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    WSOP Circuit Event Ireland

    Hi Guys,

    I'm working on a number of very interesting projects at the moment.

    One which is on my lap at the moment is WSOP Circuit Event.

    The big problem with the circuit events as I see it is the large reg fee's due to the licencing fee which needs to be paid to WSOP.

    The Main event is €1675 (€175 reg fee) the other ring events been €580 (€80 reg) €365 (€65 Reg).

    Most of the ring events are €365.

    Is there enough interest here to host one of these or should I just give it a miss?
    €10,000 GTD New Monthly Tournament
    Village Green Card Club, Last Thursday of the Month, €270 Freezeout
    €1,000,000 GTD - Irish Open
    CityWest Hotel, 6th-13th April

    #2
    any gaurantee?

    Comment


      #3
      More info please. Way too Vague!

      Comment


        #4
        A chance to bring another major event to Ireland I think should be a no brainer.

        Comment


          #5
          Reg fees are too high imo but I'm sure a lot of people would like to play a WSOP Circuit event regardless. (In truth most rec players don't give a toss about the reg fee)

          The smaller buy-in WSOP structures are pretty lame compared to what we are used to on this side of the pond. That would be a big consideration for me. Would they allow you to define the structure ?
          Last edited by PokerPiper; 10-07-15, 15:03.

          Comment


            #6
            Reg Fee would be a problem if we had to play an event like this everyday, but I don't think 25€ extra reg fee (on top of std 10%) for a one-off event would really make much difference, the key is to have a nice slow structure though.
            "Poker isn’t about default strategies, it’s about exploiting your opponent's bad tendencies"

            Comment


              #7
              Do you think the WSOP brand would attract new players/players who wouldn't normally play that high?

              Would you have to run all the satellites yourself or would they be bringing in outside players through satellites (eg through online promotions or satellites elsewhere in Europe?)

              I'd probably be in favour of it regardless but I agree that a good structure would make a big difference to my likelihood of playing.

              Comment


                #8
                Take it on.

                Comment


                  #9
                  I'm really unconvinced that the simple branding of a tournament series will have a big effect on numbers in this country. Just look at how unsuccessful the WPT was a couple of years ago.

                  Too small a buy-in to have travelling pros attend combined with the fact that €1000+ tournies here are more or less dead without regular sats running that only Stars can maintain. As a result it's a big risk in my opinion. I think if you were to ask any of the regular big buy-in players here their opinion you'd get their preference toward having the tournament unbranded with €100 rake that the WSOP logo attatched for €175.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by LTL View Post
                    I'm really unconvinced that the simple branding of a tournament series will have a big effect on numbers in this country. Just look at how unsuccessful the WPT was a couple of years ago.

                    Too small a buy-in to have travelling pros attend combined with the fact that €1000+ tournies here are more or less dead without regular sats running that only Stars can maintain. As a result it's a big risk in my opinion. I think if you were to ask any of the regular big buy-in players here their opinion you'd get their preference toward having the tournament unbranded with €100 rake that the WSOP logo attatched for €175.
                    I disagree, I think the WPT a few years exceeded expectations. I think for the main event particularly, a €175 reg would make little to no difference to a €150 reg. The side events with 21.66% rake is where numbers could falter, how important would side event numbers be in the venture? Also, I assume cash games would run as normal as in any festival and the rake would be the usual?
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                    Comment


                      #11
                      If it well structured none the regs that play these buy ins is going to skip a WSOP event on home soil IMO.. The big name brand will get players to pay the extra rake 1 week of the year I think just for bragging rights if they were to win a tournament. I would for this anyway because I'd love to say I won something like this. Not all players travel for poker so its there only shot at something like a WSOP. I think it would do well. Possibly more interest as a 1k doe for player's taking one big shot a year. This being it.. GL with it if it goes ahead hopefully so.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by ViperEyeIRL View Post
                        Reg Fee would be a problem if we had to play an event like this everyday, but I don't think 25€ extra reg fee (on top of std 10%) for a one-off event would really make much difference, the key is to have a nice slow structure though.
                        +1 The structure would have to reflect the buy in imho. With the right promotion, enough sat's on a different range of sites and a quality "slow structure" there's no reason it shouldn't be a success

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by noname1255 View Post
                          any gaurantee?
                          Most likely Not
                          €10,000 GTD New Monthly Tournament
                          Village Green Card Club, Last Thursday of the Month, €270 Freezeout
                          €1,000,000 GTD - Irish Open
                          CityWest Hotel, 6th-13th April

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by IPBYOUSAY View Post
                            More info please. Way too Vague!
                            Really didn't think my OP was that Vague. Only thing that's vague is the amount of the licencing fee but that's private and confidential.

