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    Line checks/ opinions needed

    Hi,

    Hope I get details right cos hand has been wrecking my head a bit! Main event of Northern Open on Saturday - day 2. Blinds 400/800, I have approx 30k. I doubled up approx 20 mins before and before that I was in ABC shove/fold mode due to stack sizes. Hand played as follows:

    - Villain opens to 2.5k from seat 3. Played with him previous weekend and thought he was v capable. He has been pretty quiet so far but has a stack of approx 60k.
    - I have KK in the big blind and repop to 6k. Villain calls
    - Flop comes 10 A A rainbow, I'm first to act and elect to check (Opinions on that please)
    - Villian bets 6k and I call. (Opinions on that please)
    - Turn was a complete blank (can't remember exactly) and I elect to check again (Opinions on that please). Villain vets 8.5k. What's my line?

    My opinion at the time was pretty polarised. I thought he had a big ace/pocket tens or was on a bluff.

    Constructive opinions welcome

    #2
    His raise is on the large side is that normal for him? 3bet bigger pre anyway.

    Think you have to cbet too as you'll be cbetting all your AK and AQ type hands.

    If you called the flop you have to call turn imo

    Comment


      #3
      Hi Mark,

      I'm 90% sure that the flop went c/c and that he lead for 6.5k on the turn after you checked. I was interested in the hand myself because as soon as he bet 6.5k after you checked, i was wondering what hands he'd do this with because it was a pretty big bet. Villain posts here aswel

      Edit - Did Matt not make it 1900 and you made it 4500?
      Last edited by Flushdraw; 20-06-11, 17:37.

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by markc View Post
        Hi,

        Hope I get details right cos hand has been wrecking my head a bit! Main event of Northern Open on Saturday - day 2. Blinds 400/800, I have approx 30k. I doubled up approx 20 mins before and before that I was in ABC shove/fold mode due to stack sizes. Hand played as follows:

        - Villain opens to 2.5k from seat 3. Played with him previous weekend and thought he was v capable. He has been pretty quiet so far but has a stack of approx 60k.
        - I have KK in the big blind and repop to 6k. Villain calls
        - Flop comes 10 A A rainbow, I'm first to act and elect to check (Opinions on that please)
        - Villian bets 6k and I call. (Opinions on that please)
        - Turn was a complete blank (can't remember exactly) and I elect to check again (Opinions on that please). Villain vets 8.5k. What's my line?

        My opinion at the time was pretty polarised. I thought he had a big ace/pocket tens or was on a bluff.

        Constructive opinions welcome


        I think 3-bet sizing is totally fine. We want to give him as much room as possible to go ahead and four bet. We are OOP, but we have a monster, 3-bet small to hopefully induce.

        I don't hate a check and call one street or maybe even two if you feel he's capable of bluffing at a board like this. Do you think he flats 3-bets in position wide? I also don't hate a c-bet of around 6.5k. I don't really see the need of going any bigger and it gets the job done.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Flushdraw View Post
          Hi Mark,

          I'm 90% sure that the flop went c/c and that he lead for 6.5k on the turn after you checked. I was interested in the hand myself because as soon as he bet 6.5k after you checked, i was wondering what hands he'd do this with because it was a pretty big bet. Villain posts here aswel

          Edit - Did Matt not make it 1900 and you made it 4500?
          Not 100% sure tbh - if Matt comes on maybe he can clear it up. He deffo raised pre and I 3bet.(His final bet was deffo 8.5k cos I counted it out to see what I had behind..

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by markc View Post
            Not 100% sure tbh - if Matt comes on maybe he can clear it up. He deffo raised pre and I 3bet.(His final bet was deffo 8.5k cos I counted it out to see what I had behind..
            Yep he defo bet 6.5k and 8.5k, but i was sure the 6.5k was into a ~10k pot

            I think the flop was checked, you c/c on a 4 turn and then he bet 8.5k on a 6 river when you checked

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Flushdraw View Post
              Yep he defo bet 6.5k and 8.5k, but i was sure the 6.5k was into a ~10k pot

              I think the flop was checked, you c/c on a 4 turn and then he bet 8.5k on a 6 river when you checked
              That could be right. As said earlier I 3 bet small enough to induce. Check check on the flop. Check call 6.5k on the turn (cos I definitely called a post flop bet) and then I checked the river which was when he fired the 8.5k... Not 100% sure..

              Jeez - I need to get better at remembering these. I deffo remember agonizing over the 8.5k. Obv I am worried about a big ace and I am worried about pocket 10's. In some ways I thought my check on the flop was fine cos I could well have a big ace and could be slowplaying. The check call also looks pretty strong I think - esp cos I called that bet pretty quick. If I have a good ace there not sure I would have raised, I may have waited to the river or even given him another chance to fire at it. When he fired the second barrel though I had a really tough decision. If I call and lose I am down to 10BB ish. Fold and I have 20BB ish. If I jam at any point I could well be drawing dead to AT or very thin to TT/AK/AQ/AJ. One of those spots where u are either a mile ahead or behind. Will post the result later for others - you know it already!

              p.s. good to meet u at the event..

