Bad beat/Moaning/Venting thread - Wordle Gummidge

[Solksjaer!]

I'm still hoping for a docco on Showaddywaddy

Every girls crazy about a sharp dressed man

[Hectorjelly]

A lot of the direct impacts are hidden from consumers, ie the products are being shipped to manufacturers, who then either pass the costs on to consumers - or swallow them. But the main way to see the impact is in the Inflation prints.

This is US inflation - 5% is staggeringly high, although as we can see from LL posts there are good reasons that should be relatively temporary

Capture.PNG

[BennyHiFi]

Change of topic.

Benny ? Have you seen the Sparks brothers yet. I know you mentioned it.

No. Is it good? Must try and get to see it in the cinema but chance could be slim as I'm away again. Might have to wait for Netflix.

Got a ticket to see them in Vicar Street next April though.

[Tar.Aldarion]

mad to see how much the buying has increased, little else to do since covid for a lot of people, Amazon loving life. I don't think I've bought anything other than food since it started, not even clothes or anything for over a year, last purchase appears to be a shirt in March 2020.

[Degag]

Every girls crazy about a sharp dressed man

Maybe this is an ode to it but Dusty Hill passed away today.

Joey Jordison yesterday.

[Solksjaer!]

Maybe this is an ode to it but Dusty Hill passed away today.

Joey Jordison yesterday.

Was my tribute to him

[Hectorjelly]

Right, I may have mentioned some of this before so apologies if I am repeating myself, but here goes


Asia and in particular, China, is the manufacturing capital of the world. On any trade lane, there is generally a head-haul and a back haul lane to it. The head haul lane is the most dominant one with the back haul having less volume. Pretty much every lane out of Asia is the head haul lane as they are primarily an export focused region. They do, of course, import goods but from a container point of view, exports coming out of China are all laden containers whereas volumes coming in are a mixture of laden and empty containers.

When Covid (officially) hit China in February last year, the whole country closed down for approx six weeks. There was next to no manufacturing and next to no exports either. As China came out of lockdown in mid-March, most of the western world (Europe & USA) went into lockdown and a lot of buyers this side cancelled or postponed orders with their Asian suppliers. There was a genuine fear that there would be a global recession as a result of the pandemic and shipping lines moved swiftly to withdraw capacity (Container vessels) from the market to reflect the reduce amount of laden cargo moving in/out of Asia/EU/USA. This meant that freight rates didn't drop through the floor in the early part of the pandemic. It seems pretty basic, if demand drops, reduce supply, but this was really the first time that the shipping lines have managed to not only do it but do it so quickly. Part of the reason for this is that over the last 8-10 years, there has been a lot of mergers and acquisitions in the industry, and we have gone from about 20 global players to 8 or 9 and all these are now in three vessel sharing alliances. I'm not suggesting any collusion or anything, it's just easier for 3 bodies to reduce capacity without as much a chance as one player breaking ranks and cutting rates to go after market share than there was when there was 20 players. The buzzword phrase of late is "Less competition is less competition"

From May/June onwards, things started to pick up a bit and some capacity was added back into the market. In particular, retailers, started to notice sales going up and stock levels going down. There was a lot of talk about everyone would go all out for Christmas as it had been such a miserable year and people, mainly sitting at home doing nothing, started to buy more and more products as they couldn't pay for services as usual. The vast majority of these products are all made in China.

By September, the market was on fire, sales were through the roof in Europe and USA (plus other secondary markets - South America, Oz/NZ, Middle East) and pretty much all available capacity was back in play. There was just one problem, for months, empty containers hadn't been making their way back to Asia at the same rate they normally would (If a vessel doesn't leave Asia to go to Europe/USA, there is no vessel to go back in the opposite direction several weeks later) so there was severe equipment shortages and not enough to deal with the volume of demand. This caused backlogs and when that happens, rates only go one way.

Between then and Chinese New Year (mid-February 2021) shipping lines tried to do everything they could to get empty containers back to Asia as quick as possible, even to the point whereby they would sacrifice a back haul laden booking to send it back empty instead as they could reuse it quicker as a result. I say sacrifice, but the reality was that by sending it back empty and getting it moving on the head haul lane quicker, they made more money overall. But they just couldn’t keep up with the demand.

