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    Got sent ads for 'vegan cactus sneakers'.

    Google is amongst us here Tar.
    "We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."

    Comment


      Originally posted by Denny Crane View Post

      Is just using a credit card not an option for that segment of the market?

      Why pay interest when you can get a 56 day free overdraft?


      This sounds like asking why are people that are bad with money not bad with with money in a different way, because they are bad with money. Anybody I know that needs stuff like that will just end up paying even more by not paying things back on time, the kind of people that still pay for subscriptions years after they've stopped using them.

      Comment


        Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To... View Post
        There was an awkward sentiment expressed in an unfortunate death earlier in the week of someone who have fallen off a bus and died "woman who fell off bus 'died doing what she loved' ", The notable thing was that the story headline was later amended to avoid the unfortunate conclusion that what she loved doing was falling off busses, to 'died doing what she loved: having fun and meeting people'
        Gone full 'Glinner' since June 2022.

        Comment


          Originally posted by Tar.Aldarion View Post

          This sounds like asking why are people that are bad with money not bad with with money in a different way, because they are bad with money. Anybody I know that needs stuff like that will just end up paying even more by not paying things back on time, the kind of people that still pay for subscriptions years after they've stopped using them.
          Exactly, you're creating dependency aka 'sustainable business model. It's predatory.
          "We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."

          Comment


            Originally posted by dinekes View Post

            "He was too good for dis wurdled"
            Has there been any backstory revelations? Drunk, depressed etc?
            "We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."

            Comment


              Looking at the US covid stats and they're back up at 1,000 deaths a day - this time preventable deaths as it's primarily the unvaccinated.

              GOP governors like De Santis and Abbott doubling down on banning mask mandates and sending out messages condoning vaccine hesitancy. Gonna be a long winter.

              Is Trippie still around? Be interesting to get his Lone Star take.

              "We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."

              Comment


                Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To... View Post

                I don't know? I was turned down for a credit card a few months ago. There's a really fucked up Irish credit scene. Plus a credit card *might* be more expensive, with the annual fee, charges, interest.
                Anyone with a credit card paying anything other than the €30 (?) Gov fee is doing it wrong IMO.

                Comment


                  Originally posted by Solksjaer! View Post
                  Sunday morning musings .
                  Not being funny but if driving on the motorway these days surely the safest lane is the middle one . If a car coming the wrong way youve a choice of two lanes to swerve into giving you better odds ? The slow lane also the likely lane the errand driver hits the motorway on. ????
                  Would it not be the fast lane though? I.e. their leftmost lane.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Tar.Aldarion View Post

                    This sounds like asking why are people that are bad with money not bad with with money in a different way, because they are bad with money. Anybody I know that needs stuff like that will just end up paying even more by not paying things back on time, the kind of people that still pay for subscriptions years after they've stopped using them.
                    The practical solution though is not: can everyone just handle their money better. The more you prevent access to financial solutions the more people turn to unregulated solutions that are far more expensive. That's what I like about the Revolut idea - it's tied to actual earnings, and it has a very low cost. It's not perfect, as people are still using money that they should ideally be storing up for bigger expenses, but it's better than the other solutions available.
                    ​​​​​​
                    "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

                    Comment


                      The worthies would have you believe that credit union loans are the solution. But they so much are not. Ridiculous levels of admin and complex rigid repayments. The reason why Provident were once so popular was because despite their massive interest cost they made everything exceedingly simple for the user. The proper access to money solution are things like the payday loan idea of Revolut and the pay-in-installment idea of Klarna. Exceedingly user friendly. Or we could just increase the minimum wage and lower housing costs, but those ideas are surprisingly less popular with the people who want to say how poor people should handle their limited money.
                      "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by ComradeCollie View Post
                        Now you are talking. I challenge anyone to watch this video and not well up when the lyrics pierce ol uncle Seymours heart. raw lyrics, Townes was the master of it and right up to his death he was cutting people up. I'd imagine the old wild west cowboys would have worshiped him .

