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Old 09-12-11, 17:53   #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arazi View Post
In my first post I think I said that the SB would have to be a clusterfuck to call 25% of his stack and then fold to a BB shove, yet later in the thread 2 of the posters I'd respect most said that they would play the hand in such a way with the bottom of their range.
I know we're on the line here with regards to spew when we call/fold 25% of our stack. Given a decent range BB will shove over our call here it can only really be easily justified 40-45BB+ deep, I didn't think it through thoroughly but I secede to your point that 36BB deep may be cutting it. The problem is if we assume a decently wide range for BB to reshove we're just about getting our 2:1 and are super-close to being forced to call it off, regardless of holding. If it's tighter than that, maybe AK/JJ+, then call/folding would be ok since 95% (more with an A/K blocker to his reshoving range in our hand) of the time we get this HU, and the other 5% we can make a -EV fold to survive since BB is obv a nit and will likely make life easy for us in future hands. BB being a nit also means BTN shoves wider which improves the EV of our call.

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Old 09-12-11, 19:19   #102
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Originally Posted by smoothcall View Post
What do we do if the SB flats playing 20 bigs, 23 bigs, 30 bigs 40 bigs 60 bigs??
Shove, shove, shove, shove and click back fold to sb reshove.
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Old 09-12-11, 22:53   #103
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Originally Posted by blaaaaaaah View Post
I am Captain Prudence in tournys! Yet I still agree with shoving with AQ over the top of sb flat, especially if it is online as there a so many players who just so below par in these spots, they see 10bb button shove and will flat any ace,kj kq and any pair, without even thinking what if bb reshoves and when bb does shove they fold everytime unless they have TT, Ak or better. Thats alot of times you get hu with dominated button with extra equity. I will say tho AQ is the bottom of my range here for a reshove.

I think once someone works out the numbers for this Arazi you will see a new light on this spot and maybe perhaps you will be the one who is more open minded to a shove with AQ because it's going to be closer to a shove than you think.

Also, the fact that this is the Ipops where you have about a thousand recreational players playing the event it's certainly a reshoving spot as it's one of the biggest leaks in a recreational players game. Even if the numbers come so close that maybe your line of thinking could be better play by a small margin, I still shove because in a field like this with it's size, fast structure, bad players and my edge knowing ranges better than most I've got to stick it in here, all these variables are apart of this hand and will without notes saying otherwise make this a +ev shove.

Now where's the LaoisHammer to stove this shit

Apologies for my intro tone to the thread too, was no need for it. I was on hooker tilt, you no when your like fuck this shit, fuck that, fuck everything & everyone sort of tilt?..well yeap that's the one.




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Old 10-12-11, 00:47   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hectorjelly View Post
Totally wrong, people put way too much importance in blockers IMO

You have 35% equity with AQ, 44% with TT - that's a pretty big difference

104,503,543,452 games 98.745 secs 1,058,317,316 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 44.062% 43.58% 00.48% 45540043582 506610209.33 { TT }
Hand 1: 20.079% 19.58% 00.50% 20462173917 521343813.83 { 22+, A2s+, K2s+, Q2s+, J2s+, T2s+, 95s+, 85s+, 74s+, 64s+, 54s, A2o+, K2o+, Q4o+, J7o+, T7o+, 97o+, 87o, 76o }
Hand 2: 35.858% 35.20% 00.66% 36788256353 685115576.83 { 66+, A8s+, KJs+, A9o+, KQo }

11,259,373,356 games 11.957 secs 941,655,378 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 39.738% 39.35% 00.40% 4430106059 44638021.67 { 99 }
Hand 1: 21.735% 21.31% 00.43% 2399256723 48263770.17 { 22+, A2s+, K2s+, Q2s+, J2s+, T2s+, 95s+, 85s+, 74s+, 64s+, 54s, A2o+, K2o+, Q4o+, J7o+, T7o+, 97o+, 87o, 76o }
Hand 2: 38.527% 37.83% 00.70% 4259293391 79186145.17 { 66+, A8s+, KJs+, A9o+, KQo }


---

2,411,156,286 games 3.005 secs 802,381,459 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 36.435% 33.59% 02.85% 809877549 68621124.83 { AQo }
Hand 1: 29.118% 28.93% 00.19% 697477093 4593674.33 { 22+, A2s+, K2s+, Q2s+, J2s+, T2s+, 95s+, 85s+, 74s+, 64s+, 54s, A2o+, K2o+, Q4o+, J7o+, T7o+, 97o+, 87o, 76o }
Hand 2: 34.448% 31.54% 02.91% 760406507 70180337.83 { 66+, A8s+, KJs+, A9o+, KQo }
I think blockers are pretty important in this case because most of the time the flatting range of the caller in the SB is made by hands that plan to fold a reshove or by monsters. I would expect AQ/AK//AJ//AT/JJ/TT/99 to reship nearly always there from the SB. I don't think he would flat AT/AJ/AQ/88 etc hoping for us to shove with worse hands and call it off (given that there is no much FE and we look superstrong if we reship there) - this is why I think having blockers decreases by 33% the frequency of the monster hands he flats with (AA/KK/QQ), and given that if he does have AA/KK/QQ we have much better equity with AQ than with TT - we don't worry much about hand like 66/77/etc (probably 90% of the range you assigned to player 2) against which TT/99 perform better because they are not going to call off our shove anyway (most of the times).

TT certainly performs better than AQ vs player 1 range, but player 1 is not our main concern in this spot.
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Last edited by ViperEyeIRL; 10-12-11 at 01:06.
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