                            The event itself would run for 10-12 days. Made up mostly of €365 ring events with 2 x €580 ring events and 1 Main Event €1675.
                            €10,000 GTD New Monthly Tournament
                            Village Green Card Club, Last Thursday of the Month, €270 Freezeout
                            €1,000,000 GTD - Irish Open
                            CityWest Hotel, 6th-13th April

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by PokerPiper View Post
                              Reg fees are too high imo but I'm sure a lot of people would like to play a WSOP Circuit event regardless. (In truth most rec players don't give a toss about the reg fee)

                              The smaller buy-in WSOP structures are pretty lame compared to what we are used to on this side of the pond. That would be a big consideration for me. Would they allow you to define the structure ?
                              Hi Tim,

                              I would have no say over the structures of the Ring Events as they are standardized globally.
                              €10,000 GTD New Monthly Tournament
                              Village Green Card Club, Last Thursday of the Month, €270 Freezeout
                              €1,000,000 GTD - Irish Open
                              CityWest Hotel, 6th-13th April

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Originally posted by robin View Post
                                Do you think the WSOP brand would attract new players/players who wouldn't normally play that high?

                                Would you have to run all the satellites yourself or would they be bringing in outside players through satellites (eg through online promotions or satellites elsewhere in Europe?)

                                I'd probably be in favour of it regardless but I agree that a good structure would make a big difference to my likelihood of playing.
                                No Guarantee of players from WSOP. It would be up to me to sell it to an online site to get behind it.
                                €10,000 GTD New Monthly Tournament
                                Village Green Card Club, Last Thursday of the Month, €270 Freezeout
                                €1,000,000 GTD - Irish Open
                                CityWest Hotel, 6th-13th April

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by LTL View Post
                                  I'm really unconvinced that the simple branding of a tournament series will have a big effect on numbers in this country. Just look at how unsuccessful the WPT was a couple of years ago.

                                  Too small a buy-in to have travelling pros attend combined with the fact that €1000+ tournies here are more or less dead without regular sats running that only Stars can maintain. As a result it's a big risk in my opinion. I think if you were to ask any of the regular big buy-in players here their opinion you'd get their preference toward having the tournament unbranded with €100 rake that the WSOP logo attatched for €175.
                                  This was my thinking on it originally.
                                  €10,000 GTD New Monthly Tournament
                                  Village Green Card Club, Last Thursday of the Month, €270 Freezeout
                                  €1,000,000 GTD - Irish Open
                                  CityWest Hotel, 6th-13th April

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by Jam-Fly View Post
                                    I disagree, I think the WPT a few years exceeded expectations. I think for the main event particularly, a €175 reg would make little to no difference to a €150 reg. The side events with 21.66% rake is where numbers could falter, how important would side event numbers be in the venture? Also, I assume cash games would run as normal as in any festival and the rake would be the usual?
                                    The WPT ran at a massive loss which is the reason why it didn't return to Ireland.

                                    Personally I'd prefer not to commit 4-6 months of my life to something that could end up costing me €100K.

                                    Yes rake would be normal.
                                    Last edited by JP Poker; 10-07-15, 20:03.
                                    €10,000 GTD New Monthly Tournament
                                    Village Green Card Club, Last Thursday of the Month, €270 Freezeout
                                    €1,000,000 GTD - Irish Open
                                    CityWest Hotel, 6th-13th April

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by IPBYOUSAY View Post
                                      +1 The structure would have to reflect the buy in imho. With the right promotion, enough sat's on a different range of sites and a quality "slow structure" there's no reason it shouldn't be a success
                                      Structure will be WSOP standard structures and I would have no say over them.
                                      €10,000 GTD New Monthly Tournament
                                      Village Green Card Club, Last Thursday of the Month, €270 Freezeout
                                      €1,000,000 GTD - Irish Open
                                      CityWest Hotel, 6th-13th April

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by JP Poker View Post
                                        Structure will be WSOP standard structures and I would have no say over them.
                                        How good/bad are the wsop standard structures for these events as they stand??
                                        would this be a new festival or try to incorporate it into an existing festival, the norweigan festival jumps to mind which would obviously boost player numbers but may turn off the recretional local player tho having an irish only ring event may solve that problem.
                                        The satt system both live and online would also play a massive role in the success of this festival, every pub player in the country would recoginise the wsop brand so be it tru league prizes or straight satts i'd imagine alot of interest in the lower buyin events from these players ....... it would a big undertaking for any operator.