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by ComradeCollie
                          See you in another 26 years... Cunt . Taking her kids for their vaccines at 4. Couldn't have told me that like yesterday? Women
                          FYP

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by Gimmeabreak
                            Sunday morning music has to be The Collins Collection on RTE Radio 1. Brilliant show without fail.
                            Really enjoyed Thomas Walsh on it this morning great stuff towards the end where they were getting into the detail of the songwriting





                            @laz
                            that's a fairly watery version of how I got to Memphis I'd be either going for the original by Tom T Hall or the greatest version by Solomon Burke







                            Turning millions into thousands

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by Solksjaer! View Post
                              Sunday morning musings .
                              Not being funny but if driving on the motorway these days surely the safest lane is the middle one . If a car coming the wrong way youve a choice of two lanes to swerve into giving you better odds ? The slow lane also the likely lane the errand driver hits the motorway on. ????
                              It really only helps on the rare occasion that you are the leader of the traffic and have a clear sight line of say 1000 metres ahead of you. Even then how much reaction time does it give you - you at 100kph, the other car at maybe 150kph coming at you. (I don't know, I'm no good at those travelling in opposite direction when will they meet maths puzzles).
                              But even if you are able to move lane then doesn't the crash just happen with the car that's 50 metres behind you who clearly has absolutely no chance of reacting in time. And unfortunately that second car might be you.

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by Strewelpeter View Post

                                Really enjoyed Thomas Walsh on it this morning great stuff towards the end where they were getting into the detail of the songwriting





                                @laz
                                that's a fairly watery version of how I got to Memphis I'd be either going for the original by Tom T Hall or the greatest version by Solomon Burke






                                Hadn't heard that Solomon Burke version, class.

                                I think the silly video took somewhat from that Karl Blau version, I really love it.
                                I hold silver in tit for tat, and I love you for that

                                Comment


                                  Originally posted by Solksjaer! View Post
                                  Sunday morning musings .
                                  Not being funny but if driving on the motorway these days surely the safest lane is the middle one . If a car coming the wrong way youve a choice of two lanes to swerve into giving you better odds ? The slow lane also the likely lane the errand driver hits the motorway on. ????
                                  If you are worrying about cars coming at you on the motorway you are worrying about the wrong thing. There have been just the two driving the wrong way incidents recently one criminal vermin and the other sounds like a murder suicide. Every single day there are still thousands of people getting into cars under the influence of drink and drugs.
                                  Turning millions into thousands

                                  Comment


                                    Jesus, what's app group I'm in someone posted a vid of a woman surrounded by armed Taliban.She is initially standing and is made to kneel and then a bearded scum starts talking to the crowd of armed thugs presumably accusing her of something. This goes on for about 2 mins then abruptly another bearded piece of filth scum takes out a revolver and shoots her in the head.

                                    Comment


                                      Originally posted by Solksjaer! View Post
                                      Sunday morning musings .
                                      Not being funny but if driving on the motorway these days surely the safest lane is the middle one . If a car coming the wrong way youve a choice of two lanes to swerve into giving you better odds ? The slow lane also the likely lane the errand driver hits the motorway on. ????
                                      The programming for decisions like these in self driving vehicles will be interesting.
                                      Happiness is not a goal; it is a by-product. ~Eleanor Roosevelt

                                      Comment


                                        Originally posted by dinekes View Post
                                        Jesus, what's app group I'm in someone posted a vid of a woman surrounded by armed Taliban.She is initially standing and is made to kneel and then a bearded scum starts talking to the crowd of armed thugs presumably accusing her of something. This goes on for about 2 mins then abruptly another bearded piece of filth scum takes out a revolver and shoots her in the head.
                                        I think u watched 2 much of that video

                                        Comment


                                          Originally posted by Tar.Aldarion View Post

                                          I'm not counting calories but I eat a lot of low calorie food anyway. I'm just walking a lot and 2 hours of football a week. I guess I walk something like 1200+ calories a day so would have been eating 1900+. Find out your BMR + movement/exercise calories and need to be at -1000 eaten per day for that goal.
                                          that's about 30/40k steps per day. Some going if right!

                                          Comment


                                            Originally posted by balfejohn View Post

                                            I think u watched 2 much of that video
                                            2 minutes too much. And whoever sent it should be struck off from all social media feeds.
                                            "We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."

                                            Comment


                                              Originally posted by balfejohn View Post

                                              I think u watched 2 much of that video
                                              Yeah, not sure i stay in that group for much longer.

