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    Sunday Million Hand

    Hey, just want a bit of feedback on this hand. Thought it was a tough spot and want people's opinion on the right play? Been told its good to leave the result out of the OP for a while to get best feedback? Just FYI I was playing fairly standard up to this and didnt have many hand go to showdown. I had a fairly tight image at the table which I think was the biggest influence in my decisions throughout the hand. All feedback appreciated.

    PokerStars - $200+$15|125/250 Ante 25 NL - Holdem - 9 players
    Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

    BTN: 10175
    SB: 15387
    Hero (BB): 13390
    UTG: 11170 (VPIP: 15.38, PFR: 9.62, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 52)
    UTG+1: 20568
    UTG+2: 5957
    MP: 9575
    MP+1: 31626
    CO: 28266

    9 players post ante of 25, SB posts 125, Hero posts BB 250

    Pre Flop: (pot: 600) Hero has K:diamond: K:spade:

    UTG raises to 520 , fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 1125, UTG calls

    Flop: (2600, 2 players) 7:diamond: 2:spade: 2:diamond:
    Hero bets 1125, UTG calls 1125

    Turn: (4850, 2 players) A:spade:
    Hero checks, UTG bets 2100, Hero calls 2100

    River: (9050, 2 players) 6:heart:
    Hero checks, UTG bets 6795 and is all-in, Hero calls 6795
    Last edited by Duecewilder; 06-05-13, 19:55. Reason: Requested Changes
    Poker is like sex, position is everything..

    Twitter: https://twitter.com/Duecewilder

    #2
    ughhh can you put it into amounts, and not numbers of BBs? That's just an eyesore

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by Flushdraw View Post
      ughhh can you put it into amounts, and not numbers of BBs? That's just an eyesore
      this!! that OP makes my eyes bleed

      Comment


        #4
        This is all pretty standard tbf

        EDIT: Miss read OP
        Last edited by Kenny; 06-05-13, 23:08.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Flushdraw View Post
          ughhh can you put it into amounts, and not numbers of BBs? That's just an eyesore
          Originally posted by chips1234 View Post
          this!! that OP makes my eyes bleed
          No bother just the way PT4 had it.
          Poker is like sex, position is everything..

          Twitter: https://twitter.com/Duecewilder

          Comment


            #6
            Defo need to 3 bet bigger this deep imo.

            Definitely think a call is high variance, seems very polarised, what sorta range you have him calling a 3 bet with??

            Comment


              #7
              Looking back I agree I prob should have deff 3 bet larger.

              Range wise I suppose since my 3 bet wasn't so large. Maybe 22+ AJs+ AQ+
              Last edited by Duecewilder; 06-05-13, 20:12. Reason: Ya no way he calls 3 bet with KQs
              Poker is like sex, position is everything..

              Twitter: https://twitter.com/Duecewilder

              Comment


                #8
                I had a fairly tight image at the table which I think was the biggest influence in my decisions throughout the hand.

                When you say this, do you think your opponent knows you have no A as you checked turn and therefore is bluffing you? If so and your read was good, VWP, great call.
                One of these days I am either going to quit poker or learn how to play the damn game

                Comment


                  #9
                  3-bet bigger because we're gonna be OOP in the hand. Other than that, I probably play it exactly the same.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    I wouldnt make it much more pre but maybe something like 1350.

                    I think betting something like 1700 on turn. I think it puts more bluffs in his turn raise range so you can go with your hand more. If he calls turn, I prob check reasses river.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Cheers for the advice.

                      *** SHOW DOWN ***
                      Kecinpulach: shows [9h 9d] (two pair, Nines and Deuces)
                      holdumAA: shows [Kd Ks] (two pair, Kings and Deuces)
                      holdumAA collected 22640 from pot

                      Originally posted by 40something View Post
                      I had a fairly tight image at the table which I think was the biggest influence in my decisions throughout the hand.

                      When you say this, do you think your opponent knows you have no A as you checked turn and therefore is bluffing you? If so and your read was good, VWP, great call.
                      Even though it was a good call, I was/still unsure if it was the right play..
                      I literally used all my time bank on river to make the call. In the end my logic for calling was that by check calling turn I allowed him to widen his bluff shove range on the river.

                      Not by any means a super leveling war or plan to induce the shove or anything of the sort More of a realisation with 30 seconds left to go in the Timebank that his bluff range might be wider than I originally thought.

                      Afterwards the thought of firing the turn crossed my mind and I wondered if it would have been a better play as Rory suggested?

                      But if I fire turn what would ye suggest if:

                      A Villain raises turn?
                      B Villain calls turn and the river is the same 6h?

                      Cheers
                      Last edited by Duecewilder; 06-05-13, 23:01.
                      Poker is like sex, position is everything..

                      Twitter: https://twitter.com/Duecewilder

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Duecewilder View Post
                        Cheers for the advice.

                        *** SHOW DOWN ***
                        Kecinpulach: shows [9h 9d] (two pair, Nines and Deuces)
                        holdumAA: shows [Kd Ks] (two pair, Kings and Deuces)
                        holdumAA collected 22640 from pot



                        Even though it was a good call, I was/still unsure if it was the right play..
                        I literally used all my time bank on river to make the call. In the end my logic for calling was that by check calling river I allowed him to widen his bluff shove range on the river.