There was also no real alternative. The rail network from Asia to Europe is limited to what it can carry and, even if people were willing to pay air freight rates, the capacity in that market was extremely reduced due to the lack of people flying. In fact, there was some traditional air freight business shifting to ocean freight due to lack of capacity in the air market.

While this was all happening, ports in Europe and the USA were started to struggle with the volume arriving. Ports were not at full productivity, partially due to missing staff due to being out sick with Covid (Los Angeles got hit particularly badly) and partially due to new working rules around Covid, smaller crews, having to do a full deep clean down of all equipment in between shifts. This lead to congestion in the ports which led to even more delays in getting equipment back to Asia.

Shipping lines measure their turn time of containers. This is the time from when they give the exporter at origin the empty container until the time they get the empty container back at destination from the importer. Pre Covid, the global average turn time was 50 days. It now sits at 59 days. 9 days may not seem like much but to put it in perspective, the 5^th largest shipping line in the world has said that for every day the turn time increases by, they need to find 17,500 forty-foot containers to cover their global bookings – So, that’s just a shortage of 157,500 at any one time globally for one shipping line…

Back in Q3/early Q4 2020, most people thought that things would calm down after Chinese New Year. It is historically a quiet period for shipping and just how much money could people spend on products? Then we started to have 2^nd and 3^rd waves of Covid and people just didn’t stop buying and then we had the Suez Canal incident. That six-day delay on containers moving put huge strain on a supply chain that was almost at breaking point. Vessels were significantly delayed, which meant that containers could not get back to where they were needed as quick as they could. In addition, we had some severe bunching (when a lot of vessels all arrive at once) after they all got freed from the Suez which caused havoc in Europe and to a certain degree on the US East Coast. Vessels were so badly delayed getting back to Asia, that the sailing schedules were just cancelled or voided as there was no vessel there to sail as planned.

At this point, ports globally are at breaking point. Every single major (or even halfway major) port is congested from the avalanche of the containers arriving. The barge and feeder vessel system in Europe that is used to get containers out of the main ports to inland areas or outports (like Dublin) are overwhelmed and cannot handle the volumes. Similarly in the USA, the rail network which is used to get containers from the ports inland suffers the same faith.

Then, THEN, we have a Covid outbreak among port workers in Yantian port in Shenzhen, China at the end of May and the port is essentially shut down for an entire month. Yantian is the biggest port in South China and is usually top 3 in the world for volumes handled per annum at around seven million forty-foot containers. Twenty-five percent of all US imports come from the greater Shenzhen area. It causes chaos as vessel have to omit the port, so no exports leave and even worse, no import containers arrive. Attempts are made to divert cargo to other ports but there is very limited success due to restrictions of movement within districts due to Covid lockdown rules, slightly different customs processes and the other ports just not being able to deal with the volume that Yantian handles. Around mid-June, there was roughly a back log of cargo to fill two hundred thousand forty-foot containers that hadn’t shipped ex Yantian as planned. I didn’t look at the final number as it would be too depressing, but it definitely increased over the following two weeks.

Meanwhile in the USA, there has been wildfires in Canada and that has damaged rail lines and has added even more congestion to the already congested ports. The problem with shipping routes is that they don’t just call one origin port and one destination port. A sailing schedule will for example call, Qingdao, Ningbo, Shanghai, Yantian, Los Angeles, Oakland & Vancouver before heading back to Qingdao and starting all over again so if there is an issue in any of the ports, it has a knock-on effect on all the others.

Sure, this seems easy to fix, would ya not just make more containers or get more ships? Seems obvious but sadly, not possible. Over 90% of all shipping containers are made…. you guessed it, in China and by 3 state or semi state owned companies. During their first lockdown, they were closed and are as a result manufacturing of new containers is way behind schedule. Now, call me cynical but if there was such a demand, surely, they could operate around the clock, 3x8 hour shifts and get it sorted. Well yes and no – there is a limit to what they can make but also, due to the demand, the sale price of a new container has now doubled so why would you drive that price down by ramping up production and cost with all the over time? In fairness, they are trying to increase production but it’s just not enough.

