Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To...View Post
As soon as I'm a local tax payer I'll do my bit by only voting for councillors who want the local tax raised by 15%, but I'm not sure (dobby) it's really all that wrong to not want homeless people camping on the main streets. The whole city centre is a mess. It's filthy. It doesn't feel welcoming. It doesn't feel safe. Part of the issue is the tents and all the apparatus that has built up around it. Like I don't think the answer is "well if we solve the homeless problem then we won't have tents". There will always be some temporary flow of homeless, or people who want to sleep in tents rather than hostels so they can inject, drink. Maybe there could be more "wet" beds, where people can do those things indoors, but I guess there will always be some on the streets. I don't think it's wrong to say that the tents can't be parked on Henry Street or Grafton Street, or the GPO. Like, it's not something mean to say.
I vote Longford.
Cops round them up, put them on a bus, dump 'em in Longford. A few days there and they'll be shocked onto a path of solid citizenry for life.
"We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."
On the US discussion, it's important to remember the unconscious biases we all have. We live in an American world, we watch American shows, half our financial lives are in dollars, since the outbreak of Friends (the show) we speak American & Raoul goes to sleep each night ranking the presidents in order of haberdashery. It's going to be hard not to be emotionally biased towards them.
You could probably make the same point about our good friends across the Irish Sea, maybe even more so.
"We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."
On the US discussion, it's important to remember the unconscious biases we all have. We live in an American world, we watch American shows, half our financial lives are in dollars, since the outbreak of Friends (the show) we speak American & Raoul goes to sleep each night ranking the presidents in order of haberdashery. It's going to be hard not to be emotionally biased towards them.
We're also far more culturally matched, lots have family over there (some even killed in 9/11) and there weren't too many going on J1s to Afghanistan back in the day. Still, to an alien landing on Earth, I'm sure they would be questioning their free reign to bomb some countries into oblivion because only we can have the big bombs (and want the cheap oil).
I can understand why a CEO of a capital city wouldn't want to have tents on the city streets containing homeless people but for a person in that position, with the power and funds to be able to fix the issue, to comment that we should just ban the tents is absolutely woeful and shows just how out of touch he is with, not just reality, but with the job is he employed to do.
O'rly
Rough sleeping is less about accommodation and more about addiction and mental health.
From talking with several people who live wild, their main concern with hostels was with security, like their stuff being stolen during the night. That and not having charge points for their phones and vapes. Not a one mentioned the shortage of drugs or advice.
I've changed my thought experiment. It has now become which regime which the US had been in conflict with would you switch with the US in respect of being the world's greatest superpower, with the economic and military superiority that entails?
I've changed my thought experiment. It has now become which regime which the US had been in conflict with would you switch with the US in respect of being the world's greatest superpower, with the economic and military superiority that entails?
Flashes of genuine anger in Biden's remarks last night I thought, when referring to the Afghani leadership and soldiers who ran away and deserted their posts.
May not have been the time for it but definitely a lot of truth in that I thought.
This speech was crafted over a number of days by teams of people. It was rehearsed over and over again. Impossible for genuine anger to be present.
Biden, and the likes of Keegan, have one thing in common, they are master communicators. That Biden can come across as being genuinely angry is evidence of his talent. Brilliant delivery usually trumps content creation in speechifying.
Biden's and Keegan's teams plan the speech with a clear set of objectives. Biden's objective is pretty obvious. I suspect Keenan's is to eliminate the hazard of unplanned accommodation.
Funnily enough its poor communication, mostly off the cuff, the often leads to their demise.
Happiness is not a goal; it is a by-product. ~Eleanor Roosevelt
Think I first read the Communist Manifesto when I was 11, it was certainly before my Catholic Conformation which I still feel guilty about not refusing. Was pretty decided on defecting to the eastern block by about 15 and chose leaving cert subjects with that in mind, which somewhat skewed my cao choices. Turned down music college offers, later (that I hadn't applied for) because that's the last thing they needed. Had originally settled on Yugoslavia as the more progressive spot, but was happy to go to East Germany when it was obvious Yugo was no more. A lot of stuff changed around 1990.
Think I first read the Communist Manifesto when I was 11, it was certainly before my Catholic Conformation which I still feel guilty about not refusing. Was pretty decided on defecting to the eastern block by about 15 and chose leaving cert subjects with that in mind, which somewhat skewed my cao choices. Turned down music college offers(that I hadn't applied for) because that's the last thing they needed. Had originally settled on Yugoslavia as the more progressive spot, but was happy to go to East Germany when it was obvious Yugo was no more. A lot of stuff changed around 1990.