                                        Comment


                                          #21
                                          Originally posted by underachievement View Post
                                          How good/bad are the wsop standard structures for these events as they stand??
                                          would this be a new festival or try to incorporate it into an existing festival, the norweigan festival jumps to mind which would obviously boost player numbers but may turn off the recretional local player tho having an irish only ring event may solve that problem.
                                          The satt system both live and online would also play a massive role in the success of this festival, every pub player in the country would recoginise the wsop brand so be it tru league prizes or straight satts i'd imagine alot of interest in the lower buyin events from these players ....... it would a big undertaking for any operator.
                                          Yes this was the plan when I originally begun talks with Jack Effel.

                                          However I am also looking at different dates.
                                          €10,000 GTD New Monthly Tournament
                                          Village Green Card Club, Last Thursday of the Month, €270 Freezeout
                                          €1,000,000 GTD - Irish Open
                                          CityWest Hotel, 6th-13th April

                                          Comment


                                            #22
                                            Originally posted by JP Poker View Post
                                            Hi Tim,

                                            I would have no say over the structures of the Ring Events as they are standardized globally.
                                            Had a look at the 2014/15 Circuit structures.

                                            1675 Main starts with 20k & 40min levels day 1 increasing to 60min and then 75mins on day 2. All levels included.

                                            365 starts with 10k and 30min levels progressing to 40/50/60

                                            580 starts with 12k with same clock as above.

                                            Not a million miles away i suppose.

                                            I was comparing to WSOP 1k/1.5k's which start with 5k & 7.5k stacks but have 1hr clock.

                                            Its really all about the numbers and marketing I think.

                                            Comment


                                              #23
                                              Originally posted by JP Poker View Post
                                              The WPT ran at a massive loss which is the reason why it didn't return to Ireland.

                                              Personally I'd prefer not to commit 4-6 months of my life to something that could end up costing me €100K.

                                              Yes rake would be normal.
                                              Didn't realise this, from a player's pov at the time I thought main event numbers had exceeded expectations.
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                                              Comment


                                                #24
                                                Originally posted by Jam-Fly View Post
                                                Didn't realise this, from a player's pov at the time I thought main event numbers had exceeded expectations.
                                                (Obviously Main Event numbers doesn't always equal a successful festival too)
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                                                Comment


                                                  #25
                                                  Originally posted by Jam-Fly View Post
                                                  Didn't realise this, from a player's pov at the time I thought main event numbers had exceeded expectations.
                                                  There was like 3 tables at the start of day 1a.

                                                  IIRC, they even delayed the start time to get those numbers. WPT Dublin was a clusterfuck IMO

                                                  Comment


                                                    #26
                                                    Originally posted by newbie2 View Post
                                                    There was like 3 tables at the start of day 1a.

                                                    IIRC, they even delayed the start time to get those numbers. WPT Dublin was a clusterfuck IMO
                                                    just had a look there and it got 338 runners. I remember a lot of people were setting the over/under at like 200 so from that point of view, it was actually better than expected. But obviously based on what's been said, a lot more was needed for it be deemed close to a success.


                                                    Anyway fwiw JP, in my own personal opinion, I think the 1675 main event would attract a lot and the slightly higher reg fee is negligible and I think would be more than made up for by the WSOP brand (i.e. I think a 1500+175 WSOP Circuit Event would get more runners than a 1500+150 non-affiliated event).

                                                    However, I doubt you'd get many playing multiple 365 or 580 side events and I'd be doubtful whether the Irish poker economy is big enough to sustain a 10-12 day festival. I'm sure nearly every player in the country might call in at some stage, but I can't see many people playing every day. I also wouldn't imagine the daily games would be big enough to attract many players traveling from the UK or Europe. You'd need some influx of players/money (the Norwegian Championship being the obvious example) as I just don't think the Irish poker economy is big enough, and by the sounds of things, there won't be any huge influx of players from an online site or from abroad.

                                                    Anyway, just my $0.02, I'm sure you'd be better informed than my regardless.
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                                                    Comment


                                                      #27
                                                      Originally posted by Jam-Fly View Post
                                                      just had a look there and it got 338 runners. I remember a lot of people were setting the over/under at like 200 so from that point of view, it was actually better than expected. But obviously based on what's been said, a lot more was needed for it be deemed close to a success.
                                                      I think events are successful when they make the organisers money, and are then repeated because people like money. Events that lose money don't get repeated. The amount of horses involved is academic to those concerns really.