On the vessel front, everything that can be done has been done. Pretty much, every available vessel is in use. The container vessel idle fleet is at ~2% and that makes up vessels that are either in dry docks for repairs or very small vessels that won’t make any significant impact to the problem. On top of this the cost to charter a vessel has gone through the roof. All shipping lines have a mix/match on their vessels, between what they own and what they charter. This allows them to scale up/down as needed as most charters are for 6-9 months or at least it used to be. Now ship owners are insisting on up two 24 months charter and the price is through the roof. To give you an example, a 5,000 TEU vessel (1 forty-foot container = 2 TEU) pre Covid would have cost about $15K per day to charter. I know one shipping line who had to walk away from the auction to charter a similar sized vessel when the asking rate got to $75K per day. We are seeing the really large vessels (19,000 TEU plus size) going for up to $160K per day. And that’s just for the bare bones of the vessel, it doesn’t include fuel, crew or anything else. Shipping lines have ordered new (after a few years of under investment) but they will not be built and enter the market until 2023 at the earliest.

So when does it all end? Right now, we can’t see much change happening before Q2 2022 (we did say this last year about this year..) but we are starting to see a slight difference between the main two markets ex Asia – Europe and USA. The demand into Europe is slowing – There is still large backlogs and lots of freight to move but the level of growth is reducing, for now. But we need to get the ports back to normal and have equipment flowing to sort out the fundamental issues. In order for this to happen, not only do people need to stop buying products at the rate we are, but we also need to allow time to let business replenish stock levels – The sales to inventory ratio for almost all retailers are very, very low.
On the USA side, there seems to be no let up in demand. Their growth is going up. This could be in part to the amount of stimulus cheques handed out or just that they are more of a consumer nation? But if things stay the same in the USA, it will impact all Asian origins which in turn will have an impact on Europe.

Can you pour me a stiff one please?

Do you mind me sharing this outside of IPB?

[ComradeCollie]

Change of topic.

Benny ? Have you seen the Sparks brothers yet. I know you mentioned it.

I'm planning on seeing it in the IFI on Friday lunchtime. No huge spoilers please, as I remember them as a 2 hit wonder, and the advert seems more Spinal Tap than Spinal Tap.

[rounders123]

Not a bad idea, I'd certainly watch this!

Where does this hated come from? Were you forced to play or watch it before?

I'm not sure tbh. But I never liked the obstruction element to it where a player looks to whack the ball but instead plays a soft shot and leaves his body impeding the other layer who was never getting there anyway. Some ref you never see decrees if it stands or not. In tennis you need to get it over the net and within the lines but here the main thing is to be a cunning sly dog.

And another thing, ive never seen a close game, its always some elite player trumping some ex hurler type. And there seems to be some unwritten rule that you cant celebrate a shot like you would in most other sports. You must win silently. Oh yeah and the squeaking is a bit of an annoyance too.

I've never played but would much rather play than spectate. But id modify the rule that if you play a sly dog shot you need to immediately gtf out of he way even to put yourself at a disadvantage. And sly dog shots are to be frowned upon.

[BennyHiFi]

I'm planning on seeing it in the IFI on Friday lunchtime. No huge spoilers please, as I remember them as a 2 hit wonder, and the advert seems more Spinal Tap than Spinal Tap.

Interested to hear what you think!

[Solksjaer!]

I'm planning on seeing it in the IFI on Friday lunchtime. No huge spoilers please, as I remember them as a 2 hit wonder, and the advert seems more Spinal Tap than Spinal Tap.

Must have been you talking about it. The opening to ' this town isnt big enough' is my fav . Infectious.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

I'm planning on seeing it in the IFI on Friday lunchtime. No huge spoilers please, as I remember them as a 2 hit wonder, and the advert seems more Spinal Tap than Spinal Tap.

On the IFI front, am going to see this tomorrow, to get back into the French sensibility. It looks ridiculously good.

[Lazare]

Fascinating post Lao Lao.

This may be a stupid question or incredibly ignorant of me (or likely both), but what was the real impact to the consumer? Or perhaps, where was it?

I ask as to me, everything seemed fine. Supermarkets, as such, didn’t run out of food (barring if i remember correctly, ‘niche’ items like mozzerella, rice cakes & pineapples - may be misremembering this!!)

