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Stars 3x Turbo Satellites strategy

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    Stars 3x Turbo Satellites strategy

    I know that no-one is going to give away their secrets here, but was wondering about everyone's thoughts on strategy for these 3x Turbo Sats. I know many play the nightly UKIPT €8 3x Turbos, while others grind the other 3x Turbos that run throughout each day. I have played a good few of these, with buy-ins between $1 and €10, and have made a profit thus far, but doubt my sample size is big enough to come to any conclusion about long-term ROI%!

    Firstly, what are the thoughts on strategy during the 60 minute registration / 90 minute rebuy period? I have focused on minimising the outlay needed to reach the crucial add-on break at 90 minutes (I think we can all agree that those who play these and don't last until the add-on are missing the point of these entirely!), so I often register sometime in the last 5 minutes possible (between 55-60 minutes in), only go for single rebuys and then obviously auto add-on when I reach that point. This keeps my average number of rebuys down to usually between 10-15, though sometimes I can get lucky; last night I reached the break in a €2 3x Turbo with one of the biggest stacks after only 6 rebuys.

    I feel that if I rebuy 10 times and start after the break with between 33K and 50K (usually the case unless I build a big stack), in the long term my profit will not be significantly less than those who rebuy 30 times and start after the break with between 33K and 150K (given if you play more aggressively and always double rebuy, you should have a bigger average chip stack). I notice that many of those who successfully grind the 3x Turbos (120z_mouse and others) pursue a single rebuy strategy, while others (I think Midnitekowby is among them) go for the double rebuys - thoughts on this? How aggressively do you play during the rebuy period; survival tactics versus chip accumulation?

    Once the add-on break has finished, I guess that most of us try to play perfect push-fold poker; those with a decent stack can wait a while while everyone else needs to get moving fast (blinds start off at 6K/12K/1.2K so the vast majority of remaining players have less than 10BB). I think that many players tighten up too much during the initial period following the break, and then next in the run-up to the final table (so 14 players out or so) and it's slightly easier to build your stack at this point. If there is any time during these turbos that stats come into play, it is in identifying the true rocks at this point! Thoughts?

    As mentioned above, I doubt anyone wants to give away too much here, but so many of us play these that it's worth having a discussion at least.



    #2
    run like kowby

    /endthread
    48

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      #3
      Plenty of notes on players needed in the €8 rebuys imo, not so much in the cheaper ones.

      Double-rebuys up to a certain blind level then single?

      Maths & fold-equity/position after the break?

      Kill the mouse whenever possible.

      Also what Loopz said!

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by Dice75 View Post
        Double-rebuys up to a certain blind level then single?
        Yeah, have seen this mentioned on 2+2 before; not usually a consideration for me, I usually register so late in the game that it is single buyins all the way.

        Kill the mouse whenever possible.
        Him and that Russian with the screenname I IXI I or whatever, he's proven himself a real pain in the arse, bah!

        Also what Loopz said!
        Most definitely


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          #5
          You pretty much nailed it there lads, not much to em.

          I double rebuy for 1st while, think til 600/1.2k lvl. Then switch to singles.
          Lots of players spazz out early with rebuys cause it's a 3x turbo, so win your first couple of allins from a double start and you have good chance of getting to addon without 1 more. And being the bossman big stack post break.

          All your doin really is buying time to choose your hands to commit with post break. Obviously like in every mtt there's a time to put foot on pedal and time to hold back.

          As regards notes, I dont bother much, I know the regs ranges and when u see a Spewy shove it stands out a mile anyways.

          Shoving the easy bit though, calling correctly and holding or incorrectly and dogging is what wins most o these

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Dice75 View Post
            Kill the mouse whenever possible.
            2nd this motion, mouse shoves ridiculous wide on bubbles/ final tables, he shoves Way beyond optimum shoving ranges but not near enough players are calling correctly so it's profitable for him. he's a clever player and will tighten ranges if shovin into me or doke or another reg.

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              #7
              Never played one of these, what's the 3x about?

              So they're basically unlimited rebuy turbos?

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                #8
                Also, is there UKIPT Galway ones on every night? I might have to give them a go tonight.

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                  #9
                  Originally posted by FeetMagic View Post
                  Also, is there UKIPT Galway ones on every night? I might have to give them a go tonight.
                  On at 21.02, most nights ticket only - some packages.
                  Over at 23.15ish normally.

                  Perfect strategy is as Kowby says, double buyin / addon / win ticket. Like throwing a nine-darter!
                  Think I've done it 3 times

                  Comment


                    #10
                    i have played a couple of these, but not much experience. however i do notice lads busting out and going for single rebuys of say 2000 chips when the blinds are something like 1.5k/3k and shoving any two cards in the hope of getting lucky i really cannot see the point of buying back in for less than 1 bb surely a double rebuy makes more sense and take a few hands before committing to shove.
                    anyhow like i said i don't play too many of them my general strategy is to go for 2 double buyins and the addon if iam still there. i can't see the sense in keeping throwing money at them just so that you will be there at the end of the rebuy.
                    anyhow i just play way to tight for these things and need an incredible amt of run good to go any distance due to my miserly approach of buying back into them
                    Last edited by Angry-Ball; 19-01-12, 14:32.



                    "Remember the time he ate my goldfish? And you lied and said I never had goldfish. Then why did I have the bowl, Bart? Why did I have the bowl?"

                    Comment


                      #11
                      What's the logic of only single rebuying later on in the rebuy period?

                      Comment


                        #12
                        The logic is its going all in anyway because you have no fold equity with blinds and antes taking most your stack. Why waste rebuy because if you hit you hit and win a sizeable pot.

