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    two mid-stage tourney spots

    Hand 1: e130 LIVE F.O
    BLINDS 1,000/2,000 ante 200

    Just moved tables so no reads per se, 16 left, 6 paid
    Villain (UTG+1)(50k) RAISES TO 4500
    fold to..
    Hero (button)(27k) 77

    best play at this stage and stacks??

    SPOILER
    I shove which I felt was fine but could be wrong (SB shoves 35k with AJ, UTG+1 calls with KK- A hi flop...)


    Hand 2: e100 Live f.o

    I've been super active , opening loads and shown 2/3 big bluffs...
    Blinds 800/1600 ante 100
    15 left 7 paid

    Hero (36k)(c.o) raises to 3900 with AQ

    Villain (25K) (s.b) goes all-in

    call????

    SPOILER
    I thought for a momnet and called, villain had 66, flop a queen, river a 6. Dealer made a comment under his breath about it being a bad call to the guy in seat 9 which particularly made me question my call which I thought was fine

    #2
    Originally posted by Kie Diddy View Post
    Hand 1: e130 LIVE F.O
    BLINDS 1,000/2,000 ante 200

    Just moved tables so no reads per se, 16 left, 6 paid
    Villain (UTG+1)(50k) RAISES TO 4500
    fold to..
    Hero (button)(27k) 77

    best play at this stage and stacks??

    SPOILER
    I shove which I felt was fine but could be wrong (SB shoves 35k with AJ, UTG+1 calls with KK- A hi flop...)


    Hand 2: e100 Live f.o

    I've been super active , opening loads and shown 2/3 big bluffs...
    Blinds 800/1600 ante 100
    15 left 7 paid

    Hero (36k)(c.o) raises to 3900 with AQ

    Villain (25K) (s.b) goes all-in

    call????

    SPOILER
    I thought for a momnet and called, villain had 66, flop a queen, river a 6. Dealer made a comment under his breath about it being a bad call to the guy in seat 9 which particularly made me question my call which I thought was fine
    both fine imo and the second is a SNAL CALL

    smack dealer in the face - sick and tired of stupid comments from dealers - I mostly just hear it about drunk guys at the table playing bad but just not right imo
    Go big or go homeless.

    Comment


      #3
      First one's close (between fold and shove), he has an awkward enough stack but still could be stealing and you don't have much fold equity in general here.

      His 4500 bet sizing suggests he's capable of a steal here. Probably edge towards fold for me. Up to you!

      Second one is an ez call for me.

      Gonna check your spoilers now but you shouldn't even leave results in spoilers. People will look

      Comment


        #4
        Hand 1: easy fold.

        Hand 2: easy call.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by danutpeddler View Post
          First one's close (between fold and shove), he has an awkward enough stack but still could be stealing and you don't have much fold equity in general here.

          His 4500 bet sizing suggests he's capable of a steal here. Probably edge towards fold for me. Up to you!

          Second one is an ez call for me.

          Gonna check your spoilers now but you shouldn't even leave results in spoilers. People will look
          +1 what tom said

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Caf View Post
            Hand 1: easy fold.

            Hand 2: easy call.
            +1 on this

            Comment


              #7
              First is close.

              Second is an easy call.




              What sort of range do we put the villain on in the first?

              Comment


                #8
                Hand 1) shove. Dunno why people wanna fold 77 with 13BBs, we're unlikely to find many better spots and this brings with it some FE vs a randoms range, which would technically be a MP raising range since the table is likely 8-handed, so a tad wider than UTG.

                Hand 2) trivial r/call with recent history, but still wouldn't be much of a decision without.
                "c'est en faisant n'importe quoi qu'on devient n'importe qui"

                Comment


                  #9
                  Hand 2 is a snap call, UL

                  Hand 1 is either a shove or a fold as already said. As a default given stack sizes I'd be shoving. If the villain was playing tighter than average or I picked up some particular sign of strength I might fold it but as a default it's a shove. The other thing that might make me fold is the length of the blind levels, greater than 30 mins makes a fold more possible as u might find a better spot especially if you have easy blinds to your button. If levels are 15/20 mins live then he'd have to flip the Kings over for me not to shove.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Hand 1: Villain is playing a 25bb stack and opening UTG. Those who shove here;
                    what range do you open here?
                    Maybe I should be asking what range you give an unknown doing this?

