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    marginal spot

    hi all, Quiet new here, this is the first hand ive ever posted so be gentle

    found myself in this spot last night and would like some opinions,

    we were four handed, the two big stacks were decent players especially the guy to my right, the villian in this hand was a strange argentinian player was openning 3x and 4x at the final table and his bet sizing was skeways, had reshoved over early position raises twice once with AJ(won a flip) and once with AQ suited which got a fold yet he showed it like it was the nuts.

    then we got this hand,

    money details
    1st 760
    2nd 550
    3rd 470
    4th 312

    UTG (t1,229,655)
    Button (t817,491)
    SB (t1,859,463)
    Hero (BB) (t842,391)

    Hero's M: 12.03

    Preflop: Hero is BB with ,
    1 fold, Button bets t813,116 (All-In), 1 fold,

    I have 8s whats the play?

    #2
    Min raise
    Carl Sagan - Pale Blue Dot

    Comment


      #3
      Ya snap call for me. Button gonna be shoving a pretty decent range I'd imagine. All Ax, weaker broadway hands and tiny pairs. Versus that range we do really well. Always calling here.

      Comment


        #4
        Snap call for me. As mentioned you're ahead of most of his range, you've a blind invested and potentially a lot of equity. Snap and hold IMO
        http://carlmorrissey.blogspot.com/
        http://twitter.com/#!/Moro88

        Comment


          #5
          snap call fistpump



          You obv lost since posted here

          Comment


            #6
            I'm not so sure guys, 88's are at the very bottom of his calling range four handed, he has an M of over 12 so he can definitely wait for a better spot. Also the ladder up is €158. Hero could definitely wait 2 orbits to pick up a stronger pair and decrease the chance of running into Aces
            If you do get it in bad don't worry, you could always flop quads

            Comment


              #7
              blinds were 17.5/35k so the point of having a blind out is not that relevant considering the stacks, I dont ever think its a 'snap call' as the vast majority of the time its gonna be flip which I prefer to avoid,

              does ICM come in to the equation due to the fact he is the only guy I have covered?

              the only thing I snapped was the time bank.... its def marginal at best

              Comment


                #8
                Definitely not marginal at best, it's a call. Perfect spot to give yourself a chance to ship, folding would be horrendous, you are absolutely crushing his shoving range.

                Just done very quickly on phone rounding up numbers, you need like 48% equity to make the call, you have more than that vs his shoving range, so it's a call
                Last edited by Guest; 17-05-13, 14:34.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by luckypadraig View Post
                  I'm not so sure guys, 88's are at the very bottom of his calling range four handed, he has an M of over 12 so he can definitely wait for a better spot. Also the ladder up is €158. Hero could definitely wait 2 orbits to pick up a stronger pair and decrease the chance of running into Aces
                  If you do get it in bad don't worry, you could always flop quads
                  You do pick up a bigger pair than 8's every 8 hands.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by englishbob View Post
                    blinds were 17.5/35k so the point of having a blind out is not that relevant considering the stacks, I dont ever think its a 'snap call' as the vast majority of the time its gonna be flip which I prefer to avoid,

                    does ICM come in to the equation due to the fact he is the only guy I have covered?

                    the only thing I snapped was the time bank.... its def marginal at best
                    It is always a snap call man. Always. If you're folding this 4 handed its criminal.

                    ICM doesn't really matter here when were like 1bb away from being the shorty.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      thats true peter, folding here would be horrible, this is why I posted this hand to get some views and I appreciate all feed back its a tricky spot we were 8hrs in at this stage and flipping against the 'weak spot' on the table isnt ideal either

                      Comment


                        #12
                        You can take AA KK & QQ out of his range as he wouldnt shove with them.

                        So in fact against:

                        JJ-22, A2s+, K9s+, QTs+, JTs, A2o+, KTo+, QTo+, JTo

                        you're a 60/40 favourite.

                        Never a clearer call IMO unless you don't like money
                        One of these days I am either going to quit poker or learn how to play the damn game

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by 40something View Post
                          You can take AA KK & QQ out of his range as he wouldnt shove with them.

                          So in fact against:

                          JJ-22, A2s+, K9s+, QTs+, JTs, A2o+, KTo+, QTo+, JTo

                          you're a 60/40 favourite.

                          Never a clearer call IMO unless you don't like money


                          This was exactly my thought process at the time and the reason I acted as I did,

                          It turned out he had the very top of his open shoving range

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by 40something View Post

                            JJ-22, A2s+, K9s+, QTs+, JTs, A2o+, KTo+, QTo+, JTo
                            No way hes shoving that range for this many bigs that needs adjusting, Playing atm so cant really have decent input.

                            It is a call but when 66 is probably a fold he does have a point about it being marginal

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Just too good a hand to fold imo 4 handed here! Big shove so I'd rule out a lot his weaker hands but 88 beats a lot of pairs. This added with the fact you would not expect him to shove the top of his range (JJ+ Ak) makes it an easy call!

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Originally posted by Laois Hammer View Post
                                No way hes shoving that range for this many bigs that needs adjusting, Playing atm so cant really have decent input.

                                It is a call but when 66 is probably a fold he does have a point about it being marginal
                                Yeah, I see the size of his stack now.

                                This range makes it a 50/50 and therefore a call with the blinds and antes

                                55+, A9s+, A5s, KJs+, QJs, ATo+, KJo+
                                One of these days I am either going to quit poker or learn how to play the damn game

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  just to close this thread tks for all the input, marginal call seems the verdict

                                  I called and he had the very top of his open shoving range pocket 10s

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