I wouldn’t be a huge purchaser of items, but any clothing, electronics, books etc that i bought or considered buying, were available (barring, oddly a bread maker which someone recommended on here)

But maybe Ireland escaped somewhat for some reason and it hit other countries worse; or perhaps we were hit significantly but in ways that i wasn’t affected.

Our industry is ravaged with shortage of materials. Aluminium and electronic components mostly.

[Lazare]

You won't be able to buy a solar powered Velux blind anywhere in the world until next spring.

[Hectorjelly]

I'm going to this Sunday. Looking forward to it! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9Okx5teGBQ

[Tar.Aldarion]

Enjoy! I only go to Denis Villeneuve films in the cinema it seems, bring on Dune.

[DeadParrot]

Nobody can argue that the IPB collective are a clever bunch , however I'm surprised ye dont scribe your long posts elsewhere and paste them .

I do that as a matter of course. For spell check reasons if nothing else.
Also, depending on your browser the post may be cached. As well as that there is a restore/discard button too left of posting window when you return to an uncompleted post.

[balfejohn]

Fascinating post Lao Lao.

This may be a stupid question or incredibly ignorant of me (or likely both), but what was the real impact to the consumer? Or perhaps, where was it?

I ask as to me, everything seemed fine. Supermarkets, as such, didn’t run out of food (barring if i remember correctly, ‘niche’ items like mozzerella, rice cakes & pineapples - may be misremembering this!!)

I wouldn’t be a huge purchaser of items, but any clothing, electronics, books etc that i bought or considered buying, were available (barring, oddly a bread maker which someone recommended on here)

But maybe Ireland escaped somewhat for some reason and it hit other countries worse; or perhaps we were hit significantly but in ways that i wasn’t affected.

At the moment the building industry and sanitary ware industries are seeing negative effects from our Chinese brothers suffering from container famine
from images seen today Rotterdam port is overwhelmed by containers sitting waiting to be sent to all parts of Europe
Granite paving is one of the big sufferers in our business and toilets and shower trays in another part
next 2 months be very tight for anyone doing refurbs and new builds

[Solksjaer!]

I'm planning on seeing it in the IFI on Friday lunchtime. No huge spoilers please, as I remember them as a 2 hit wonder, and the advert seems more Spinal Tap than Spinal Tap.

Just booked 2 tickets for Sat. No huge spoilers please might take the eldest brother .

[DeadParrot]

Lovely: https://www.reddit.com/r/talesfromte...utoresponders/

I've actually had to deal with this exact scenario with a ticketing system.
Every mail to the ticket system created a response to all people on the mail to say
"Hi, you've created ticket xxx please click here to follow progress . "
If one of the people cc'd on the ticket had an out of office, it'd generate an email back to the ticketing system.
Which would create a new ticket and mail.
And repeat ad nauseam

[Lao Lao]

Fascinating post Lao Lao.

This may be a stupid question or incredibly ignorant of me (or likely both), but what was the real impact to the consumer? Or perhaps, where was it?

I ask as to me, everything seemed fine. Supermarkets, as such, didn’t run out of food (barring if i remember correctly, ‘niche’ items like mozzerella, rice cakes & pineapples - may be misremembering this!!)

I wouldn’t be a huge purchaser of items, but any clothing, electronics, books etc that i bought or considered buying, were available (barring, oddly a bread maker which someone recommended on here)

But maybe Ireland escaped somewhat for some reason and it hit other countries worse; or perhaps we were hit significantly but in ways that i wasn’t affected.

A few have already posted on some shortages but it's right across the board to be honest - obviously people/companies that can afford to pay more have been slightly less impacted but I think it will get worse over the next few months.

Whether companies can continue to absorb the increases in prices is unsure - It's probably unlikely. I know some customers that have already had to increase prices and renegotiate contracts.

Christmas could be a problem. There is definitely things like artificial trees & decorations that are late leaving China, how late they will be getting here could get interesting and could be quite tight. I know of some large toy retailers that are under serious pressure at the minute and have pretty much accepted that a certain % of what they planned to ship won't make it here in time.

To give an example, a forty-foot container full of Christmas decorations would have cost anywhere between USD$1500-$1800 port to port back in 2019. Now, that rate is anywhere between $14K and $18K. You can still fit the same amount of stuff in the container so it's a big increase.

If prices do go up, it'll ultimately be Joe Public that they get passed onto.