It must have been devastating for you when the whole edifice just crumbled (I actually mean that sincerely)?
"We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."
I've changed my thought experiment. It has now become which regime which the US had been in conflict with would you switch with the US in respect of being the world's greatest superpower, with the economic and military superiority that entails?
Yeah, the first one didn't really work as no-one could come up with a decent answer.
Let's go for....eh, Germany obv (if we're allowed to magically morph Germany from Nazidom into today's version. Are we?).
Otherwise, Cuba as at least we'd have hawt women, cigars and rum to take our minds off the auld dictatorship.
"We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."
From talking with several people who live wild, their main concern with hostels was with security, like their stuff being stolen during the night. That and not having charge points for their phones and vapes. Not a one mentioned the shortage of drugs or advice.
A friend who works with addicts has been scathing about the role of some (unnamed to me) charities who he says are in the business of keeping people on the streets. he says there are too many groups working incoherently and the likes of Merchant's Quay and Peter McVerry trust with better funding and stronger influence over policy offer the most practical routes out for individuals who want help.
From talking with several people who live wild, their main concern with hostels was with security, like their stuff being stolen during the night. That and not having charge points for their phones and vapes. Not a one mentioned the shortage of drugs or advice.
Yeah I think security, getting mugged/robbed, or if they are attempting to get clean they are terrified of the temptations of being around it, and the dealers waiting for them as the leave the next morning would be what I've heard.
A friend who works with addicts has been scathing about the role of some (unnamed to me) charities who he says are in the business of keeping people on the streets. he says there are too many groups working incoherently and the likes of Merchant's Quay and Peter McVerry trust with better funding and stronger influence over policy offer the most practical routes out for individuals who want help.
Not too sure what actions are keeping them in the Streets, but I'd definitely agree with the rest.
Anyway Im far from an expert on any of it, just adding my opinion based on the interactions I'd have with the people.
Devout commies and devoted religious followers always had far more in common than they would care to admit.
Even down to the rituals and icongraphy.
Oh yeah, the Hare Krishna's, and my part time job as chaplain's assistant was after that. Some of us just like rules, both to follow, and rebel against.
Oh yeah, the Hare Krishna's, and my part time job as chaplain's assistant was after that. Some of us just like rules, both to follow, and rebel against.
Communist Saints (Marx, Lenin)...Christian Saints.
Communist bible (Das Kapital)...Christian bible
Martyrs all round
Heretics (Trotsky!) and schisms.
High priests and sacred rituals (May Day parades)
Doctrines of infallibility
Religious relics (Lenin in Red Square)
Corruption at the highest levels. One rule for the nomenklatura, one for the proles.
The Great Terror. The Spanish Inquisition.
And so forth. You can see where the commies took their inspiration.
"We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."
Keegan has two fundamental flaws.
He's dismissive of any differing opinions
and his methods are crudely belligerent.
During that interview be acknowledges that certain business's raise legitimate objections
to DCC policy then immediately
stated that their opinions will be ignored.
The cycle lane fiasco in Sandymount
came about because he tried to override
every planning law precedent and insisted
the major roadworks engaged in
we're part of a short temporary test
and that no impact studies were necessary.
While I read a bit of Marx and more of Lenin ( were you just quoting a random title when you mentioned 'What is to be done'?) it mas mostly Trotsky for me. He was cooler than skateboards for me in the 80's
While I read a bit of Marx and more of Lenin ( were you just quoting a random title when you mentioned 'What is to be done'?) it mas mostly Trotsky for me. He was cooler than skateboards for me in the 80's
I say 'what is to be done?' quite a bit in my daily life. No-one ever gets the source. One of the small things that makes the day more bearable.
I'm also quite fond of throwing in the odd Mao aphorism in work. 'Knowledge is direct experience' being a favourite. Although I did get caught out yesterday by a sneaky Indian colleague who knew that didn't come from some MBA textbook.
"We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."
I say 'what is to be done?' quite a bit in my daily life. No-one ever gets the source. One of the small things that makes the day more bearable.
I'm also quite fond of throwing in the odd Mao aphorism in work. 'Knowledge is direct experience' being a favourite. Although I did get caught out yesterday by a sneaky Indian colleague who knew that didn't come from some MBA textbook.
You really need to watch the entire series of Star Trek TNG though. It's still on Netflix afaik number one.
