9 Handed live F/O

[AlanO92]

Been kinda tilting over my decision here,wanna get a few opinions. Live game so stacks are rough,rest of the info is fairly accurate.

Blinds 400/800

4 limpers pre,we're sb(stack about 45k( with A9 raise to 2200
bb folds
2 limpers fold
HJ calls(roughly 55k)
Button calls

flop: 934

Hero bets 3700
HJ tanks and flats
button folds

turn: 3

Hero bets 7500
HJ tanks for about 3 mins(during which he requests a count of my stack),then ships all-in.

Hero?

This is the HJ's first hand at the table(tournament has just gone from 3 table to 2) and i've never played him before so no info outside what we get from the hand.

Thoughts?

[FeetMagic]

Any info on villain? Shocking raise pre to be honest, make it much bigger or jump complete. Flop bet is too small after that. As played it's a tough spot, with absolutely no info on villain I guess ya have to fold.

[AlanO92]

Any info on villain? Shocking raise pre to be honest, make it much bigger or jump complete. Flop bet is too small after that. As played it's a tough spot, with absolutely no info on villain I guess ya have to fold.

Only info i have is that the table that was just broken was very active and fairly loose but none of that is specific to the villain

[FeetMagic]

Sorry should've read last few lines. Well it's roughly 30k to win 53k. I probaby call.

[Mellor]

Sorry should've read last few lines. Well it's roughly 30k to win 53k. I probaby call.

I think its more like 63k, as the final pot will have to be about 94k (45k x 2 + limpers)
With 2/1 on the money I think call this.


As played, your bet sizing is too small everywhere.
<3BBs is too small pre OOP
There's 9k in the middle on the flop, you need to be more that c.1/3rd of the pot.

[Arazi]

Just flat pre, I'm actually amazed u got 2 of the limpers to fold, if you must raise I'd make it 5500.

As played its close, instinctively I want to fold but the maths probably make it closer to a call.

[Gholimoli]

i think he has a very narrow value range (44,33,43,99) and there really isnt't that many combos of them .

there isn't really that many naked 3s in his range either.
his semi bluffing range is much bigger though with two flush draws there and also str draw.

he doesn't play over pairs that way so getting 2/1 i think it's a snap call.

[KK82]

Meh, I fold. He probably has 44. Don't like your raise pre either. A9 doesn't play too well, epsecially out of position in what could be a multiway pot.

Actually, what size buy in is this? If it's just a small local tournament it's perfectly possible he could have an overpair too.

[NuckChorris]

Agree with others here. Don't like the raise pre or the sizing of it when you do. In live games many players will limp AJ/AQ and call down once they hit the ace so A9 is not a good hand to play OOP here. As played it's a tough one on the turn but without info a call is prob just about right.

[Winning!]

pre is lolbad, complete or make it like 6500, you're effectively stealing not trying to build a pot to get paid off when you hit cos at best you flop a weak TP on Axx or a vulnerable TPTK on 9xx.

As played this is one of the best runouts you could ask for making turn a fairly easy b/c. He never has TT+, even if villain is the type to limp that behind two others pre it just means he's passive enough to make a turn shove extremely unlikely. We lose to 7 boat combos and 1 combo of A3ss, maybe one or two other 3x combos, lets say 10 combos total. Boat combos make no sense as the shove is ridic big and would have expected them to raise that flop a lot 3way if they were the type to overplay/protect strong hands. A3ss/3x is about the only hand that makes sense, other than that I guess spazzers gon spazz, expect FD/SD/Combo-Draws and a few worse TP hands for the most part

[dbinit]

Nuf said about the preflop raise.. I'll leave that one well alone

HJ can already be put on a likely range of weak aces , suited connectors or low -med pairs just by his limping.

So what fits his tanking then calling post flop. A3 for sure A4 seems likely too A9 , or maybe he had a flush or straight draw and wanted to act a little weak on what was great odds for calling due to your very low post flop bet. 88's , 77s 66;s 55's or 44’s , 33s are also likely. It’s a big range for this flop.