                        Not by an means a super leveling war or plan to induce the shove or anything of the sort More of a realisation with 30 seconds left to go in the Timebank that his bluff range might be wider than I originally thought.

                        Afterwards the thought of firing the turn crossed my mind and I wondered if it would have been a better play as Rory suggested?

                        But if I fire turn what would ye suggest if:

                        A Villain raises turn?
                        B Villain calls turn and the river is the same 6h?

                        Cheers
                        Its villain dependent, but I would be betting small on turn to increase his bluff turn raise. So A) I call.

                        B) Is a little trickier, its unlikely he has air by just calling both pre/flop/turn. He doenst have to have an Ace though. I think checking is the best option. I expect you will get a decent amount of check backs having bet the turn. So B) Villain dependent, dynamics etc but prob check/ fold or check/call.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Duecewilder View Post
                          I
                          Pre Flop: [i]
                          Hero raises to 1125,

                          Flop:
                          Hero bets 1125,
                          A?s other have said, I like making it more pre.
                          I's also make the flop bet bigger than pre. Maybe a shade over half pot, so 1350/1400 or so as played - slightly bigger had you raised more pre.

                          Even though it was a good call, I was/still unsure if it was the right play..
                          I literally used all my time bank on river to make the call. In the end my logic for calling was that by check calling turn I allowed him to widen his bluff shove range on the river.
                          This.
                          When you decide to check call turn, you should follow through. There aren't many times when he bluffs the turn and gives up on the river.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Betting the turn 95% of the time here.

                            While it's not a great turn card for us, it's not that bad either.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              I like to 3bet to like 1500 pre due to being oop.

                              As played, I lead turn for like 1600. If called, the river will usually go ch-ch. If he bets river, I usually fold - he'd want to be getting very creative to bet worse on the river the way the hand plays out. If he raises ur bet on the turn, depending on size of raise, I prob call.

                              As played, ur right, his bluffing range is wider. The problem I have with the call is on the river, the only way your winning is if he is literally turning a hand like 99 into a bluff. Assuming he's not on some crazy bluff with the T8o or something, the only hands you beat are smaller pocket pairs and missed flush draws.

                              The most likely suited cards he plays pre-flop are Ax of diamons, and KQ/KJ/KT of diamonds, the Ax beats u and u have the king of diamonds. That leave the QJdd, 89dd etc. Does he open utg and call a 3-bet with these hands? It's of course possible that he does, but it's unlikely enough.

                              One you rule out missed draws, there's not a lot of hands that make sense here. I would have thought a lot of people with hands like 88-QQ would just check back. Because 88-QQ have some showdown value, the likelihood of people betting with it decreases.


                              Of course, he could put you on the KK the way hand plays out which makes the bluffing with 88, 99, TT etc. greater. But like, if he has QQ, he's hardly going to put you on exactly KK and try to make you fold it? If he has JJ, is he going to put u on exactly KK or QQ and try to make you fold it? It's get a little easier with TT as he can now put u on KK,QQ,JJ, and even easier again with 99 etc. etc.
                              If you want to be really pedantic (although I think this last paragraph is prob a bit too much so!) I think he never turns QQ into a bluff (simply because QQ can beat JJ or lower which u cud legitimately be 3-betting an utg open pf) and very rarely turns JJ into a bluff.
                              TT is definitely possible, and I can see a legitimate reason for claiming 99-88 is in his bluffing range.

                              But basically all told, I don't like making a call based on putting a guy on TT, 99, 88 and even then not being sure if he plays those hands like that!
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                              Comment


                                #16
                                Just in general gameplay I would flat pre and check raise nearly every flop without an Ace on it. 3betting Utg players from bb with tight image screams too much strength. I find I get paid off way more by just flatting pre for deception.
                                Huh, Math my dear boy is nothing more than the lesbian sister of biology.

                                My Poker Blog http://jason-tompkins.blogspot.com
                                My twitter http://twitter.com/#!/blaaaaaah666

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by blaaaaaaah View Post
                                  Just in general gameplay I would flat pre and check raise nearly every flop without an Ace on it. 3betting Utg players from bb with tight image screams too much strength. I find I get paid off way more by just flatting pre for deception.
                                  Hey Jason hows Oz , do you always fold an A high flop here then also ?
                                  cheers Liam
                                  Atlantis Events Beat The Boss Saturday 7th Mar @5pm €5,000 Gtd The Dolmen Carlow

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    im with blaaaaaaah on this you said it yourself with a really tight image makes no sence in 3 betting hear and when you check raise the flop you can easy have 22+ yourself from his point of view its so easy for him to 3 bet your checkraise with 99+ hear puting you on a wide range draws and pairs ,,, with the line you take in this hand from a poalrised 3 bet range pre so easy for a good player to exploit this and have a wider bluffing range

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by Atlantispoker View Post
                                      Hey Jason hows Oz , do you always fold an A high flop here then also ?
                                      cheers Liam
                                      Hey Liam, na i check call on the flop and evaluate later streets. Damage control, fold/call down based on betsize/reads. Oz is great craic, it was a nice build up to Vegas.
                                      Huh, Math my dear boy is nothing more than the lesbian sister of biology.

                                      My Poker Blog http://jason-tompkins.blogspot.com
                                      My twitter http://twitter.com/#!/blaaaaaah666

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