While I read a bit of Marx and more of Lenin ( were you just quoting a random title when you mentioned 'What is to be done'?) it mas mostly Trotsky for me. He was cooler than skateboards for me in the 80's
I say 'what is to be done?' quite a bit in my daily life. No-one ever gets the source. One of the small things that makes the day more bearable.
I'm also quite fond of throwing in the odd Mao aphorism in work. 'Knowledge is direct experience' being a favourite. Although I did get caught out yesterday by a sneaky Indian colleague who knew that didn't come from some MBA textbook.
A lot here to process since my last post and hard to do without being able to multi quote on the phone so I'll catch it all in one go.
First up Hotspur - Homeless sleeping in tents is not a new phenomenon. 3 years ago, we were regularly asked for both sleeping bags and tents on our soup run. We sometimes got donated sleeping bags but rarely got tents, I'm presuming it's down to the cost of the two. That said, I regularly saw tents but more so in areas outside the city centre. I think the last 18 months or so, we're seeing more of the people that used to camp in the suburbs camp in the city centre. This is for two reasons, one, they feel safer with the smaller amount of footfall plus they have less distance to travel to get to services that offer food etc during the day.
I completely refute the idea that well meaning groups are not helping. The overwhelming majority (if not all) of the volunteer groups can only give out food, clothes, sleeping bags, etc. If these services didn't exist, people would quite simply go without and it would a hell of a lot worse for them.
Also, not all hostels have support services like social workers etc. Some of them are literally just a place to lay your head between set hours and then you are kicked out at 7/8am.
Next up is Hitch, who seems to be OK with homeless people in tents but God forbid they would be in main thoroughfares that he might frequent. That sort of problem should be hidden well out of sight of the eyes of the middle classes.
OPR nailled it. Finland took a somewhat radical approach at the time. House people first. Once you get them off the street, you can then open up a world of services to them to help them, services they just can't get either on the streets or in hostels. Here, we have an approach of, "listen mate, I know you have a heroin addiction and I know that addiction leads you to sleeping rough on the street whilst shitting and pissing yourself on a nightly basis, but if you just wouldn't mind getting yourself clean and in a decent state on your own, we might be able to put you on a ten year waiting list for a gaff so you can then try to fully reintegrate I to society, sound good?"
And finally Strewelpeter, with his comment that
Rough sleeping is less about accommodation and more about addiction and mental health.
That is just totally backward. The reason people don't want to go into hostels is because they are either trying to avoid getting addicted and/or relapsing due to the amount of drugs available in the hostel or because they have mental health issues and being couped up in a dorm with 5 to 7 other people in tight confines where there is drugs and violence is not helpful to their mental state.
Sorry, missed one point from Strewelpeter, I do think that some of the larger charities have become a bit of a business and if homelessness ended, they would be out of business, although sadly, I think this exists in all types of charities.
It would make sense to consolidate a good few of them, pool resources and get a better policy / strategy on how to deal with the issue (think Finland model)
I would have thought the reason they flock to the city centre is to beg panhandle. The capuchin centre gives out bags of food the whole area is then strewn with the contents. It’s a complex situation and think it’s unfair on business people in town having to deal with it from shop lifting sleeping in doorways needles puke human waste needing to be washed away every morning.
Next up is Hitch, who seems to be OK with homeless people in tents but God forbid they would be in main thoroughfares that he might frequent. That sort of problem should be hidden well out of sight of the eyes of the middle classes.
No. I said when I'm paying property tax I'll only vote for candidates who support a rise in property tax of the +15%. That professional care, and not charity, is how we should be supporting people in need of care. It's a practical solution that provides long term funding.
And I think it's a bizarre idea that it should be acceptable for people to sleep, shit, and inject, on the main pedestrian streets.
The Tallaght Bandits have definitely had some media training since their last iteration. I'm picturing some shadowing V-like figure in the background advising them.
Imagine a dusty cave somewhere in the mountains of Afghanistan, V, wearing his most impactful tie, is surrounded by vicious fighters...
"So Infidel Dog V, please explain one more time'
"Just V is good. We're all friends now. Let's go through the mock interview again. How about you, Mullah Abdullah Mamullah - want to give it a try?"
"OK, OK. I try. Praise be to Allah!"
"Let's maybe try and leave Him out of it. People might find it a little oppressive. Remember it's 2021, we're aiming for Taliban 2.0 - diversity and inclusion. Anyway, we've just captured Kabul.."
"Praise be to Allah!! Now we will scourge the traitorous dogs of the government!!!"