The 3 changes a lot. He has just made trips , a boat , draw with A9 Also I don’t think his shove is all that weak as he was acting obviously weak before. He could be thinking that his acting skills were good enough to get you to call the other wise weak looking all in.

Most hands you are beating would just call here and try and get to a cheap show down. His all in to me was unlikely a bluff after he as seen you bet 3 times in a row. so he much more often than not has something , and would he make that play with 2nd 2 pair .. Not likely. Again , hes not desperate either . he has plenty of chips left to let go if he missed, so no need to risk his tournament on an all out bluff against a player already showing a lot of strength.

You’ve got plenty left in your stack and with so much out there that’s beating you and such a small possibility of a blatant bluff , I would not want to risk my tournament there.

[Gholimoli]

Nuf said about the preflop raise.. I'll leave that one well alone

HJ can already be put on a likely range of weak aces , suited connectors or low -med pairs just by his limping.

So what fits his tanking then calling post flop. A3 for sure A4 seems likely too A9 , or maybe he had a flush or straight draw and wanted to act a little weak on what was great odds for calling due to your very low post flop bet. 88's , 77s 66;s 55's or 44’s , 33s are also likely. It’s a big range for this flop.

The 3 changes a lot. He has just made trips , a boat , draw with A9 Also I don’t think his shove is all that weak as he was acting obviously weak before. He could be thinking that his acting skills were good enough to get you to call the other wise weak looking all in.

Most hands you are beating would just call here and try and get to a cheap show down. His all in to me was unlikely a bluff after he as seen you bet 3 times in a row. so he much more often than not has something , and would he make that play with 2nd 2 pair .. Not likely. Again , hes not desperate either . he has plenty of chips left to let go if he missed, so no need to risk his tournament on an all out bluff against a player already showing a lot of strength.

You’ve got plenty left in your stack and with so much out there that’s beating you and such a small possibility of a blatant bluff , I would not want to risk my tournament there.

alot of assumtion you have made are incorrect or irrelevent here imo such as his acting skills or what he thinks of his acting skills.

also the 3 on the turn doesn't change a whole alot.
there are not that many 3s in his pre-flop range (A3s,K3s,34s,23s) .
he folds alot of A3,K3,23 on the flop and 43 was already ahead of us anyway so the 3 on the turn does not change much if anything.

he has a value range when he shoves and he has bluffing/semi bluffing range.
i doubt he is ever on a pure bluff here so it's value range v semi-bluff range.

value range:

boats or poker: 1 combo of 99,2 combo of 34s,3 combos of 44 ,1 combo of 33 =7 combos

trips: i really don't think there are that many here if any but out of 6 combos of A3 i think he folds half preflop and half on the flop so that leaves us 1.5 combo.
there are 2 combos of K3s which again i think he folds then pre or on the flop ,half the time so that leaves us with on combo for a total of =2.5 combos

so his value range has 9.5 combos
i think his semibluffing range is alot bigger than the above so getting 2/1 on your money makes this a very easy call and a very bad fold IMO.

[dbinit]

jees man... Limpers commonly play with raggy aces and suited connectors. The board suits both... I dont like my top pair here for calling a shove . Also some players are big actors. And if they are acting weak (ie tanking on the flop) , theres a pretty good chance .. well you know..

Nah , loads of chips left.. im out

[Mellor]

And if they are acting weak (ie tanking on the flop) , theres a pretty good chance .. well you know..

Nah , loads of chips left.. im out

The vast majority of times when somebody takes some time for a decision, they are genuinely thinking and not acting. The assumption from a "few mins to call" to "he is acting therefore very strong" is ludicrous.
"Acting weak equals strength" is the kind of strat advice that I'd expect on a beer mat.

And 40 BBs or so isn't loads of chips in my opinion, but that irrelevant anyway. Calling is either profitable or it isn't. Our remaining stack doesn't change that.

[dbinit]

dunno about that. it depends on the player.. Ive seen some serious holywooding to instacall in my time..

[Bubbleking]

I just complete pre

cant see any reason to fold now

[Kie Diddy]

sigh call, get shown 9t ........ leave with grace (not a waitress)