                                              Comment


                                                Originally posted by Strewelpeter View Post

                                                If you are worrying about cars coming at you on the motorway you are worrying about the wrong thing. There have been just the two driving the wrong way incidents recently one criminal vermin and the other sounds like a murder suicide. Every single day there are still thousands of people getting into cars under the influence of drink and drugs.
                                                Thousands everyday? Why are Gardai only convicting about 150-200 per week?
                                                Jayzus, Sheila! I forgot me feckin' trousers

                                                Comment


                                                  Originally posted by Pat Mustard View Post

                                                  Thousands everyday? Why are Gardai only convicting about 150-200 per week?
                                                  You really think they catch a significant %

                                                  If they were catching that many out of the pool of regs there would be no one left with a license doing it after a couple of months.
                                                  Turning millions into thousands

                                                  Comment


                                                    Originally posted by Degag View Post

                                                    Yeah, not sure i stay in that group for much longer.
                                                    Probably from 15 years ago, if its verified as current it will make the news tonight.
                                                    Turning millions into thousands

                                                    Comment


                                                      Originally posted by Strewelpeter View Post

                                                      If you are worrying about cars coming at you on the motorway you are worrying about the wrong thing. There have been just the two driving the wrong way incidents recently one criminal vermin and the other sounds like a murder suicide. Every single day there are still thousands of people getting into cars under the influence of drink and drugs.
                                                      Musings are not worries . There have been 3 incidents recently .

                                                      Comment


                                                        Originally posted by Pat Mustard View Post

                                                        Thousands everyday? Why are Gardai only convicting about 150-200 per week?
                                                        Oh theres at least 'thousands'.
                                                        "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

                                                        Comment


                                                          Originally posted by Strewelpeter View Post

                                                          Probably from 15 years ago, if its verified as current it will make the news tonight.
                                                          Yep. And WhatsApp could easily stamp out that type of crap.
                                                          "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

                                                          Comment


                                                            Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To... View Post

                                                            Yep. And WhatsApp could easily stamp out that type of crap.
                                                            No they can't, it's end-to-end encrypted. They have no idea what any data passing through is. Just a stream of 1s and 0s.
                                                            "I can’t find anyone who agrees with what I write or think these days, so I guess I must be getting closer to the truth." - Hunter S. Thompson

                                                            Comment


                                                              Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To... View Post

                                                              Yep. And WhatsApp could easily stamp out that type of crap.
                                                              how?

                                                              Comment


                                                                Originally posted by balfejohn View Post

                                                                I think u watched 2 much of that video
                                                                True that. Just kind of wasnt thinking about what was going on in a distracted way.

                                                                Shocked me out of my safe little world.
                                                                just trying to get my head around the oppressive horror of living under that regime .

                                                                Comment


                                                                  Originally posted by Emmet View Post

                                                                  how?
                                                                  If they routed everything via Russia Putin's goons could read every message
                                                                  Turning millions into thousands

                                                                  Comment


                                                                    Originally posted by AndyFatBastard View Post

                                                                    No they can't, it's end-to-end encrypted. They have no idea what any data passing through is. Just a stream of 1s and 0s.
                                                                    Thats not quite right though, is it? These viral videos are known by the platform, that's why they have a warning saying 'this video has been forwarded many times' - not quite 1s and 0s (although everything on the internet is 1s and 0s, but I'm writing it as you intend it to mean something anonymous). So they know the viral videos. That's why in countries like India, WhatsApp has been forced to limit the forwarding of frequently forwarded messages as it was creating misinformation. They can easily do that in other countries, and they don't need to know the precise content to do this. They could also observe frequently forwarded messages and check the content. They've decided not to do this, but that is a decision they have made - precisely because some viral videos, even if harmful to society, add value to their platform. Its a decision they have made though and it can be changed.
                                                                    "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

                                                                    Comment


                                                                      Originally posted by Strewelpeter View Post

                                                                      If they routed everything via Russia Putin's goons could read every message
                                                                      I can't imagine Russia has anywhere near the capability of Biden's goons. The wikileaks leaks a few years ago showed every internet cable coming into Ireland is breached by Five Eyes for the NSA. Actually with the willing obligesse of the Irish internet companies - I think Imagine was mentioned?
                                                                      "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

                                                                      Comment


                                                                        Originally posted by Emmet View Post

                                                                        how?
                                                                        Maybe a suitable analogy is:

                                                                        A museum guard knows his accomplices are planning to rob the museum. So he ties himself up and when questioned afterwards about how he didn't attempt to stop the robbery he claims what could he have done, he was tied up?