"Nooooooo, no no. No. Look at the power point deck. Let's try it again - I'll be the interviewer. So Abdullah, now that you have captured the presidential palace, what is your message towards the people who served in the previous regime?"
"We respect all our Afghan brothers and promise no revenge towards them"
"Excellent Abdullah! Really good! Now let's try question 2 - what do you say to the women of Afghanistan who have enjoyed much improved access to education and human rights in the last twenty years and are now scared?"
"They must cover their shameful faces and submit to the will of their menfolk!!"
"<FFS> Come on, read the deck. It's not that hard really"
"We respect all our sisters and promise that we will continue to support their rights"
"Excellent Abdullah!! Really good! Now for the last bit, question 3 - how do you feel about homosexuals?"
"They are an abomination in the eyes of Allah and we will stone them to death!"
"See, that's the kind of shit that got you in trouble last time. Just read the script."
"We respect the sexual choices of all, including all of our LBGTQ friends"
"Brilliant Abdullah, excellent delivery. I saw you with that donkey before remember. Maybe lose the bloodstained sword when you're on camera, eh? And may I suggest a beard trim and a more impactful turban?"
"of course Emir V, of course"
"and ahem, may we just go over the details of out secret arrangement? What happens with the poppy fields?"
"the product will be loaded onto your planes Emir V, and we take our usual cut - 20%"
"I rather think 5%, Abdullah. Yes, 5% seems fair."
"OK, OK. Done, Emir V. Done."
"Yes, you really have been."
"We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."
Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To...View Post
No. I said when I'm paying property tax I'll only vote for candidates who support a rise in property tax of the +15%. That professional care, and not charity, is how we should be supporting people in need of care. It's a practical solution that provides long term funding.
And I think it's a bizarre idea that it should be acceptable for people to sleep, shit, and inject, on the main pedestrian streets.
I like that you think the local property tax goes towards such things.
The rest of it I agree with.
"We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."
Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To...View Post
No. I said when I'm paying property tax I'll only vote for candidates who support a rise in property tax of the +15%. That professional care, and not charity, is how we should be supporting people in need of care. It's a practical solution that provides long term funding.
And I think it's a bizarre idea that it should be acceptable for people to sleep, shit, and inject, on the main pedestrian streets.
I agree that it’s not acceptable however, lying on the cold street and hungry and fearful of hostels , what do you do THAT NIGHT. What is the government to stop these folk dying on the street? The Charities take care of the immediate need Longer term , who is going out to these people in the street and sitting down with them to explore their options. Who is Officially doing that? It’s not a rhetorical question , just wondering , are they arsed ? Is it up to the Charities to do the Governments work in communicating these things , tent by tent? Again I don’t know but in order to pontificate about services on offer the government needs to query why these services are not being taken up. If there is a dangerous element, remove them, add more security, camera. Make the services desirable ? If the streets are more desirable well then something major is wrong.
met up with a friend for a game of golf (lolbadstuff) yesterday and we sat afterwards in a gusty tent outside the Pontins Sill and had a couple of pints. How the mighty have fallen. I was like a happy little kid drinking my two pints of Guinness (recommend their Guinness btw) and went home afterwards with the after party feeling you would have precovid from a decent night out on the rip. COvid has really reshaped my Hierarchy of needs Pyramid.
I like that you think the local property tax goes towards such things.
The rest of it I agree with.
I think it explicitly goes towards that, in part, no? As in property tax equals local spending and local homelessness is local responsibility - at least in terms of housing.
I agree that it’s not acceptable however, lying on the cold street and hungry and fearful of hostels , what do you do THAT NIGHT. What is the government to stop these folk dying on the street? The Charities take care of the immediate need Longer term , who is going out to these people in the street and sitting down with them to explore their options. Who is Officially doing that? It’s not a rhetorical question , just wondering , are they arsed ? Is it up to the Charities to do the Governments work in communicating these things , tent by tent? Again I don’t know but in order to pontificate about services on offer the government needs to query why these services are not being taken up. If there is a dangerous element, remove them, add more security, camera. Make the services desirable ? If the streets are more desirable well then something major is wrong.
Absolutely. I agree with all of this. I find the state reliance (and funding of) charities quite dodgy. If something is a genuine social need then it should be carried out by the state.
met up with a friend for a game of golf (lolbadstuff) yesterday and we sat afterwards in a gusty tent outside the Pontins Sill and had a couple of pints. How the mighty have fallen. I was like a happy little kid drinking my two pints of Guinness (recommend their Guinness btw) and went home afterwards with the after party feeling you would have precovid from a decent night out on the rip. COvid has really reshaped my Hierarchy of needs Pyramid.
