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    pot vs the valorian

    Thought I'd throw up a HH to get the ball rolling on here. The villian, which is certainly apt word as its valor.

    cant find the HH, but was something along the lines of ....

    both playing $100, HU game, pretty loose action.

    Im dealt 3578 (suits irrelvant)


    he raises SB to 3

    I call

    FLOP : 2x3x5h

    check check

    TURN: 10h

    I lead for $5

    he reraises to $20

    I repot to 80 or w/e.

    Had a good discussion with valor after the hand, think it was one of the more interesting hands. anyone , ANYONE like it?

    #2
    i can be converted to any line of thinking in omaha.

    Reasons for liking it:
    1) an a4xx hand is unlikely as valor is probably too good to play a hand with a dangler, i.e akj4.
    2) villains usually raise draws and call their made hands (maybe this is wrong, but seems common at the micros).
    3) I dont think 22, 33, 55 check the flop.
    4) i cant think of a hand he's trying to represent.

    reasons for not liking it:
    1) its omaha, and 9/10 times I am beat in any pot, as a general rule.
    2) we have little or no outs (4) if we do get called, and even if we do they may not be live outs.

    Comment


      #3
      You have the hand a bit wrong, although it doesnt change much

      You have 8h 3h 5d 8d

      and the flop was

      6d 5s 3s

      I check back flop,

      Turn Tc

      You bet $5 into $6, I make it $19, you make it $63

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by ditpoker View Post
        i can be converted to any line of thinking in omaha.

        Reasons for liking it:
        1) an a4xx hand is unlikely as valor is probably too good to play a hand with a dangler, i.e akj4.
        2) villains usually raise draws and call their made hands (maybe this is wrong, but seems common at the micros).
        3) I dont think 22, 33, 55 check the flop.
        4) i cant think of a hand he's trying to represent.

        reasons for not liking it:
        1) its omaha, and 9/10 times I am beat in any pot, as a general rule.
        2) we have little or no outs (4) if we do get called, and even if we do they may not be live outs.
        1 I mean this point does not make any sense, I probably play 100% of hands with A4 in them from the BU in HU PLO
        3 I actually thinking checking the flop here is a pretty good option, especially with 22, because I think I get cred a lot on this board, and I wont be happy with it, and also because Chubb was check raising alot of flops, or folding, and not check calling alot, which is not the result we want when we cbet with a hand like bottom set here. So sometimes I bet/dont fold 22, but I def have it in my check range
        4 Thats the point and what makes it a good play sometimes, is that it confuses people and they have no idea what you have

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Valor View Post
          1 I mean this point does not make any sense, I probably play 100% of hands with A4 in them from the BU in HU PLO
          3 I actually thinking checking the flop here is a pretty good option, especially with 22, because I think I get cred a lot on this board, and I wont be happy with it, and also because Chubb was check raising alot of flops, or folding, and not check calling alot, which is not the result we want when we cbet with a hand like bottom set here. So sometimes I bet/dont fold 22, but I def have it in my check range
          4 Thats the point and what makes it a good play sometimes, is that it confuses people and they have no idea what you have
          wow, i'd struggle to write something more condescending.

          did i learn something reading your post. yes.
          did i enjoy reading your post. no.

          Comment


            #6
            ha, Not the nicest way of explaining it valor.

            But in HU plo you pretty much can't take anything out of starting hands. He was probably opening 90% + of buttons.

            Comment


              #7
              I wasn't trying to sound insulting or condescending, I was just trying to say its wrong, apologies

              Comment


                #8
                Wow talk about not being able to take a little criticism. Valor is capable of much harsher words than that. That may be the nicest post he's ever written. Didn't even seem a bit condescending.

                As regards to the hand, I guess my default would be to just bet/fold the turn, but I can see merits to raising over calling(if you plan to continue) as I think you can get owned so much on the river.
                Overall I don't know that much about PLO apart from the fact I run superhot when I play it.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by ditpoker View Post
                  i can be converted to any line of thinking in omaha.

                  Reasons for liking it:
                  1) an a4xx hand is unlikely as valor is probably too good to play a hand with a dangler, i.e akj4.
                  2) villains usually raise draws and call their made hands (maybe this is wrong, but seems common at the micros).
                  3) I dont think 22, 33, 55 check the flop.
                  4) i cant think of a hand he's trying to represent.

                  reasons for not liking it:
                  1) its omaha, and 9/10 times I am beat in any pot, as a general rule.
                  2) we have little or no outs (4) if we do get called, and even if we do they may not be live outs.
                  2. Not too sure what you mean here, any competent player should have a balance in there calling and raising hands. As in they are as you say, they would be easily exploitable.

                  3. sets can easily check back the flop for fear of being CR'd. But the question is why would they then reraise the turn??

                  4. This is the best point , his 'story' so to speak doesnt add up. There is no hand that if played as standard he can have.

                  The interesting point is then what sort of hands can he have.... how do we line up vs them.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Valor View Post
                    I wasn't trying to sound insulting or condescending, I was just trying to say its wrong, apologies
                    no worries. i may have taken it up the wrong way. excellent content though.

                    Originally posted by smoothcall View Post
                    2. Not too sure what you mean here, any competent player should have a balance in there calling and raising hands. As in they are as you say, they would be easily exploitable.

                    3. sets can easily check back the flop for fear of being CR'd. But the question is why would they then reraise the turn??

                    4. This is the best point , his 'story' so to speak doesnt add up. There is no hand that if played as standard he can have.

                    The interesting point is then what sort of hands can he have.... how do we line up vs them.
                    2. i have maybe 5k plo hands lifetime, so my knowledge of it is limited at best. What i meant was that what is most common at the micros that i'd play is say on QhJh9x board, KTxx will call down and bet the river strong if the nuts dont change, but a hand like Ahxhxx will pot like crazy. i.e. made hands play slower til river than draws to the nuts. this could be very very wrong but have seen a few players do it.

                    3. the 10 on the turn is a reasonably safe/dry card, only hand is majorly improves is ttxx. And only one card to come might be a reason for a set to get busy.

                    Originally posted by valor
                    4 Thats the point and what makes it a good play sometimes, is that it confuses people and they have no idea what you have
                    4. i guess this is player dependent. i.e against a bad villain, i.e. me, if my story doesnt add it up, its usually cos my story is bulls**t. but when the villain is good, i.e. valor, and his story doesnt add up its because he intentionally is trying to confuse you, at which point he could have a massive range and is harder to play against.

                    Hands that valor can check flop and reraise turn imo are a wrap sorta hand like 345x, 567x. I think the turn raise is probably a "smoothcall's turn lead is weak, what hand can he have the the T has helped him and any hand he checked flop with showdown value is weak enough to not lead flop so with one or both bits of info we can make him fold hands we lose to." Also,i think if valor called you're screwed.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      I personally think that in this type of spot, out of position against a good player, you just have to fold unless you think he is absolutely trying to fuck around with you. It sucks, and you are folding the best hand a decent amount of the time, but you cant call and play a river with this hand and the board texture, and I dont think the risk reward of 3 betting justifies it

                      Comment

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