[hotspur]

I saw The Truffle Hunters last week, it's enjoyable if perhaps overpraised by critics. What is it about documentaries that makes critics auto-gush over them?

I fancy seeing Night of the Kings which is an Ivory Coast film on at the Lighthouse atm.

[Lao Lao]

Thats genuinely fascinating Lao Lao.


Did you ever look into whether the belt and road initiative of China will eventually solve these types of bottlenecks in the future, or is that too medium-to-long-term?

It seems like the transformative infrastructure of the next generation, but I don't know precisely how it is going to impact anything.

I'll come back to this when I have a bit more time as it's an interesting angle to it.

Do you mind me sharing this outside of IPB?

Yeah, work away. You might want to check/fix grammar/spelling mistakes. I typed it up at speed during lunch so there is bound to be quite a few errors.

[Solksjaer!]

Lao Lao finally got around to reading that. A silly question.


Why doesnt the likes of the UK avail of their steel heritage and build containers and take advantage of the demand ?

I know nothing of the business so dont scoff too hard at my greenhorn.

Very interesting. Sounds fking stressful though

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

At the moment the building industry and sanitary ware industries are seeing negative effects from our Chinese brothers suffering from container famine
from images seen today Rotterdam port is overwhelmed by containers sitting waiting to be sent to all parts of Europe
Granite paving is one of the big sufferers in our business and toilets and shower trays in another part
next 2 months be very tight for anyone doing refurbs and new builds

I suspect this is why we were about to (hopefully) get our house. Decent development potential, but apparently all the builders running the rule over it couldn't make things work due to material and labour availability. Our small win (of buying somewhere overpriced, but probably not as overpriced as places needing no work) was that we can wait out the delayed containers in the way a builder can't.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

I'll come back to this when I have a bit more time as it's an interesting angle to it.

I'd be a huge fan of that if you ever get a chance.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

I saw The Truffle Hunters last week, it's enjoyable if perhaps overpraised by critics. What is it about documentaries that makes critics auto-gush over them?

I fancy seeing Night of the Kings which is an Ivory Coast film on at the Lighthouse atm.

And documentaries with old people in them *swoon*

It turns out there are no tickets left for the truffle hunters, forgot to check that before posting, so must explore something else.

[Theresa]

Whelp.

Looks like I’m going to Bandon.

Shot a 69 tonight.

First time under par, and under 70 to boot.

Absolutely delighted, the dream of scratch this summer is still alive!

[DeeBrown]

Nice to see Skibbereen upgrading
their Olympic medal to gold.

[Lao Lao]

Lao Lao finally got around to reading that. A silly question.


Why doesnt the likes of the UK avail of their steel heritage and build containers and take advantage of the demand ?

I know nothing of the business so dont scoff too hard at my greenhorn.

Very interesting. Sounds fking stressful though

Not a silly question at all.

The USA through various government bodies have mooted the possibility of starting to make containers again in the USA as they feel that having so much economic reliance on essentially a foreign government is not wise.

The problem though and you alluded to it is that this is part of their heritage. It's in the past. Western nations just can't compete with China and Asia on a cost basis, even with the rise in the sell price.

They also don't have infrastructure, the factories, machinery, suppliers, supply chain mapped out for raw materials, trained workers. All the later things can be put in place but the cost to do that now is way greater than when China did it a few decades ago.

There is also an argument that it doesn't make sense to make containers half way around the world from where they are needed as you then need to send them there which again takes time and money.

The only way it would really work is if national governments heavily subsidised the industry which I'm not sure will happen.

[Wombatman]

Pull

[Goodluck2me]

You won't be able to buy a solar powered Velux blind anywhere in the world until next spring.

WHERE ARE THE MAINSTREAM MEDIA IN ALL THIS?

[Solksjaer!]

Pull

Steady on. You'll get Collie excited

[Goodluck2me]

Not a silly question at all.

The USA through various government bodies have mooted the possibility of starting to make containers again in the USA as they feel that having so much economic reliance on essentially a foreign government is not wise.

The problem though and you alluded to it is that this is part of their heritage. It's in the past. Western nations just can't compete with China and Asia on a cost basis, even with the rise in the sell price.