                                                                        WhatsApp has made design choices to allow dodgy behaviour and can't then use those design choices as an excuse for how the behaviour is inevitable on their platform. They feed off viral videos, which have a decent likelihood of being false, and so have set things up to allow these videos to be passed along unimpeded and to claim it is nothing to do with them.
                                                                        "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

                                                                        Comment


                                                                          Why are Limerick allowed have three more players on the pitch than Cork?
                                                                          Turning millions into thousands

                                                                          Comment


                                                                            Originally posted by dinekes View Post
                                                                            Jesus, what's app group I'm in someone posted a vid of a woman surrounded by armed Taliban.She is initially standing and is made to kneel and then a bearded scum starts talking to the crowd of armed thugs presumably accusing her of something. This goes on for about 2 mins then abruptly another bearded piece of filth scum takes out a revolver and shoots her in the head.
                                                                            Send that on to Lazare, he loves getting all those WhatsApp chain messages

                                                                            Comment


                                                                              Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To... View Post

                                                                              Thats not quite right though, is it? These viral videos are known by the platform, that's why they have a warning saying 'this video has been forwarded many times' - not quite 1s and 0s (although everything on the internet is 1s and 0s, but I'm writing it as you intend it to mean something anonymous). So they know the viral videos. That's why in countries like India, WhatsApp has been forced to limit the forwarding of frequently forwarded messages as it was creating misinformation. They can easily do that in other countries, and they don't need to know the precise content to do this. They could also observe frequently forwarded messages and check the content. They've decided not to do this, but that is a decision they have made - precisely because some viral videos, even if harmful to society, add value to their platform. Its a decision they have made though and it can be changed.
                                                                              https://faq.whatsapp.com/general/cha...imits/?lang=en

                                                                              It absolutely is true. Whatsapp metadata contains information about the sending of messages / times forwarded without any information whatsoever about the payload.

                                                                              Whatsapp (and Signal / Telegram) are built on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signal_Protocol
                                                                              Last edited by Emmet; 22-08-21, 15:32.

                                                                              Comment


                                                                                Originally posted by Emmet View Post

                                                                                https://faq.whatsapp.com/general/cha...imits/?lang=en

                                                                                It absolutely is true. Whatsapp metadata contains information about the sending of messages / times forwarded without any information whatsoever about the payload.

                                                                                Whatsapp (and Signal / Telegram) are built on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signal_Protocol
                                                                                You do get the point though that they've designed it like this to allow dodgy videos to be forwarded that they can wipe their hands of? Its a design choice, so its fully in their control to come up with an alternative design that doesn't allow this. For example they could allow reporting of any message, that would allow flags to be attached to messages that could then be used to stop those messages being forwarded. But that would be a bit like OnlyFans banning sex workers.
                                                                                "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

                                                                                Comment


                                                                                  Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To... View Post

                                                                                  You do get the point though that they've designed it like this to allow dodgy videos to be forwarded that they can wipe their hands of? Its a design choice, so its fully in their control to come up with an alternative design that doesn't allow this. For example they could allow reporting of any message, that would allow flags to be attached to messages that could then be used to stop those messages being forwarded. But that would be a bit like OnlyFans banning sex workers.
                                                                                  Twitter and Facebook are designed in a way that allows them to be moderated but WhatsApp isn't, are you saying you think it should be
                                                                                  Turning millions into thousands

                                                                                  Comment


                                                                                    Originally posted by Strewelpeter View Post

                                                                                    Twitter and Facebook are designed in a way that allows them to be moderated but WhatsApp isn't, are you saying you think it should be
                                                                                    If hitch had his way we'd all be under Chinas Great firewall

                                                                                    Comment


                                                                                      Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To... View Post

                                                                                      You do get the point though that they've designed it like this to allow dodgy videos to be forwarded that they can wipe their hands of? Its a design choice, so its fully in their control to come up with an alternative design that doesn't allow this. For example they could allow reporting of any message, that would allow flags to be attached to messages that could then be used to stop those messages being forwarded. But that would be a bit like OnlyFans banning sex workers.
                                                                                      As a simple experiment, instead of using the "forward message" in Whatsapp, save the file locally, and then create a new message with only it in it, and see that you can forward as many times as you want.