                    Also, are people actually going to be stealing in these spots? Why would you?

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Caf View Post
                      Hand 1: Villain is playing a 25bb stack and opening UTG. Those who shove here;
                      what range do you open here?
                      Maybe I should be asking what range you give an unknown doing this?

                      Also, are people actually going to be stealing in these spots? Why would you?
                      If he's good he's opening wide, mid suited cards, any ace, good kings etc - especially if table is passive. Reason easy chip accumulation. If he's opening 2/3 times an orbit u should have plenty of FE. If he's not opening too often then that changes things.
                      Ps 25 BBs is prob above average.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Arazi View Post
                        If he's good he's opening wide, mid suited cards, any ace, good kings etc - especially if table is passive. Reason easy chip accumulation. If he's opening 2/3 times an orbit u should have plenty of FE. If he's not opening too often then that changes things.
                        Ps 25 BBs is prob above average.
                        So your reasoning is based on having a read? We've just moved to the table.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Winning! View Post
                          Hand 1) shove. Dunno why people wanna fold 77 with 13BBs, we're unlikely to find many better spots and this brings with it some FE vs a randoms range, which would technically be a MP raising range since the table is likely 8-handed, so a tad wider than UTG.
                          Balls I don't agree with Winning, something is wrong I'd much prefer to be fold here and be first to shove with 13 bigs then raise over the UTG+1 raiser in this situation. Both hands, stacks mentioned seem quite shallow and would expect a call a high % of the time from the raiser so flipping at best

                          Comment


                            #14
                            hand 1 is close as mentioned but i would lean towards a fold in this situation... hand 2 is a call all day long.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Caf View Post
                              So your reasoning is based on having a read? We've just moved to the table.
                              I never said it was read based, I actually said it was a default shove for me but just mentioned some factors that could make me fold 77 with a 13 bb stack to a minish raise this late in a tournament

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Originally posted by ghostface ste View Post
                                would expect a call a high % of the time from the raiser so flipping at best
                                It's going to cost the opener 22.5k to call with 13.6k dead. I think he'd need to have AQs/1010+ here to call and player with significantly more chips than us (and a few more at the table I'll guess) will be opening a fairly wide range here. The raise size would suggest to me that he is a good player which would also add to the arguement that he should have a wide enough range.

                                I think our shove is getting thru here a lot and would be shoving much more than folding although would fold it the odd time.

                                Hand 2 is a call he prob has 77 or some crap!

                                (time to read the spoilers now).

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Read the spoilers, follow the SB from hand 1 and play with him wherever he goes. His play was awful there.

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by Caf View Post
                                    Hand 1: Villain is playing a 25bb stack and opening UTG. Those who shove here;
                                    what range do you open here?
                                    Maybe I should be asking what range you give an unknown doing this?

                                    Also, are people actually going to be stealing in these spots? Why would you?
                                    UTG is the new button.

                                    I'd lean towards a shove too all things being equal.

                                    Edit :
                                    Read the spoilers LOL @ the dealer...he can just GTFO
                                    Turning millions into thousands

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by Caf View Post
                                      Hand 1: easy fold.

                                      Hand 2: easy call.
                                      Originally posted by ghostface ste View Post
                                      Balls I don't agree with Winning, something is wrong I'd much prefer to be fold here and be first to shove with 13 bigs then raise over the UTG+1 raiser in this situation. Both hands, stacks mentioned seem quite shallow and would expect a call a high % of the time from the raiser so flipping at best
                                      All of the above.

                                      Spots and good spots......ok we 'may' be folding the best hand, 'potentially the best hand'...., this deep, irrespective of hole cards, at this stage of the tourney there are most definitely better spots imo than to be hoping to be flipping at best.