They also don't have infrastructure, the factories, machinery, suppliers, supply chain mapped out for raw materials, trained workers. All the later things can be put in place but the cost to do that now is way greater than when China did it a few decades ago.

There is also an argument that it doesn't make sense to make containers half way around the world from where they are needed as you then need to send them there which again takes time and money.

The only way it would really work is if national governments heavily subsidised the industry which I'm not sure will happen.

There are also so few barriers to entry that by the time you had set up the industry others could compete that margin away, unlike say aerospace where the moat is very large.

[Goodluck2me]

Whelp.

Looks like I’m going to Bandon.

Shot a 69 tonight.

First time under par, and under 70 to boot.

Absolutely delighted, the dream of scratch this summer is still alive!

That’s class, first under 70? Shaky hands on the 18th?!

[Solksjaer!]

Not a silly question at all.

The USA through various government bodies have mooted the possibility of starting to make containers again in the USA as they feel that having so much economic reliance on essentially a foreign government is not wise.

The problem though and you alluded to it is that this is part of their heritage. It's in the past. Western nations just can't compete with China and Asia on a cost basis, even with the rise in the sell price.

They also don't have infrastructure, the factories, machinery, suppliers, supply chain mapped out for raw materials, trained workers. All the later things can be put in place but the cost to do that now is way greater than when China did it a few decades ago.

There is also an argument that it doesn't make sense to make containers half way around the world from where they are needed as you then need to send them there which again takes time and money.

The only way it would really work is if national governments heavily subsidised the industry which I'm not sure will happen.

Cheers . I guess the Supply Chain is weighing heavily from the east for the next decade.

[Solksjaer!]

Whelp.

Looks like I’m going to Bandon.

Shot a 69 tonight.

First time under par, and under 70 to boot.

Absolutely delighted, the dream of scratch this summer is still alive!

Very impressive. Word of warning , the next round will be 80+
Golf QED .

[Raoul Duke III]

West Cork is happy. Got a free coffee out of it.

[Lazare]

West Cork is happy. Got a free coffee out of it.

Have you bumped into the murdering poet?

[Raoul Duke III]

Have you bumped into the murdering poet?

Bumped into him last year in the market in Skibbereen. He clearly loves the attention, seemed to spend most of his time calling into the other stallholders. They all were clearly embarrassed by this with some actively blanking him.

My youngest (no idea who he was) had a very visceral reaction to him when she saw him. "Daddy, I don't like that man."
Trust your instincts.

[Raoul Duke III]

Actually on the road to Schull now so we may see him again.

[oleras]

West Cork is happy. Got a free coffee out of it.

If you do end up in the Brew House tomorrow, monkfish risotto was also decent.

[Lao Lao]

WHERE ARE THE MAINSTREAM MEDIA IN ALL THIS?

Joe : Hello, We have Kate from Clontarf on line 3. Kate, talk to Joe.

Kate : Hi Joe, I'm currently doing up the house here in Clontarf and for love nor money, I can't get a hold of a solar powered Velux blind anywhere.

Joe : Go on, there's none to be had anywhere Kate?

Kate : No Joe, I spoke to a lad and to be honest, it seemed like he was playing the guitar while talking to me and he said, there would be none available until at least the spring of next year.

Joe : A guitar Kate? Go on, what did the lad say about the spring next year. go on. Is it to do with the fact that we don't get enough sun here in Clontarf Kate, I mean I took a walk down the promenade yesterday in Clontarf and the sun was glorious, it was shining like I've never seen it shined before.

Kate : No Joe, I think the problem is in China

Joe : CHINA KATE? Go on...

[Solksjaer!]

Yer on a heater Lao

[Lazare]

Haha LL

[Lazare]

Michelle Smith the Joe Duffy topic

[Iago]

Only 2 weeks until the premier league starts people. Get into the FPL thread and more importantly SEND ME THE MONIES!!!!

Iago needs a weekend of cocktails

[Silver-Tiger]

Any fancies in Galway?

[Silver-Tiger]

Michelle Smith the Joe Duffy topic

It's pathetic that she and the topic of her is trending today after this morning but not surprising. There was never really any closure to the issue.
RTE are just acting like she didn't happen in their swimming coverage. Not calling her "Disgraced Michelle Smith". Would have been so much easier if her medals were binned. Not sure what they are to do TBH.