                                                                                      It's that simple to get around the forward flags contained in the meta data.

                                                                                      Due to how end-to-end encryption works, an identical payload can be sent between A and B as is sent between X and Y, yet A and B have a cat video from it, and X and Y are sending PDFs of how to make bombs.

                                                                                      Not sure what any perceived benefit of flagging anything as inappropriate would do.
                                                                                      Last edited by Emmet; 22-08-21, 16:10.

                                                                                      Comment


                                                                                        Originally posted by Strewelpeter View Post

                                                                                        Twitter and Facebook are designed in a way that allows them to be moderated but WhatsApp isn't, are you saying you think it should be
                                                                                        Sure. A modicum of moderation. Like being able to flag posts and that allows those posts to be evaluated and if deemed inappropriate those messages cant be forwarded. Why not? Its a cesspit of misinformation.
                                                                                        "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

                                                                                        Comment


                                                                                          Originally posted by Emmet View Post

                                                                                          As a simple experiment, instead of using the "forward message" in Whatsapp, save the file locally, and then create a new message with only it in it, and see that you can forward as many times as you want.

                                                                                          It's that simple to get around the forward flags contained in the meta data.

                                                                                          Due to how end-to-end encryption works, an identical payload can be sent between A and B as is sent between X and Y, yet A and B have a cat video from it, and X and Y are sending PDFs of how to make bombs.

                                                                                          Not sure what any perceived benefit of flagging anything as inappropriate would do.
                                                                                          Yep. But most people won't do that. So it will end up not being forwarded as much.
                                                                                          "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

                                                                                          Comment


                                                                                            Originally posted by Hectorjelly View Post

                                                                                            If hitch had his way we'd all be under Chinas Great firewall
                                                                                            As long as my particular brands of pornographic fetish are still allowed, then sure bring on the firewall.
                                                                                            "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

                                                                                            Comment


                                                                                              There's no parts of any of our communication where we have a presumed right to absolute privacy, why would we have it just in messaging, and mainly to allow the forwarding of fake news?

                                                                                              Imagine - if you will - a video of your kid, now a teenager, doing something stupid with another kid in a back of a taxi. The taxi driver has it filmed unbeknownst to you. Out it goes onto WhatsApp and makes its way through thousands of groups, no mechanism in place to stop it. Or maybe there should be a mechanism to stop it? That someone could see it and go - that's clearly inappropriate. Flag it - off it goes to WhatsApp HQ in Grand Canal Dock and they go - these people could not possibly have given their permission for their image to be used in this way. Block all further forwarding of this message. Alert the police to the details of the original uploader. Why should we not have those rights, or our kids? Why should Mark in SanFran be able to say that our kids shouldn't have their EU-given GDPR rights to their own image?

                                                                                              (the video of the back of the taxi story is based on an approximation of a real one currently happening in Northern Ireland, just for added pointedness).
                                                                                              Last edited by Hitchhiker's Guide To...; 22-08-21, 16:30.
                                                                                              "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

                                                                                              Comment


                                                                                                Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To... View Post

                                                                                                Sure. A modicum of moderation. Like being able to flag posts and that allows those posts to be evaluated and if deemed inappropriate those messages cant be forwarded. Why not? Its a cesspit of misinformation.
                                                                                                How? The keys to unlock the message are on the sender and receivers' phones only.

                                                                                                You can't 'raise something to a moderator' if they cannot see the content. You forwarding the content doesn't prove that's what was sent to you either, as once again, the WhatsApp server doesn't see the payload. You could attach anything you wanted back in with the previous metadata if you were so inclined.

                                                                                                What you're suggesting is that WhatsApp move away from basing their communication on an end to end encrypted protocol and instead become a mass surveillance outfit. Gas that you then start talking about GDPR given that it would explicitly prevent what you are suggesting!