                                                      I guess an exception may be if you are running a poker website and want a "flagship" event and are willing to lose money on the live event that is considered a discounted marketing / advertising investment - but even PP passed a threshold on that with the IO this year.
                                                      "Worldly wisdom teaches that it is better for reputation to fail conventionally than to succeed unconventionally." - John Maynard Keynes

                                                      Comment


                                                        #28
                                                        ...From someone that plays only occasionally, an event like this would be fantastic to Play...the extra €25:00 reg compared to normal reg is no issue at all. To say you won a wsop style event is worth alot more than the extra reg fee...not too sure about the other event's...it could be difficult to sustain 10 days of events to a profitable level...I'd say if you could make it 3/4 days of slightly higher buy ins followed by main event it would work better...

                                                        Comment


                                                          #29
                                                          [QUOTE=Jam-Fly;908163]


                                                          However, I doubt you'd get many playing multiple 365 or 580 side events and I'd be doubtful whether the Irish poker economy is big enough to sustain a 10-12 day festival. I'm sure nearly every player in the country might call in at some stage, but I can't see many people playing every day. I also wouldn't imagine the daily games would be big enough to attract many players traveling from the UK or Europe. You'd need some influx of players/money (the Norwegian Championship being the obvious example) as I just don't think the Irish poker economy is big enough, and by the sounds of things, there won't be any huge influx of players from an online site or from abroad.


                                                          Would tend to agree with this view.
                                                          http://www.pokerinireland.net/

                                                          Comment


                                                            #30
                                                            Originally posted by JP Poker View Post
                                                            Really didn't think my OP was that Vague. Only thing that's vague is the amount of the licencing fee but that's private and confidential.

                                                            The event itself would run for 10-12 days. Made up mostly of €365 ring events with 2 x €580 ring events and 1 Main Event €1675.
                                                            10-12 days seems a bit over the top but as long as it was built around the tourneys and not around the cash games then I guess it could work, depending on sats and some higher buy in sides to attract the over seas player base.

                                                            Comment


                                                              #31
                                                              Originally posted by LuckyLloyd View Post
                                                              I think events are successful when they make the organisers money, and are then repeated because people like money. Events that lose money don't get repeated. The amount of horses involved is academic to those concerns really.

                                                              I guess an exception may be if you are running a poker website and want a "flagship" event and are willing to lose money on the live event that is considered a discounted marketing / advertising investment - but even PP passed a threshold on that with the IO this year.
                                                              yeah as I've said, I realise now it's obvious the event was a disaster from the organiser's pov. I was only saying that from a player's perspective, the ME seemed to have attracted more players than originally predicted.
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                                                              Comment


                                                                #32
                                                                Great to see a promotor engaging with punters about reg fees. Personally for me to play a 1k plus event I would be looking for at least one hour long blinds

                                                                Comment


                                                                  #33
                                                                  Originally posted by Hectorjelly View Post
                                                                  Great to see a promotor engaging with punters about reg fees. Personally for me to play a 1k plus event I would be looking for at least one hour long blinds
                                                                  Thanks Daragh,

                                                                  Unfortunately I'll have no say over the structures of the ring events as they are stardardized from WSOP.
                                                                  €10,000 GTD New Monthly Tournament
                                                                  Village Green Card Club, Last Thursday of the Month, €270 Freezeout
                                                                  €1,000,000 GTD - Irish Open
                                                                  CityWest Hotel, 6th-13th April

                                                                  Comment


                                                                    #34
                                                                    I think this is a cool idea, would definitely play
                                                                    My poker blog - Doking around in cyberspace

                                                                    Comment


                                                                      #35
                                                                      It does appeal, especially the idea of several side events. How many would be non-NLHE? Any scope for a PLO/8 event?

                                                                      Comment


                                                                        #36
                                                                        Think I'll be putting this on the back burner for the moment unfortunately.

                                                                        Exploring another option which looks very promising
                                                                        €10,000 GTD New Monthly Tournament
                                                                        Village Green Card Club, Last Thursday of the Month, €270 Freezeout
                                                                        €1,000,000 GTD - Irish Open
                                                                        CityWest Hotel, 6th-13th April

                                                                        Comment


                                                                          #37
                                                                          Shame, but intrigued by the new option...

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