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        Hand #1 - Stack sizes still to act may also be a consideration for me in this spot. Are there any shorties likely to re-shove ? Certainly don't like the hand in a 3-way pot. As described, I think I find a fold here most of the time.

                                        Hand #2 - Insta-Call.

                                        Scene #3 - John Boy Whacks Dealer with a Glock :-)

                                        Comment


                                          #21
                                          Originally posted by NuckChorris View Post
                                          It's going to cost the opener 22.5k to call with 13.6k dead. I think he'd need to have AQs/1010+ here to call and player with significantly more chips than us (and a few more at the table I'll guess) will be opening a fairly wide range here. The raise size would suggest to me that he is a good player which would also add to the arguement that he should have a wide enough range.

                                          AQs/1010+ is too tight of a calling range for villain imo. You actually fold 99 to a 13bb reshove?

                                          Originally posted by Strewelpeter View Post
                                          UTG is the new button.
                                          Not with these stacks imo. What's the reasoning behind opening wide there?





                                          What range are you reshoving? Is 77 the worst you would shove?
                                          Last edited by Caf; 14-12-11, 17:59.

                                          Comment


                                            #22
                                            Originally posted by Caf View Post
                                            AQs/1010+ is too tight of a calling range for villain imo. You actually fold 99 to a 13bb reshove?
                                            As people have said of the 77 hand you'd be close between folding and calling a shove with 99 as you'd "be flipping at best". I'd be folding 88 for sure if it's 11.25BB to call after investing only 2.25BB. Villain would also be risking going from a 20-25BB bullying stack to a 10-13BB shoving stack. It's definitely a factor that would add to the fold equity of the semi-premium hands that he can open with.

                                            Originally posted by Caf View Post
                                            What range are you reshoving? Is 77 the worst you would shove?
                                            77 would certainly be near the bottom of my shoving range here anyway.

                                            Comment


                                              #23
                                              I'd expect him to call with 88+, AJ+ and it'd be close with 55, 66, 77, A10 and KQ.
                                              I'd play 66 and AJ the same, probably folding A10, KQ is close, deffo shoving KQsuited.

                                              Comment


                                                #24
                                                1 is close as others have said. My default online would be to shove and live to fold (mainly for reasons Arazi gave in his original post). If the utg guy was over 30 I'd definitely fold. If he was 20 and wearing a baseball cap or a hoody I'd be more likely to shove

                                                2 is a call.
                                                My poker blog - Doking around in cyberspace

                                                Comment


                                                  #25
                                                  Originally posted by Kie Diddy View Post
                                                  Hand 1: e130 LIVE F.O
                                                  BLINDS 1,000/2,000 ante 200

                                                  Just moved tables so no reads per se, 16 left, 6 paid
                                                  Villain (UTG+1)(50k) RAISES TO 4500
                                                  fold to..
                                                  Hero (button)(27k) 77

                                                  best play at this stage and stacks??

                                                  SPOILER
                                                  I shove which I felt was fine but could be wrong (SB shoves 35k with AJ, UTG+1 calls with KK- A hi flop...)


                                                  Hand 2: e100 Live f.o

                                                  I've been super active , opening loads and shown 2/3 big bluffs...
                                                  Blinds 800/1600 ante 100
                                                  15 left 7 paid

                                                  Hero (36k)(c.o) raises to 3900 with AQ

                                                  Villain (25K) (s.b) goes all-in

                                                  call????

                                                  SPOILER
                                                  I thought for a momnet and called, villain had 66, flop a queen, river a 6. Dealer made a comment under his breath about it being a bad call to the guy in seat 9 which particularly made me question my call which I thought was fine
                                                  The first one i'd fold unless he's been very active regardless of position and you think you have more FE than you should have in theory in this spot. Id rather open jam T9s in LP than rejam here.

                                                  Second hand it's a def get in just ul. Just remind the d-bag dealer that he's dealing for a living not grinding

                                                  Comment

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