                                                                                                Comment




                                                                                                  Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To... View Post
                                                                                                  The worthies would have you believe that credit union loans are the solution. But they so much are not. Ridiculous levels of admin and complex rigid repayments.The reason why Provident were once so popular was because despite their massive interest cost they made everything exceedingly simple for the user. The proper access to money solution are things like the payday loan idea of Revolut and the pay-in-installment idea of Klarna. Exceedingly user friendly. Or we could just increase the minimum wage and lower housing costs, but those ideas are surprisingly less popular with the people who want to say how poor people should handle their limited money.
                                                                                                  Where are you getting the bolded bit from? I'm not saying they are a solution to anything but I've had dozens of credit union loans over the years and each application was super straight forward with cheque/cash/deposit to my bank account usually within a day or two. The repayments are somewhat up to you in that you get to choose weekly or monthly and the you request a certain time frame at the time of the loan application but you can always pay it off early at no extra cost. I've paid off pretty much every credit union loan I've ever got early and there was never an issue.

                                                                                                  Comment


                                                                                                    Originally posted by Emmet View Post

                                                                                                    How? The keys to unlock the message are on the sender and receivers' phones only.

                                                                                                    You can't 'raise something to a moderator' if they cannot see the content. You forwarding the content doesn't prove that's what was sent to you either, as once again, the WhatsApp server doesn't see the payload. You could attach anything you wanted back in with the previous metadata if you were so inclined.

                                                                                                    What you're suggesting is that WhatsApp move away from basing their communication on an end to end encrypted protocol and instead become a mass surveillance outfit. Gas that you then start talking about GDPR given that it would explicitly prevent what you are suggesting!
                                                                                                    It's got zero to do with GDPR for WhatsApp to moderate illegal content. Absolutely zero GDPR implication. They've designed their app to allow viral news, a lot of it fake, because that creates more stickiness and therefore more money eventually.
                                                                                                    "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

                                                                                                    Comment


                                                                                                      Originally posted by Lao Lao View Post



                                                                                                      Where are you getting the bolded bit from? I'm not saying they are a solution to anything but I've had dozens of credit union loans over the years and each application was super straight forward with cheque/cash/deposit to my bank account usually within a day or two. The repayments are somewhat up to you in that you get to choose weekly or monthly and the you request a certain time frame at the time of the loan application but you can always pay it off early at no extra cost. I've paid off pretty much every credit union loan I've ever got early and there was never an issue.
                                                                                                      A lot of those things - paper applications, cheques, standing orders, APRs, going into a branch to speak to someone or authority are things that we know people from poor backgrounds are very uncomfortable about. That's why something like Provident was so successful it removed almost everyone of those things.
                                                                                                      "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

                                                                                                      Comment




                                                                                                        Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To... View Post

                                                                                                        A lot of those things - paper applications, cheques, standing orders, APRs, going into a branch to speak to someone or authority are things that we know people from poor backgrounds are very uncomfortable about. That's why something like Provident was so successful it removed almost everyone of those things.

                                                                                                        You can apply online for credit union loans. They give you an option of how to get the money, cheque/cash/transfer to a bank account so a cheque is not required. You also don't have to set up a standing order. You can just make a transfer each month from you bank account to your credit union account. Everything can be done online without ever having to go into a branch or speak to anybody, whether they are in authority or not.

                                                                                                        Comment


                                                                                                          Originally posted by Lao Lao View Post




                                                                                                          You can apply online for credit union loans. They give you an option of how to get the money, cheque/cash/transfer to a bank account so a cheque is not required. You also don't have to set up a standing order. You can just make a transfer each month from you bank account to your credit union account. Everything can be done online without ever having to go into a branch or speak to anybody, whether they are in authority or not.
                                                                                                          Well then people don't know it. As they've been offering special loans aimed at people with low resources for a few years and have had almost no uptake. They are clearly doing something absolutely wrong. And it's not lack of publicity. Also the system as you have redescribed it is still far too complex.

                                                                                                          Plus not all credit unions work like you say. I had to go into a branch to open an account and now have to go back in as they forgot to give me an online pin number. They've four different types of loans that look a bit complicated. It's a real thing - financial terminology and system intimidation - that's why people keep going for options that are worse for them - because those worse organisations have simplified matters enough because they understand the people.

                                                                                                          And interestingly even you that understands the system and were baffled why people weren't using the simple system first chose to use all the terms that are complex to understand to describe it. I'd say credit unions do the same, and don't user test their interfaces and processes with representative populations.
                                                                                                          "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

                                                                                                          Comment




                                                                                                            Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To... View Post

                                                                                                            Well then people don't know it. As they've been offering special loans aimed at people with low resources for a few years and have had almost no uptake. They are clearly doing something absolutely wrong. And it's not lack of publicity. Also the system as you have redescribed it is still far too complex.