I was playing a comp a couple of weeks back with one of my mates. After migrating to 100% remote work, the missus sold her wheels so she needed my car for the day. I was happy to be dropped off as it provided the opportunity for a couple of rare post-round pints. Was a tidy +5 through 9 and playing great stuff for my HC. Ended up +20 for a reality check.
The grub and a few juicy pints afterwards were absolutely glorious. Couldn't give a fiddlers about how the comp went in the end. There really is a lot to be said for a few scoops and a chat with your mates.
Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To...View Post
Absolutely. I agree with all of this. I find the state reliance (and funding of) charities quite dodgy. If something is a genuine social need then it should be carried out by the state.
A lot of it goes back to the founding of the state and the effective outsourcing of things like healthcare, schooling etc to religious orders. A lot of that has been unwound but there's still quite a way to go to catch up with more sensibly structured countries.
You now have bizarre situations where charities and state institutions are effectively competing to provide services.
"We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."
Got the final mortgage approval just there. Where they have managed to approved the requested mortgage amount minus the deposit. Instead of the purchase price minus the deposit amount. And the valuer report with its made up valuation seems to have not realised the error, and has also said the value of the house is the mortgage amount minus the deposit. I'm hoping they can fix that and not get stuck up with the valuation report.
A lot of it goes back to the founding of the state and the effective outsourcing of things like healthcare, schooling etc to religious orders. A lot of that has been unwound but there's still quite a way to go to catch up with more sensibly structured countries.
You now have bizarre situations where charities and state institutions are effectively competing to provide services.
I was reading a horrific story last week related to the first points here about six class girls being shown a video full of the most awful lies about abortion in their class and the school just shrugs and goes "was that wrong, should we not have done that" . An example of the effect of the outsourcing.
Ireland has the same Housing First policy as Finland does.
Of course we do. Initially set up in 2013 by the then minister Jan O'Sullivan. Over the last 8 years, it has been a hugely well funded, well thought out, well executed policy that has resulted in us not talking about people feeling safer to sleep in a tent on the street instead of checking into a hostel in 2021.
In other news, I have some Superbowl tickets made from rice cakes if you are in the market to purchase?
Did you stay off the drink for the holiday? If so, how is it changing the holiday experience?
Had few beers as in no more than 3 in a day. Up at 9 am every morning, don't want to experience hangovers ever again. It's lovely actually getting full days holidays and not thrown in bed sick!
Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To...View Post
I was reading a horrific story last week related to the first points here about six class girls being shown a video full of the most awful lies about abortion in their class and the school just shrugs and goes "was that wrong, should we not have done that" . An example of the effect of the outsourcing.
Well, that's the thing - the management of that school might feel that was 100% the correct thing to do, depending on their 'ethos'
"We are not Europeans. Those people on the continent are freaks."
Originally posted by Hitchhiker's Guide To...View Post
Got the final mortgage approval just there. Where they have managed to approved the requested mortgage amount minus the deposit. Instead of the purchase price minus the deposit amount. And the valuer report with its made up valuation seems to have not realised the error, and has also said the value of the house is the mortgage amount minus the deposit. I'm hoping they can fix that and not get stuck up with the valuation report.
Found it interesting when buying a few years ago how the valuation report ended up as the exact purchase price - not even a round number, €XX2k rather than €XX0k. What a racket.
Found it interesting when buying a few years ago how the valuation report ended up as the exact purchase price - not even a round number, €XX2k rather than €XX0k. What a racket.
Just read further in the report and he actually says he explicitly disagrees with the contracted value. ffs. I'm guessing that might be the end of that. I didn't realise that was possible.
The government spends over €200 million a year on homelessness. The cost of accommodation in this country is a cause of homelessness, a black hole in costs of providing temporary and emergency accommodation (most of which goes to for-profit places), and a barrier to long term housing of homeless.
Some things that are done are not helpful. All this money spent on emergency accommodation is band aid stuff, but we aren't going to magically produce or buy a tonne of apartments and houses given the nature of the property situation we have. Peter McVerry convinced me that groups just giving food and handouts were preventing people engaging with those organisations who do that and also help them more substantially in the long run.
As for what can be done about hostels having people taking drugs and being violent, I haven't a notion what could possible be done about that. I have had clients in recovery who slept rough rather than being in them, but what can you do given the profile of rough sleepers (a minuscule number of people)?
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