                        i have played these and they are just a bit of a jokebox tbh. Most of the play is all in pre flop and what happens is you re raise all in with a hand like AK get called with hands like A6 and then fish on the button decides he will gamble his 2 5 suited because there is a nice pot up for grabs and bingo the fish hits his rags and takes it down. position is crucial in these turbos early position raise by you is inviting a snowball effect. Personally i think willing to re buy 10 times is too much in this format. Let others inflate the prize pool and if you have not been running good there is no shame in hitting the quit tournament button, waiting to get to the add on with a min stack and shoving is not going to work too often. I think by late reg you are practically forced all in on does levels and still have to last 30 mins to get to the add on. More often than not you going to leak many a re buy . Build early and if its not going to plan GTFO.

                        If you are willing to rebuy 10 times and an add on thats like rougly 90 euros. My advice would be enter a FO for a few more beans when a its a package not a seat too. A lot more skill involved. but maybe you prefer all in luck box poker. Anyways best of luck
                        Last edited by mugsy; 19-01-12, 15:21. Reason: .

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by zuutroy View Post
                          What's the logic of only single rebuying later on in the rebuy period?
                          There is no fold equity later in the rebuy period and it keeps your investment costs low, so your $ / chips ratio is nice and high following your add-on. The huge add-on depresses the value of having a big stack pre-break, so there is less incentive to ramp up your costs by double rebuying when bust. This is all about ROI rather than just winning I suppose!


                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by mugsy View Post
                            Personally i think willing to re buy 10 times is too much in this format. Let others inflate the prize pool and if you have not been running good there is no shame in hitting the quit tournament button, waiting to get to the add on with a min stack and shoving is not going to work too often. I think by late reg you are practically forced all in on does levels and still have to last 30 mins to get to the add on. More often than not you going to leak many a re buy . Build early and if its not going to plan GTFO.
                            I honestly think people shouldn't play these if they aren't willing to last until the break, otherwise you're just padding the prizepool for those with 'deeper' bankrolls. Maybe I'm wrong but those who grind these for profit get to the add-on break no matter the cost, that's the most consistent bit of 3x Turbo strategy I can see anyhow.


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                              #15
                              Originally posted by zuutroy View Post
                              What's the logic of only single rebuying later on in the rebuy period?
                              This is to keep your overall investment to a minimum, and to enable you to get to the crucial add-on break. Using the time bank is also crucial as the blinds come around to you and watching when the levels increase so as to try and gain some advantage from folding quickly or not.
                              You still need some run-good after the break though.

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                                #16
                                Originally posted by ionapaul View Post
                                I honestly think people shouldn't play these if they aren't willing to last until the break, otherwise you're just padding the prizepool for those with 'deeper' bankrolls. Maybe I'm wrong but those who grind these for profit get to the add-on break no matter the cost, that's the most consistent bit of 3x Turbo strategy I can see anyhow.
                                Exactly right imo.

                                Only difference for me are the EPT one's (€22/€33 3X's) where I'll double buyin & add on only most of the time unless I bust my stack early doors where i still have a shot of building a stack B4 it becomes crazy. Wouldnt play these too often anyway.

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by FeetMagic View Post
                                  Never played one of these, what's the 3x about?

                                  So they're basically unlimited rebuy turbos?
                                  3x just refers to the rebuy time period being 3 times as long as normal turbo rebuys (90mins instead of 30mins) afaik.

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by ArmaniJeans View Post
                                    3x just refers to the rebuy time period being 3 times as long as normal turbo rebuys (90mins instead of 30mins) afaik.
                                    speed of the blinds more like 5min blinds is the go of these things
                                    Last edited by Angry-Ball; 19-01-12, 15:44.



                                    "Remember the time he ate my goldfish? And you lied and said I never had goldfish. Then why did I have the bowl, Bart? Why did I have the bowl?"

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by ionapaul View Post
                                      I honestly think people shouldn't play these if they aren't willing to last until the break, otherwise you're just padding the prizepool for those with 'deeper' bankrolls. Maybe I'm wrong but those who grind these for profit get to the add-on break no matter the cost, that's the most consistent bit of 3x Turbo strategy I can see anyhow.

                                      I see your point if you decide to play you should be there at the business end when people are not as quick to gamble it up. I personally think that getting to the add on no matter the cost is flawed. The value in these turbos is minimum outlay for maximum reward. Yes if you have invested 7/8 rebuys you should probably slug it out to the add on too but I was more talking about not getting yourself in this situation. As skill is minimal in these you cannot claim to have much of an edge even if your phil ivey in a turbo of this structure. Why just hang in for a 30k add on thats probably abouts 7bb in any case. not to mention the high antes in the hope of getting a double up? The people who grind this for profit are not the ones padding the prizepool. Multi re buyers are.

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        Probably off topic as far as strategy is concerned, only ever played one of these last year for UKIPT Cork. Literally had 12 dollars in the account. Managed to get to break without rebuy, took add-on and was CL on FT. Had my KK bust by AQ I think and finished 2 off a package Need some serious run good in these, and a hefty balance. May try some more when I'm paid!

                                        Comment


                                          #21
                                          Get to the top up period at all costs IMO.

                                          Also what MK said
                                          Shoving the easy bit though, calling correctly and holding or incorrectly and dogging is what wins most o these
                                          Originally posted by mugsy View Post
                                          Why just hang in for a 30k add on thats probably abouts 7bb in any case.
                                          More like 2.5 BB's
                                          Last edited by newbie2; 19-01-12, 22:05.

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