                                                                                                            Plus not all credit unions work like you say. I had to go into a branch to open an account and now have to go back in as they forgot to give me an online pin number. They've four different types of loans that look a bit complicated. It's a real thing - financial terminology and system intimidation - that's why people keep going for options that are worse for them - because those worse organisations have simplified matters enough because they understand the people.

                                                                                                            And interestingly even you that understands the system and were baffled why people weren't using the simple system first chose to use all the terms that are complex to understand to describe it. I'd say credit unions do the same, and don't user test their interfaces and processes with representative populations.

                                                                                                            Why do you constantly try to argue things you don't seem to know much on? It's completely and utterly baffling.

                                                                                                            You've changed your argument on this one a few times now. From being paper based applications, to people not knowing that you can apply online. Now, you're trying to say that I used terms that were complex to understand? Can you very clearly highlight the terms I used that were so taxing on the brain?

                                                                                                            Seriously, it's OK to not know everything about everything.

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                                                                                                              The two things are quite related.

                                                                                                              WhatsApp delivers a video of a poor woman being beheaded and we exclaim about how we couldn't possibly change the way WhatsApp works

                                                                                                              Credit Unions develop a product for poor people that a recent government report found had almost no uptake and we exclaim about how great the credit unions are and there's no need for new credit services for poor people.

                                                                                                              Defaults are hard to change!

                                                                                                              "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

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                                                                                                                Originally posted by Lao Lao View Post




                                                                                                                Why do you constantly try to argue things you don't seem to know much on? It's completely and utterly baffling.

                                                                                                                You've changed your argument on this one a few times now. From being paper based applications, to people not knowing that you can apply online. Now, you're trying to say that I used terms that were complex to understand? Can you very clearly highlight the terms I used that were so taxing on the brain?

                                                                                                                Seriously, it's OK to not know everything about everything.
                                                                                                                This is literally my area of expertise Financial behaviour and how people make financial decisions. Not that it means much outside of academia, but I'm the editor of the main research journal in the area and we frequently publish research on the topic.

                                                                                                                And I haven't changed my thoughts on the matter. There are paper based issue and online issues.

                                                                                                                https://www.journals.elsevier.com/jo...mental-finance
                                                                                                                "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

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                                                                                                                  Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To... View Post

                                                                                                                  This is literally my area of expertise Financial behaviour and how people make financial decisions. Not that it means much outside of academia, but I'm the editor of the main research journal in the area and we frequently publish research on the topic.

                                                                                                                  And I haven't changed my thoughts on the matter. There are paper based issue and online issues.

                                                                                                                  https://www.journals.elsevier.com/jo...mental-finance
                                                                                                                  I'll leave it to Tar to explain in future!

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                                                                                                                    Originally posted by Lao Lao View Post

                                                                                                                    I'll leave it to Tar to explain in future!
                                                                                                                    I feel Tar wouldn't mind me saying on his behalf that users need to use a service in order for it to be useful!
                                                                                                                    "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

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                                                                                                                      Originally posted by Lao Lao View Post




                                                                                                                      Why do you constantly try to argue things you don't seem to know much on? It's completely and utterly baffling.

                                                                                                                      You've changed your argument on this one a few times now. From being paper based applications, to people not knowing that you can apply online. Now, you're trying to say that I used terms that were complex to understand? Can you very clearly highlight the terms I used that were so taxing on the brain?

                                                                                                                      Seriously, it's OK to not know everything about everything.
                                                                                                                      Knowledge vs applied knowledge.
                                                                                                                      "We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."

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                                                                                                                        Originally posted by Raoul Duke III View Post

                                                                                                                        Knowledge vs applied knowledge.
                                                                                                                        Not in this case. The applied knowledge is that nobody uses the loans, the knowledge is that they should be using them according to Lao Lao.
                                                                                                                        "We're not f*cking Burundi" - Big Phil

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                                                                                                                          Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To... View Post

                                                                                                                          Not in this case. The applied knowledge is that nobody uses the loans, the knowledge is that they should be using them according to Lao Lao.
                                                                                                                          Can you provide a link to the government report you mentioned above?

                                                                                                                          From Central Banks reports I've seen, loans were down in 2020 in credit unions which seems to be more Covid related as it reversed the trend of 2019 when loans were up.

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