              Comment


                #8
                i prefer a larger 3 bet pre tbh although i understand your reasons for keeping it small, i just find that people are in general pretty bad at folding with money in the pot and i can see most players calling here when you make it 7.5k instead of 6k

                if the flop went chk chk and then he gets aggro on turn and river i think you have to fold.....if he fires at flop and turn im calling both streets against randoms although all this is very player/image dependant, so if he thinks he can take you off hands im letting him fire all way a lot of time

                Comment


                  #9
                  It was an interesting hand alright. Matt doesn't normally poke his head in this way so not sure if he will see it. Didn't know that was you at all until Damo introduced us late on. Good meeting you too mate

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by mddgfc View Post
                    i prefer a larger 3 bet pre tbh although i understand your reasons for keeping it small, i just find that people are in general pretty bad at folding with money in the pot and i can see most players calling here when you make it 7.5k instead of 6k

                    if the flop went chk chk and then he gets aggro on turn and river i think you have to fold.....if he fires at flop and turn im calling both streets against randoms although all this is very player/image dependant, so if he thinks he can take you off hands im letting him fire all way a lot of time
                    I decided to check call one barrel and I check folded to the second bet. As played I figured it was a coinflip as to whether he had TT/AX/AT in which case I was drawing very thin or maybe even dead. I had enough chips to fold and rebuild (which I did before losing a 70/30 later on) and even though I really wanted to call I found the fold which I think is the better option in this spot. Maybe I should have Cbet the flop and folded to any raise but I think it's a very marginal decision.

                    Matt played the hand very well imo. He had the stack and position in his favour and the stones to make the move. vwp sir - shame a king didn't hit the river!

                    Comment


                      #11
                      If player is likely to bluff give given a second chance then c/c on turn is fine, but I fold the river

                      Comment


                        #12
                        He doesn't have pocket tens imo, he surely bets bigger on the river than 8.5k from 6k on turn... It looks more like an uncertain ace or weird bluff! I don't no these ppl never played with em so hard to give advice other than my first line. It's an medium strength ace or a bluff.. So if u can decide wud he call 3bet with aj or worse suited aces then you can asses the river better for a call or not! I prob call fish
                        Huh, Math my dear boy is nothing more than the lesbian sister of biology.

                        My Poker Blog http://jason-tompkins.blogspot.com
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                        Comment


                          #13
                          Result

                          As played I folded on the second barrel leaving myself 20BB. It was a bluff as villain showed QJ. Don't really think I did anything wrong. Anyone good enough to fire 2 barrels in position with a big stack there is deffo good enough to raise a Cbet by me on the flop. Also think I am up against a decent ace there more often then not. Result aside I was happy enough with the fold. I rebuilt and got knocked out about an hour later when I got it all in pre with KK (again) against AQ. Villian raised pre, I repopped, he put me all in (big stack) and I snapped obv.. Ace on the flop

                          Thanks for feedback. More than anything I just think this was great play by Matt in position and a dominating stack...

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Hi Mark. I opened to 1900, ur 3 bet was 4.5k. My flat there was a bit spewy as I knew ur range oop was tight but my last 2 opens had been snapped off and I was probably a bit tilty.
                            After the flop went cc and u checked the turn, I decided to stab and tbh ur insta-call told me u had a showdown hand but no A. I had to fire again to win the pot and was hoping that u were good enough to fold. I hate showing anything (especially bluffs) but kept my word after u asked to see if u folded.
                            It was great meeting u again and for the record, coming to find me after your knockout to buy me a pint and wish me well for the rest of the tournament showed what a gent u are. Hopefully we'll se u in Killarney in July for the Cue Club €200 summer game.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Lplate View Post
                              Hi Mark. I opened to 1900, ur 3 bet was 4.5k. My flat there was a bit spewy as I knew ur range oop was tight but my last 2 opens had been snapped off and I was probably a bit tilty.
                              After the flop went cc and u checked the turn, I decided to stab and tbh ur insta-call told me u had a showdown hand but no A. I had to fire again to win the pot and was hoping that u were good enough to fold. I hate showing anything (especially bluffs) but kept my word after u asked to see if u folded.
                              It was great meeting u again and for the record, coming to find me after your knockout to buy me a pint and wish me well for the rest of the tournament showed what a gent u are. Hopefully we'll se u in Killarney in July for the Cue Club €200 summer game.
                              Cheers Matt- thanks for that and thanks for showing. If I had a bigger stack I would have called. I knew u were capable of making that move and I was so close to calling. Am happy with the fold tho cos it is a spot where I tend to overvalue big pairs and I've been trying not to call off or go broke too much in those spots. A few weeks ago I would have deffo shipped the loot in!

                              As for the drink it was just a down-payment for the lesson! I have the Cue Club game in the diary so definitely hope to catch up with you there..

                              UL again on your own exit - that was a sick beat..

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