it. It's class.

Browder has been a good commentator this week

SPOILER

First half of the book is really really great. Insane when the money starts rolling. Second half feels like an extra long Eulogy for his friend Sergei Magnetzky for whom he clearly feels a lot of guilt. But the Magnetzky act on the back of his death is clearly topical this week too.

[Raoul Duke III]

There is going to be some market in secondhand yachts and private jets.

I think I prefer this one to the one the Germans nabbed yesterday.

[oleras]

Danny was kind enough last week to share a hi-res file of his Keel Beach photograph.

Finished product arrived today, beyond happy !

PXL-20220303-112710289.jpg

PXL-20220303-112817113.jpg

[Mellor]

Most people know absolutely nothing about investment. My parents, life long investors, still think in terms of stock market value based on the price of shares. As in, they think a share of one company costing €0.01 per share is much better value than a share of another company costing €40. They still haven't grasped the concept of market capitalisation. It has been widely shown that common investors suffer from these stupid perspectives and that this costs then money.

Even the average professional investor can be pretty dumb. A lot trade actively through overconfidence and end up underperforming the market.

So the average clued-in investor is pretty stupid when it comes to investment.

So ... how absolutely completely bone-headed stupid about investment value do you think the average person who had spent their entire life working on a factory production line, with no education, under a system of communism, was about the investment value of a voucher they had been given?

I think it's not beyond the bounds of assumption, to think ... pretty fucking stupid.

It's one thing to say the average person doesn't grasp the intricate details of investment, or that people perform sub-optimally or make errors.
It's very different to play up to the hollywood meme of the dumb Ruskie - who just wants a chicken because he can't eat paper. Again which is what I think SP was getting at.
I absolutely agree that they were strong armed into shty sales because they couldn't grasp how shitty the deals were.

As an aside, anyone who think a €0.01 share is inherently better value than a €40 share is not a clued-in investor. That is pretty much the approach for a degenerate ape on WallStreetBets

[Hectorjelly]

Unit bias is pretty strong.

[Iago]

Guys I am probably overstepping my profile here as a lurker, but what is great about IPB and the small number of similar sites is the polar opposite views, the outrageously different perspectives, the banter that comes from that and that leads up to every reader/contributor feeling they now have the measure of any situation (and mostly being wrong about that but that's life). So....

I do sense a growing intolerance at times I think we have to watch. I hope HH doesn't mind me using his posts and the responses to as an example the last week or so. I find his posts interesting and that's not to say I agree with some or many but I do think we should ensure tolerance levels are always high and let conversation flow

I agree that tolerance is important, as is engaging everyone equally and honestly in terms of your world view v's theirs.

As long as we don't go down the road of 'everyone's opinion is equally relevant' because no, it isn't.

In my opinion (see what I did there) this is one of the biggest issues in the world right now, and sure that makes me part of illuminati/onepercenters/arthurites using the violence inherent in the system to beat down on the proletariat...but what it doesn't do is make me wrong

[Mellor]

Unit bias is pretty strong.

Sure, which is why people think that Bitcoin is too costly and its pointless to invest $100 in Bitcoin, and the value is a $100 of some shitecoin. Where it obviously has no bearing on EV.
But I'd attribute that mostly to an aversion to fractional/decimal shares, and wanting to have whole units. And I'd assume (total guess) that it goes away when dealing with multiple units in both options. Maybe not, but again I'd still say it not a sign of being clued in.

[eamonhonda]

We flew to Biarritz and it's an hour from there

Any food must dos? Heading there end of April

[Raoul Duke III]

Any food must dos? Heading there end of April

Basically the whole town.

The old city is cool but we actually found the best food was just over the river in Gros (near the beach), where we stayed.

Don't bother with restaurants; the best food is in the bars.