Only recently seen the pressers after her performances where the American favourites were straight up calling her our for doping. Heartbreaking for them. Imagine sacrificing a lot and training for years and end for that shite beating you.

[balfejohn]

Any fancies in Galway?

Tudor City 6.15 looks good at 16/1 in the hurdle

[Theresa]

That’s class, first under 70? Shaky hands on the 18th?!

Surprisingly not. I mentally said that if I bogey it’s I’ll break par so it was a little easier for me to just accept whatever outcome. I got a twinge of nerves on 15 since the last 3 holes are a gauntlet with a tricky shirt or 4, 585yard par 5 and a really tough par 4 to finish.

Shot 87 at the weekend so it just shows you how it goes.

Both the 87 and the 69 were aberrations afaic

[Emmet]

It's pathetic that she and the topic of her is trending today after this morning but not surprising. There was never really any closure to the issue.
RTE are just acting like she didn't happen in their swimming coverage. Not calling her "Disgraced Michelle Smith". Would have been so much easier if her medals were binned. Not sure what they are to do TBH.

Only recently seen the pressers after her performances where the American favourites were straight up calling her our for doping. Heartbreaking for them. Imagine sacrificing a lot and training for years and end for that shite beating you.

Sonia's silver behind Szabo spings to mind.

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/other-sports/sonia-o-sullivan-wonders-about-gabriela-szabo-s-olympic-gold-1.2524481

We'd back her to the hilt here I think. Can't even pretend to have faith in Smith.

[Dice75]

Sonia's silver behind Szabo spings to mind.

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/other-sports/sonia-o-sullivan-wonders-about-gabriela-szabo-s-olympic-gold-1.2524481

We'd back her to the hilt here I think. Can't even pretend to have faith in Smith.

Be some shitstorm if the rowers turned out to be at the Michelle Smiths.

[Solksjaer!]

know we all frown upon Michelle Smith (especially her husband who deflowered and drugged up our fox redheaded girl) . However I remember at the time we were all outraged at our girl being treated like this (maybe not O’Toole, he was very sus about it, even Dunphy put his oar in ..*ooh topical) .
There , was one funny interview that did get me shouting, g’wan ya good thing. The worlds press were interviewing her about it and she was being cagey and evasive yet bdefiant, then out of the blue Sean Ban Brethnacht (don’t kill me for the spelling I’m not googling it) Suddenly started asking her questions in her native Irish . I could feel the WTFs going on in the press conference. It was a funny moment but we all hoped she wasn’t on drugs , similar to Stephen Roche but alas like him she was riddled . Smart move changing the surname to avoid being followed, perhaps she predicted the interest and how it can haunt you down.

[Hitchhiker's Guide To...]

It was big at the time, also. After the first medal, national elation, after the second medal, national doubt, after the third medal, national embarrassment. It would have been better if she'd just won the one medal.

[Dice75]

Not that you'd know to look at me now but I used to cycle, a lot. Was pretty shit tbf, too tall for the hills, too skinny (those were the days) for a sprinter so time trialling was left and was only average at best at that. Did the Junior Tour twice in the early 90s. After the second one, one of the teammates who only lived up the road was off to Italy for the summer and decided to do a few races over there. Got tested and caught. He was 16. Too quote the lad in the Aldi ad on TV at the moment, I gave up and took up biscuits.

[shrapnel]

drugs were rampant in the 70s 80 s and 90s. Chemists were going so much faster developing drugs than the IOC and the anti doping agency could create tests to find them. to be fair if you weren't taking drugs at the time you were probably in a minority. Not that this excuses doping, but if you wanted to win you got with the program.

[Wombatman]

It was big at the time, also. After the first medal, national elation, after the second medal, national doubt, after the third medal, national embarrassment. It would have been better if she'd just won the one medal.

The Tom Humphries allegations triggered her fall from grace. Speaking of falls from grace.....

[Hectorjelly]

She may have been a drug cheat. But she was our drug cheat.

[Solksjaer!]

She may have been a drug cheat. But she was our drug cheat.

She only learned to Swim the Christmas before that . I heard she was training in the liffey and she was overtaken by a druggie who fell in at Lucan . Does this go to Maynoooooth love ?